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Old 09-02-2019, 08:54 AM   #295
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The Miata doesn’t sit on primacies. I’ve yet to see a proper instrumented test of the TS, but I bet that with the same tires they would be dead nuts in the 0-60 and quarter. In the quarter the brz will make up for the slight difference in power/weight (5%) with better aero (.27 vs .35 Cd, 30%)
What the tS? Nah, it is even heavier. If I recall correctly, it was around 2842 lbs.

They would have to make the new car lighter, but this means going into a more expensive materials territory. The other option which is easier is to increase a bit the displacement.
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Old 09-02-2019, 09:07 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by nikitopo View Post
What the tS? Nah, it is even heavier. If I recall correctly, it was around 2842 lbs.

They would have to make the new car lighter, but this means going into a more expensive materials territory. The other option which is easier is to increase a bit the displacement.


I didn’t mean to say the Ts specifically, I meant the fact that it sits on pilot sport 4s

I want to see a limited BRZ vs a Miata Club 0-60 and quarter mile, both on the same tire, same driver
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Old 09-02-2019, 09:39 AM   #297
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Sarcasm?

Unless I'm missing something that wasn't advertised.
not sarcasm at all.
https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107635
links no longer work, but i save everything.

honestly, not much was actually advertised, but those that seek can find.
it's not a clean sheet design, just an update throughout the block.
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Old 09-02-2019, 10:10 AM   #298
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What the tS? Nah, it is even heavier. If I recall correctly, it was around 2842 lbs.

They would have to make the new car lighter, but this means going into a more expensive materials territory. The other option which is easier is to increase a bit the displacement.
Yep. With all these they “could” theories people are leaving out some critical factors. Price is one of the biggest. There are several ways to make it lighter but it still has to have the features that people now expect and meat all the crash standards. This will not happen for free. I doubt there would be many takers for a $40k Twin.
Anther which has been mentioned is mileage and emissions. They couldn’t even give the European version the modest 5hp bump. Where do people think they can do a 50hp one?
As. Has been said often any next gen will be very similar to what we have now or so different it will be a Twin in name only. What we will not see is a high horse power similarly price upgrade of the current gen.
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Old 09-02-2019, 11:27 AM   #299
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Another very real and telling sign is the fact Toyota had to partner with Subaru (totally ok with that) for the 86, and with BMW (yuck) for the Supra. They know there is very little profit in a classic sports car. But those like Tada-san are passionate about that type of car, so he will work with just about anything he is given the green light on. It’s why we even have the twins in the first place. Would Subaru ever thought of developing this car on their own?! LOL

Here is exactly what I would love to see, and I’m in true dream mode now. Haha If for the 2nd gen 86/BRZ Toyota and Subaru could choose to put different engines in their respective cars. Subaru could use a new version of their FA20, maybe even with a small turbo. Toyota could use something like the MA20, add in some Yamaha tuning magic and create a little high revving monster. I know it will never happen, both cars are built in the same place. Like I said, it’s a dream. lol

Or, they truly get rid of the torque dip, sacrifice some MPG, lose some weight without getting into exotic materials (more aluminum could work). That’s more realistic. Haha




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Old 09-02-2019, 11:29 AM   #300
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More confirmation from Toyota on next gen 86

Subaru E-Boxer; small electric motor mounted in the transmission, with a small battery pack in the trunk:

Electric motor output:
Power: 13.4 hp (14 PS; 10 kW)
Torque: 48.0 lb⋅ft (65 N⋅m; 7 kg⋅m)

Sounds perfect. But it adds 110kg to the forester , the 86 can probably get away with a much smaller battery and weaker motor controller though.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_FB_engine
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Old 09-02-2019, 11:52 AM   #301
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In Subaru land, sports car = turbo.
No it doesn't. The XT had non-turbo options, and the SVX was only non-turbo.

Impreza/WRX/Sexually Transmitted Infection doesn't count because those are not sports cars.
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Old 09-02-2019, 01:37 PM   #302
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No it doesn't. The XT had non-turbo options, and the SVX was only non-turbo.

Impreza/WRX/Sexually Transmitted Infection doesn't count because those are not sports cars.
nissan would like a word with you



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Old 09-02-2019, 01:45 PM   #303
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No it doesn't. The XT had non-turbo options, and the SVX was only non-turbo.



Impreza/WRX/Sexually Transmitted Infection doesn't count because those are not sports cars.


I have to disagree about the WRX and STI (funny name though LOL) They may not be pure sports cars, but the STI is serious business when it comes to performance. I think you are splitting hairs. Traditionally Subaru uses a turbo application on “performance” models or whatever you want to call them. Non turbo sporty Subaru’s are not much fun.


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Old 09-02-2019, 01:46 PM   #304
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nissan would like a word with you









Heehee I’ve always been a fan of the Maxima, I don’t care what anyone says. Come at me bro!


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Old 09-02-2019, 02:22 PM   #305
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I have to disagree about the WRX and STI (funny name though LOL) They may not be pure sports cars, but the STI is serious business when it comes to performance. I think you are splitting hairs. Traditionally Subaru uses a turbo application on “performance” models or whatever you want to call them. Non turbo sporty Subaru’s are not much fun.


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Performance cars are not all sports cars and not all sports cars are performance cars. They is a huge difference between a sports car and a sporty car. I still have a hard time calling the Twins a sports car since by the old terminology it would have been a GT car since it has a rear seat. Accepting a four door as one is right out of the question. Look up the old school definition of sports car and convince me a 4 door is even close.
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Old 09-02-2019, 03:58 PM   #306
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I have to disagree about the WRX and STI (funny name though LOL) They may not be pure sports cars, but the STI is serious business when it comes to performance.
They are Imprezas. Imprezas are not sports cars by any stretch of the imagination. Slapping a turbo and some suspension parts on an econobox doesn't magically transform it into a sports car.
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Old 09-02-2019, 03:59 PM   #307
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Performance cars are not all sports cars and not all sports cars are performance cars. They is a huge difference between a sports car and a sporty car. I still have a hard time calling the Twins a sports car since by the old terminology it would have been a GT car since it has a rear seat. Accepting a four door as one is right out of the question. Look up the old school definition of sports car and convince me a 4 door is even close.
I agree on the GT distinction but I've always had a hard time thinking of cars like the 944 or 911 as GT's rather than sports cars too even though they have a pseudo back seat. With our cars I just have a hard time thinking of them as anything but a lightweight and marginally underpowered sports car in a very classic sense. The back seat is a thing that keeps the insurance more reasonable so I'm ok with it. When I think modern GT's I think of the Challenger with the V6, BMW 6 series (2 doors), MB coupes and the Audi A5/S5. It's something about the size and more pleasant aspect to them over a loud(er), rough(er) riding tossable little machine. The WRX certainly doesn't qualify but if you have to have 4 doors it takes care of itself pretty well and like several others is a sports sedan. What really bugs me is things like the BMW X6 being called a coupe.
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Old 09-02-2019, 04:52 PM   #308
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I agree on the GT distinction but I've always had a hard time thinking of cars like the 944 or 911 as GT's rather than sports cars too even though they have a pseudo back seat. With our cars I just have a hard time thinking of them as anything but a lightweight and marginally underpowered sports car in a very classic sense. The back seat is a thing that keeps the insurance more reasonable so I'm ok with it. When I think modern GT's I think of the Challenger with the V6, BMW 6 series (2 doors), MB coupes and the Audi A5/S5. It's something about the size and more pleasant aspect to them over a loud(er), rough(er) riding tossable little machine. The WRX certainly doesn't qualify but if you have to have 4 doors it takes care of itself pretty well and like several others is a sports sedan. What really bugs me is things like the BMW X6 being called a coupe.
The line has blurred considerably in the last 20 years. I was very careful to point out that my opinion of sports cars is a very old definition. The sports car crowd of any era up until the late 80s would have laughed at you if you showed up in an 86 and said "I am one of you".
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