Do you currently have a Kraftwerks Supercharger installed? I have a few questions

[D K]

Originally Posted by SkAsphalt

Let's be really honest here, if you are upgrading that much, are you not also cross shopping turbos? (Saying it before turbo guys come in here)

Exactly my point.

Whats the use of being able to just swap a new charger and go?

The whole system needs to be upgraded.

D

[gmsii]

Originally Posted by D K

Lets be honest about upgradeability here.

If you were going to upgrade, would you really just upgrade the charger?

Or would you consider bigger piping and maybe even a bigger intercooler?
As in 70% of your kit...

the simplest upgrade is a high boost pulley if you opt for the the basic C30-94...its adds about 30whp and 3lbs of boost. at some point down the road a C38 can be purchased and installed with no major changes to the kit.

some people are now opting to order the kit with a C38 from the get go. This option is a bit more expensive but it comes with the bigger blower, and different silicone adapters. Fuel pump and injectors will also be required and there is currently no canned tune option. The C38 also has a low and high boost pulley available

The other point is the only thing thats keeping the JR kit form being 'upgradeable' is the mounting bracket.
The bracket is relatively inxpensive.

And, I wouldnt be surprised if future brackets may have some adjustability

the problem isnt making the bracket. the problem is the location of their charger and their idler pulleys. from our summary evaluation there is not sufficient belt wrap to be able to use a smaller high boost pulley. To get enough belt wrap, the idler pulleys would have to move up or the charger would have to move down. Trying to accomplish this would be much more of an undertaking than just making a new bracket. Their choice of supercharger placement is surrounded by interferences which include the intake tube to the TB, the engine below, etc) hence limiting the amount of space they can have to adjust. Trying to use the big C38 blower in that location would be an even greater undertaking because the C38 blower needs to be mounted higher as it is about an inch taller thus requiring the TB tube to hump up even higher to where it will begin interfering with the hood. Furthermore, it is our assessment that even if a C38 blower did fit in that location, being that the belt is only 6-rib it would not have enough belt width or wrap to turn the blower without significant slippage.

as a side note: vortech also chose to use this location, but we feel like they did a much better job with the layout and the location of their idler pulleys to make sure they got sufficient belt wrap. maybe JR can take cues off of vortechs layout. we wish them best of luck in cracking this nut

[liewyel]

If this test actually occurs, I'll happily base my end of year supercharger purchase on the results!

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

My agenda is to post quantified data. I'm sorry that you don't like that, we'll have to agree to disagree.

Yes, my bias is toward the JR kit. It works, and it works well. I like things that work. I was offered an opportunity to test the kit (as well as Vortech and Inoovate), and it performed exactly as advertised.



I understand that you lack confidence in my driving ability. That's okay! I don't mind letting a hotshoe we can agree on beat on our cars.



Done. All you need to do is show up to the next 86 CUP.

July 26th (not the 27th mentioned above) at Streets of Willow. If that doesn't work for you August 30 at Buttonwillow is also available.

Greddy, Vortech, and Jackson Racing cars will be available.

Please PM me your registration info.
- Car owner's Name
- Address
- Email
- Phone number
- Driver's name

*edit*
Would Emilio Cervantes work for you as a backup driver candidate? We'd need to fly Billy out from Florida to make this happen...

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by gmsii

what are you talking about?...u arrange the cars, we'll arrange a driver

I had assumed that you would want your shop BRZ to be the Kraftwerks Supercharger representative? Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Originally Posted by gmsii

haha...are you serious bro? swap out one JR monkey for another JR monkey?...let me give paul frank a call

Multiple record holder, T25 champion, PTE/PTD/PTC/PTB/PTA winner not qualified for this test?

Really, if you don't mind paying for Billy's flight out from Florida, that's fine by me, but we need to agree on the driver. I'm just throwing some options out. I'm fine with both Billy and Craig.


Please select the date, and I'll make the track arrangements.

[D K]

Originally Posted by gmsii

from our summary evaluation there is not sufficient belt wrap to be able to use a smaller high boost pulley. To get enough belt wrap, the idler pulleys would have to move up or the charger would have to move down.

Furthermore, it is our assessment that even if a C38 blower did fit in that location, being that the belt is only 6-rib it would not have enough belt width or wrap to turn the blower without significant slippage.

I dont want to drag this any further.

I dont care who believes me or not....


Both of the above statements are false.

[gmsii]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

I had assumed that you would want your shop BRZ to be the Kraftwerks Supercharger representative? Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

car is being used for CARB testing....currently for the C30, then slated for the C38....after that the car would be available

out of curiousity...is the CSG 86 car running again? sincere question, not implying anything. maybe we can prep both cars so they have similar set-ups

also, i peeped into your other thread....i hope you are not trying to represent that the KW kit has belt issues because it doesnt...such implications would border on libel

anyways...perhaps the best way to iron out the past is to settle this on the track in the near future with two cars of similar setup

[D K]

I think there is only one real way to settle this...


We'll have a JR/KW shootout.

Owners drive their cars on the same track, same day.

We'll get as many cars from both sides and have a nice friendly competition.


Loser pays for the strippers.

D

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by gmsii

car is being used for CARB testing....currently for the C30, then slated for the C38....after that the car would be available

out of curiousity...is the CSG 86 car running again? sincere question, not implying anything. maybe we can prep both cars so they have similar set-ups

also, i peeped into your other thread....i hope you are not trying to represent that the KW kit has belt issues because it doesnt...such implications would border on libel

anyways...perhaps the best way to iron out the past is to settle this on the track in the near future with two cars of similar setup

Yes, our 2014 hasn't had any major downtime. If you're referring to our 2013 that was wrecked by a guest driver, or the OEM ECU issues, that's a different story.

We'll be more than happy to set our car up similar to yours, but the relevant data would be heat related.

As for Libel, I do recall you admitting yourself that you had belt issues at that event. Please correct me if my memory is mistaken.

Do you have an ETA for when the car will be available?

[OICU812]

Originally Posted by SkAsphalt

Let's be really honest here, if you are upgrading that much, are you not also cross shopping turbos? (Saying it before turbo guys come in here)

Yes honestly if I had SC and determined I need Moar...yes 100% I'd be shopping turbos.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by CSG David

We gutted the cat without physically gutting it on a complete factory car. Beat that.

Um, what?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Calum

Um, what?

We melted the stock cat is what he's saying (with a NA engine).

[Calum]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

We melted the stock cat is what he's saying (with a NA engine).

Understood.

[Cheeseballs]

Originally Posted by gmsii

also, i peeped into your other thread....i hope you are not trying to represent that the KW kit has belt issues because it doesnt...such implications would border on libel

Pot meet kettle.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67711

[Sellout]

Originally Posted by Decay107

I'm sorry, I mean absolutely no disrespect here but do people really give a shit about upgradability in superchargers? That appears to be outside of the ethos of most supercharger kits which I believe to be a balanced trackable package that delivers the performance some feel has been lacking from the showroom stock car.

Yes, people really do give a shit about upgradability in supercharger kits. There are enough people who want to be able to upgrade that when Vortech sold a kit a few years back that was maxed from the beginning, it was a dismal failure compared to their other systems. The vast majority of buyers want to be able to upgrade, even if they never actually get there. I believe Brian from Vortech went over this a while back in the old Vortech Q/A thread.

Originally Posted by SkAsphalt

Let's be really honest here, if you are upgrading that much, are you not also cross shopping turbos? (Saying it before turbo guys come in here)

Not so much if you want to pass emissions in California...

Originally Posted by D K

Lets be honest about upgradeability here.

If you were going to upgrade, would you really just upgrade the charger?

Or would you consider bigger piping...

I had to laugh at this. I know it wasn't you, but in this exact thread the bigger piping in the KW kit has been dismissed as unnecessary.