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Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting What these cars were built for!


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Old 02-12-2020, 06:29 PM   #15
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Stock front, 17+ rear.
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Old 02-12-2020, 10:42 PM   #16
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Stock front, 17+ rear.

2017+ stock rear, or 17mm+ rear? Just to clarify...
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Old 02-13-2020, 12:47 PM   #17
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Interesting note - the guys testing the Xida coilovers with 949 racing were setting N/A track records last year in NorCal and SoCal on a 22mm front sway bar with OEM rears (14mm).
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Old 02-13-2020, 01:16 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prandelia View Post
The more spring you have, the less bar you need. Auto-x'ers and casual track tend to be softly sprung and use more bar, race cars are a lot stiffer and need less bar.

I'm on 700/900# springs, and only need a 20mm front, 16mm rear bar setup. Works perfect, same size as TMG racing cars in Germany.
Not trying to start a campfire here, just wanted to point out that I though this was exactly how it works. Yet my experience with my own car was that the setup improved with stiffer bars (similar ratio increase to OEM, around 200% stiffer front and rear), for a car on 12k springs.

So a big "it depends" on this, or anything related suspension setup for that matter.
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Old 02-13-2020, 03:07 PM   #19
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With my coilovers and tyres, and alignment settings, stock are going well.
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Old 02-13-2020, 05:47 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Icecreamtruk View Post
Not trying to start a campfire here, just wanted to point out that I though this was exactly how it works. Yet my experience with my own car was that the setup improved with stiffer bars (similar ratio increase to OEM, around 200% stiffer front and rear), for a car on 12k springs.

So a big "it depends" on this, or anything related suspension setup for that matter.
I agree, I'm speaking in generalities. That's also why swaybars have adjustable holes to allow handling preference. FYI - a 20mm front swaybar with 2 holes provides around 120% and 175% stiffness increase over stock, so my setup is pretty much the same, not even accounting for shock settings and alignment.

Another big variable is tires and weight. At my weight (2390# no fuel), I can only race on 225 wide hoosiers, so others may squeeze a lot more tire, or be heavier, thus allowing for bigger bars.

But in general, once you get to "real" race car spring rates, you don't need as much bar as say, an auto-x-er who wants a 25mm front to keep the strut from moving.....All good, I'm happy to see somebody else who has some real spring rate under the car, it needs it!
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Old 02-13-2020, 07:37 PM   #21
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This is like asking what tire pressures are best.
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Old 02-13-2020, 07:37 PM   #22
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Quote:
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2017+ stock rear, or 17mm+ rear? Just to clarify...
2017+ OEM rear, which is 16mm
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Old 02-13-2020, 07:38 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doodoobrown View Post
Interesting note - the guys testing the Xida coilovers with 949 racing were setting N/A track records last year in NorCal and SoCal on a 22mm front sway bar with OEM rears (14mm).
Also of interest, is that the 949 Racing FRS is more extensively prepared than essentially any other 86 out there. With extensive modification, tuning/balance changes will also be altered.

The original question set by the OP says it best; many people drive faster when the car is set to their preference.

Don't forget that the sways are only one component of net wheel rate.
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Old 02-13-2020, 09:23 PM   #24
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I will say one thing. I wish Whiteline just welded a collar on the bar, the adjustable shaft collars that come with the sways are total garbage. I replaced them with a set of aluminum Rulands that actually work.
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Old 02-14-2020, 01:52 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TommyW View Post
This is like asking what tire pressures are best.
34 psi of courze, unless your on a courze, and dependant on tyres, oh and track temp, and whether it's raining, or your just Hwy driving looking for fuel economy, or at the drags.

And the string is exactly 2000mm long, dry.
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Old 02-14-2020, 03:20 AM   #26
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And the string is exactly 2000mm long, dry.
You don't see the irony there? You're rounding up from 1999.87 mm
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Old 02-14-2020, 05:35 AM   #27
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You don't see the irony there? You're rounding up from 1999.87 mm
And I'm going to party like it's 1999.87

Edit: or 2187.084427
for the imperialist.

Not as catchy though.
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Old 02-14-2020, 08:54 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prandelia View Post
I agree, I'm speaking in generalities. That's also why swaybars have adjustable holes to allow handling preference. FYI - a 20mm front swaybar with 2 holes provides around 120% and 175% stiffness increase over stock, so my setup is pretty much the same, not even accounting for shock settings and alignment.

Another big variable is tires and weight. At my weight (2390# no fuel), I can only race on 225 wide hoosiers, so others may squeeze a lot more tire, or be heavier, thus allowing for bigger bars.

But in general, once you get to "real" race car spring rates, you don't need as much bar as say, an auto-x-er who wants a 25mm front to keep the strut from moving.....All good, I'm happy to see somebody else who has some real spring rate under the car, it needs it!

I mean...my strut moves



Adjustability allows going from that to dealing with damp conditions (If you look at the tires, we're actually loading the front properly here).



Final point - just make sure whatever you choose you have the tuning tools necessary to setup the car for whatever conditions you're going to be running in.
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