BRZ/FR-S vs e46 M3

[daiheadjai]

Great reality check. I lusted over the E46M3 for a long time and this helps me put some perspective to it

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[darthpnoy1984]

I once lusted for a E36 by golly there prices are actually climbing higher and higher even for the high miles beat up ones. I can just imagine for the well care E36 M3, especially for that God like status hype the E30 m3 gets its crazy how much people want for these cars. So glad the Twins came along.

Originally Posted by exE36M3

JGalp:
I hear you. One of THE only reasons why I am not driving a GTS Viper, Vette or Rx-7 is that the I need a backseat for the kids. Mine are 10 and 15. So I *need* to get them in the car in a pinch. The E36 was my family car for when the kids were babies (Recaro baby seats and all!). I had a 1996 and 1995. Both were coupes, but big enough back seats for adults.

But here's the plain truth about BMWs from me, a BMW Car Club of America member of 16+ years (and former editor of the local club magazine). Don't buy any BMW past 2000 unless you can part with at least a $5k-$8k repair bill at any moment. For some reason, BMW's past 2000 (all models) just became a major PIA to maintain or trust. On their performance cars it was the turbos and fuel pumps. On their luxury cars it's the electronics going haywire. My friend bought a 2013 used 335is. He *loved* that thing and it was fast a hell. 6 months into ownership, it start smoking... bad. It wasn't the turbo or fuel pump - lucky him. It was a bad valve seal. Whee. A $2k-$3k job. My other friend, bought a brand new 2000 M5. In 2002 the car starts running funny. By 2003, motor blown. Why, oil passages self-clogged. Warranty? Nope. BMW said it was his fault. So cost of new motor? $20k.

As a BMW club member, I get the full gamut of stories. Most of the club guys I hang out with are racers and BMW techs. So when I personally retired my E36 M3 after 237k miles. I went looking at a 2010 135is, 2014 M235is, 2010 EVO 10, 2014 Subaru Sti, 2002 E46 M3, and a used 2013 BRZ.

Like you the main criteria was sports car and back seat. Here's how it went...

BMW 135is M-Sport - loved it. Fast. BUT no LSD (add in about $4k) and the extended warranty was $2.5k. So I needed to add $6.5K to have the car I wanted.

BMW M235is - Ok, I *really* liked this car. Smooth, fast, cushy. But at $42k... I really want my kid to go to college.( I'm in my 40s so there's a few things demanding my financial attention these days.)

EVO 10 - loved that. But no service support where I am. That can be ugly.

WRX Sti - fast car, but handling was... ok. Which surprised me. But great family hauler.

E46 M3 - $20k for a car 15 years old and with over 100k miles. It just didn't make any sense to me.

BRZ - Japanese build quality, simple, and I had a blast doing the test drive.

If someone were to ask me what BMW to buy I'd say get a 4-door E36 M3 1997-1999. They are all under $10k. Parts are pretty cheap and the cars are really easy to work on. If you *really* want a new BMW, I agree with the lease deal. For the price of a used car, you can get the best of the BMW experience without the long-term headaches of ownership. If you are looking at any other model, say a used one - STRONGLY consider an extended warranty - which is at least 10% of the price of the car.

So back to the E46 M3... my 2-cents... It's just going to be one big maintenance nightmare unless you find a guy who did ALL work and documented it. That's about the only way I can see anyone buying a $20k used car that is 15+ years old.

For my E46 brothers - I'm not saying it's a bad car, but it's a car still - and any car 15+ years old is going to need some attention.

[exE36M3]

As much as I *like* the E30 M3 - you REALLY got to have some money socked away to keep it going. The parts are crazy expensive. Of the entire M3 line - the E36 with it's shared components across the 325/328 line and some 320, I've never owned a car so cheap to maintain... I think the 90s Civic was just barely less expensive.

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by exE36M3

As much as I *like* the E30 M3 - you REALLY got to have some money socked away to keep it going. The parts are crazy expensive. Of the entire M3 line - the E36 with it's shared components across the 325/328 line and some 320, I've never owned a car so cheap to maintain... I think the 90s Civic was just barely less expensive.

Well I think things like body panels etc are expensive (or at least they used to be), but regular maintenance is quite decent on these. A lot of it has to do with the E36 M3 being a factory tuner 328i. The motor isn't some specialized design like the E30 M3, E28/E34 M5, E46 M3, etc. This, the thing a lot of people complain about with the E36 M3, is why I love it most. BMW took a great platform, and just uber tweaked it to make it something very special.

[darthpnoy1984]

Originally Posted by bfrank1972

Well I think things like body panels etc are expensive (or at least they used to be), but regular maintenance is quite decent on these. A lot of it has to do with the E36 M3 being a factory tuner 328i. The motor isn't some specialized design like the E30 M3, E28/E34 M5, E46 M3, etc. This, the thing a lot of people complain about with the E36 M3, is why I love it most. BMW took a great platform, and just uber tweaked it to make it something very special.

And there fast becoming harder and harder to find with well cared for ones fetching money, only a matter of time the E36 M3 will be sought after especially the Dakar Yellow with Vader Seats 😍.

[gtengr]

I owned two E46 M3's for a total of about 10 years/80k miles. It was a fun experience for me as I didn't have to make any major repairs. The M3 has good steering feel, a good amount of interior space, decent curb weight, decent power, and a hell of an engine. It doesn't really excel at any one thing though (except the engine), and to me its best attribute is that it's pretty good at nearly everything. The main reason for getting rid of my last E46 was to try something new.

I picked up a 2017 BRZ a few days ago and the only thing I miss so far is the amount of interior space and the horsepower. I bought the car with plans to up the horsepower, and I think the msrp reflects the lack of forced induction, so no big deal imo. That said, the torque dip is very disappointing given the already low 205 hp peak. The interior space was a sacrifice I made and something I can live with since I don't have kids. Time will tell if it will be an issue for me, but so far I don't mind. The transmission is much smoother than the M3 and it's nice that I won't have to bother with an SSK. Ride quality feels close to the same and maybe a tad more comfortable in the BRZ, it's hard to say at this point. I can feel the BRZ has a much lower center of gravity and will probably more fun on the track.