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Forced Induction Turbo, Supercharger, Methanol, Nitrous


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Old 07-24-2013, 01:07 PM   #15
Dezoris
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I want to make this clear, that the Autocrossing segment is just apart of the series of videos of what I did with the stock car. Wanted to show how supercharging effected the drivability before and after.

It's more fun, but the point was this is one form of motorsports where you are not rewarded for outright speed. The stock FR-S/BRZ with stock allowed mods of tires, front sway bar is almost perfect here.

Most people who do major mods skip autocross completely and go right to the track. I put more value on autocross than most.


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Originally Posted by jflogerzi View Post
I think most ppl know a SC or Turbo is not the answer for auto crossing. While your video was good, the information you provide is a pretty known fact. You want to get good at autocross and small short tracks, you want tires, suspension and lots of seat time, plain and simple.
Yes I agree, that what I was trying to highlight. Forced induction does not transform this car here.



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Originally Posted by s2d4 View Post
I honestly think you went with the wrong FI for your application.

It has nothing on NA with tune until after 4000rpm.
Absolutely no comparison to twinscrew from 600 until 5800rpm (5200rpm total range, where you will be at +90% of the time), and not much either for the last 1600rpm.
It gets obliterated by avo from 2000rpm (not going spend much time under that for any spirited driving) up to 7400 rpm, total of 5400rpm.... The whole violent boost buildup is overplayed on this setup too due to the turbo size and location, not exactly high boost level either.

Area under the graph is everything.
This video was originally like 15 minutes because I went on in commentary about how different forms of FI would net the same result. But cut it down because it was long winded.

The point was that no matter what kit you put on, the car was grip limited by pavement, and suspension/tire setup more power in the low end would have upset the rear in sections where you were already fighting for grip.

In terms of every video I have seen from every FI kit under 230HP the difference in outright acceleration through 1st and 2nd gear are within a 1/2 second. It's just not going to matter in autox in a very measurable way until you start unloading big money on suspension/chassis changes.
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Old 07-24-2013, 01:13 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by nonicname View Post
This dude has never had anything good to say about the car. That whole "I'm depressed" attitude is pretty pathetic. even from that video you can see bad driving. how about you give the fully stock car to a good driver and then you give the SC frs to the same driver and measure the change.

First mistake was paying over $5k for a fan with a pulley. I would've gotten the twin screw for a lot less with better results.
What gym do you work at to build your troll legs?
I think it's clear you need a new trainer because your technique is all wrong.

  • What intercooled twin screw supercharger would you have bought?
  • Maybe you can come give me some driving lessons, and hold my hand?
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Old 07-24-2013, 01:19 PM   #17
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Thanks for feedback!

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Originally Posted by ultra View Post
Excellent review as usual. Might not be completely scientific on a geek level but certainly illustrative, balanced and straightforward.

I think some folks in here are ignoring (or are completely ignorant of) the context of this particular review, which is AutoX competitiveness and effectiveness.

In a competitive autocross context it's no surprise at all that FI is a terrible idea for this car given the classification system. Going FI on a Toyobaru puts you straight into SM which is where the highly-to-extremely modified Evos, STis and M3s live on massive DOT slicks. Might be possible to build a competive SM Toyobaru in theory but it'd have to be a pretty extreme and creative build. Realistically there's a 99% chance you will just get your ass handed to you each and every time and that's that.

Breaking out of classification issues it's interestitng but not completely surprising to hear that there's not much of a competitive advantage to be had from going FI. I'd theorize that given a well set up car and an adept driver there would be at least a marginal (few tenths worth of a) performance advantage depending on the course layout. I'd concede that in reality (assuming a well set up chassis) getting tenths in Autocross is more about the driving though.

Pretty sure that things will be more pronounced on the track.

Great, thought provoking review again though. Thanks for that!
I think you summed it up better than I could.

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Originally Posted by DJCarbine View Post
No surprises here

You pointed out that the top driver in STX with the BRZ has tires and an alignment... I think that those are pretty much the best bang for buck mod you can do for autocross
People asked me at the autox how do you like the kit and would I do it again. And they were shocked when I told them, if I did it all over again I would have left it stock.

For autox as you said simple is your best bang for your buck. I know you came from other fast cars too.

But the same shit was happening in autox when the S2000 came out.
It was all driver with minor mods. This car is almost identical in that regard.

It's not like an STI or WRX where those cars are pigs out of the gate, or GTIs or Mazdspeed 3s.
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Old 07-24-2013, 01:44 PM   #18
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@Dezoris get a plane ticket to DC and bring your camera, more than happy to loan my car out for some impressions/driving comparisons. Keep up the good work. There's no one else doing this quality of a review with our platform. Yeah so you are nit picky but blunt and honest about it. There are a lot of fan boys on here. I'm very happy with my set-up but it's not for everyone. I wish I could produce something as quality but I'm not as creative and have no video editing skills.
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Old 07-24-2013, 02:19 PM   #19
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I'm glad these posts are the way they are... honest. If an issue shows up he talks about it. I think he does a much better job of actually documenting the highs and lows of car modification than most.

I think a lot of guys are hesitant to talk about anything that gave them trouble because they feel like admitting something is difficult threatens their machismo some how. Modding any vehicle is not sunshine and rainbows, there is always a WTF moment or three.

At the same time he obviously has fun with the car and as he said himself it is more fun with the SC. Isn't that really the goal here? I mean if you are spending the money just for numbers I guess that's your thing, I spend it to have a great time. I doubt he'd make the videos if he wasn't enjoying himself.

I enjoy watching the videos (they are pretty entertaining) and I'm appreciative of the information too. Thanks Dezoris.
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Old 07-24-2013, 04:18 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezoris View Post
People asked me at the autox how do you like the kit and would I do it again. And they were shocked when I told them, if I did it all over again I would have left it stock.

For autox as you said simple is your best bang for your buck. I know you came from other fast cars too.

But the same shit was happening in autox when the S2000 came out.
It was all driver with minor mods. This car is almost identical in that regard.
Completely agree.
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