Scion fr-s soon to be a rare sought after car?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

Cars typically do not see an increase in value that exceeds inflation until they're about 50 years old, and then only when they have had more money sunk into them to bring them back to showroom quality than they're worth.

The exception is rare performance models, which we don't have. Look at the difference in prices between a Sunbeam Tiger and a Sunbeam Alpine, a TR4a vs. a TR250, a stock Cutlass vs. a 442, a 401-powered Cherokee Chief vs. a Wagoneer. In 40 years a Dodge Magnum SRT might be worth quite a bit of money, and the Hellcats most certainly will.

If they made a factory run of 1000 V8 powered FR-Ss as a special edition, that would be the one to hold as an investment, as long as you planned to keep it 40 or 50 years to see your return and also planned to spend a fortune to either keep it in new condition or restore it when the time comes. The special editions we've had so far are just cosmetic and won't make that much difference.

All so true. Add to that the fact that the collectable car market can be very fickle and dependent upon the nostalgia of older guys with disposable income and it gets even more unstable.
In the mid 90s the guys that wanted 60s Mustangs when they were young went on a buying spree. They were in such demand that even battered hulks were going for big bucks. To rake in this profits they were restored by the thousands. Only about 5 years later the guys that really wanted them had them and there were now so many on the market that the prices nose dived dramatically. Sure there are still some that are up there but like you said they are the low production specially editions and usually all original and hardly ever driven.
Restored or high mileage collectable cars will never hit high values no matter how well done unless they are something truely rare and special. The FRS no matter how popular will never ever be that rare or special.

[krayzie]

Hard to become a collectible when it was made to be affordable.

[Burrcold]

Lol

[Silver Cervy]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

Cars typically do not see an increase in value that exceeds inflation until they're about 50 years old, and then only when they have had more money sunk into them to bring them back to showroom quality than they're worth.

The exception is rare performance models, which we don't have. Look at the difference in prices between a Sunbeam Tiger and a Sunbeam Alpine, a TR4a vs. a TR250, a stock Cutlass vs. a 442, a 401-powered Cherokee Chief vs. a Wagoneer. In 40 years a Dodge Magnum SRT might be worth quite a bit of money, and the Hellcats most certainly will.

If they made a factory run of 1000 V8 powered FR-Ss as a special edition, that would be the one to hold as an investment, as long as you planned to keep it 40 or 50 years to see your return and also planned to spend a fortune to either keep it in new condition or restore it when the time comes. The special editions we've had so far are just cosmetic and won't make that much difference.

BMW 1M comes to mind. Had a V6 from the M3 and a turbo, cost around 45,000 at launch, then shot up to 80,000 in 5 years. The price has come down a lot recently though, and I guess that can be attributed to the new M2 being released.

[Packofcrows]

As rare as a 240sx.... but 5x's more produced.


p.s. as rare as a Miata haha

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Hard to become a collectible when it was made to be affordable.

Many collectables were made to be affordable. Look at 55 Belaires or just about any 60s muscle cars. It isn't original price that makes them collectable it is how many still exist and if they mean something to sombody (the more somebodys the better) that set price and collectibility.
Sure many super cars are collectable the day they roll off the line but that is because there are so few made in the first place. You don't need to wait for most of the others to rust away for it to go up in value.

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Hard to become a collectible when it was made to be affordable.

late 60s/ early 70s muscle and late 90s import rwds are the most sought after cars for restoration and performance. They were cheap relative to the periods market! A mint condition pure skyline with low miles is worth more than it was new. Not like a that or a supra was 90,000$ from factory. Pretty sure a split window stingray was a couple grand in their time. The dang brz messes up the whole idea haha. If it was only a toyota product i think the scion would be a novelty down the road. Alls i know is in 20 years if i see an frs with 50,000 km untouched in mint shape ill probably want to drive it really bad. I just think scion ending and the car getting a facelift may make the used frs worth more than a used brz in 5-10 years. I dont think they will ever get to the level of 6 figure restorations but i could see the scion, as i said, being sort of a novelty in years to come.

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Many collectables were made to be affordable. Look at 55 Belaires or just about any 60s muscle cars. It isn't original price that makes them collectable it is how many still exist and if they mean something to sombody (the more somebodys the better) that set price and collectibility.
Sure many super cars are collectable the day they roll off the line but that is because there are so few made in the first place. You don't need to wait for most of the others to rust away for it to go up in value.

My point exactly. The frs will
Be a novelty. You cant buy a 2017 scion frs. Even thought they outnumber the brz. Soon the brz will outnumber the frs.

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Hard to become a collectible when it was made to be affordable.

Not necessarily. Some of the affordable sports cars from the 1960s are now seeing an increase in price because they are more than 50 years old and don't have as many survivors among the fleet. They're still not exceeding their original value adjusted for inflation, but someone who managed to pick up a '60s MGB for $500 at the bottom of its value in the late '70s and has kept it from rusting may not be in a bad spot now. The Volkswagen is the poster child for affordability, but there are some specific models of VWs that bring pretty big bucks if you can find them.

We don't have any models that are weird enough and scarce enough to achieve that, though. Maybe if you wait until around 2022 and pick one up cheap, then hold it until 2070, you'd get a positive return on the investment.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

late 60s/ early 70s muscle and late 90s import rwds are the most sought after cars for restoration and performance. They were cheap relative to the periods market! A mint condition pure skyline with low miles is worth more than it was new. Not like a that or a supra was 90,000$ from factory. Pretty sure a split window stingray was a couple grand in their time. The dang brz messes up the whole idea haha. If it was only a toyota product i think the scion would be a novelty down the road. Alls i know is in 20 years if i see an frs with 50,000 km untouched in mint shape ill probably want to drive it really bad. I just think scion ending and the car getting a facelift may make the used frs worth more than a used brz in 5-10 years. I dont think they will ever get to the level of 6 figure restorations but i could see the scion, as i said, being sort of a novelty in years to come.

The Scion badge will mean nothing. Nobody will pay more for that badge. People will probably still rebadge to Toyota in twenty years. A badge does not make a car collectable the meaning and prestige behind the badge does. If you saw one in twenty years and it was badged Toyota would you turn down the chance to drive it?
Surparas and Split windows may seem like a low price new now but you can't take their cost then and say "look how cheap they were". That $2k Vette sold when a bottle of Cke was five cents, a house cost $15k and people earned $3 an hour. They were expensive as hell.

[Silver Cervy]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

My point exactly. The frs will
Be a novelty. You cant buy a 2017 scion frs. Even thought they outnumber the brz. Soon the brz will outnumber the frs.

But what you're saying essentially is that the "novelty" aspect of the FR-S will come solely from the fact that it has a Scion badge, even though Scion is (or was) simply a North American sub-brand of Toyota. Not to mention that the overall quality of the FR-S pales in comparison to the GT86.

@Packofcrows made a good point in bringing up the 240's. They have a Datsun badge but are basically junk beaters that you can get for a couple grand. You can't judge the novelty of a car off it's brand alone. Scion wasn't a special enough company to be considered worth anything.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Silver Cervy

But what you're saying essentially is that the "novelty" aspect of the FR-S will come solely from the fact that it has a Scion badge, even though Scion is (or was) simply a North American sub-brand of Toyota. Not to mention that the overall quality of the FR-S pales in comparison to the GT86.

@Packofcrows made a good point in bringing up the 240's. They have a Datsun badge but are basically junk beaters that you can get for a couple grand. You can't judge the novelty of a car off it's brand alone. Scion wasn't a special enough company to be considered worth anything.

The quality of the FRS is exactly the same as the GT86. The options and extras are just different. They didn't set the assembly line up to make the FRS different.

[NLS8520]

Originally Posted by Silver Cervy

BMW 1M comes to mind. Had a V6 from the M3 and a turbo, cost around 45,000 at launch, then shot up to 80,000 in 5 years. The price has come down a lot recently though, and I guess that can be attributed to the new M2 being released.

1M had a I-6 not a V configuration. Good example though.

[Silver Cervy]

Originally Posted by NLS8520

1M had a I-6 not a V configuration. Good example though.

Right you are. I also mixed up that it was a general 3-series engine. The M3 at that time had an NA V8.