Ace 4-2-1 Header

[steve99]

Originally Posted by johan

To counter - there's a lot more done to the 2017 MT engine than just the header - so the relative gains could be the same, or even greater given the overall improvements throughout the engine.

Again true its got different manifold intake tube air box filter but not much other changes.

Im not trying to argue or discredit anything ,just after some basic comparision info.

its likley mike dyned stock car then with ace tune and header just interested in gains that were achieved.

A lot of the gains people got NA on previous models was due to two things the header and tune., the new stock tune in 2017 is better and fueling logic is changed( runs closed loop almost all the time), it doesnt run down in the 10 afr like older model it runs arround 12.5 , where most tuners target leaning out the old tune was easy gains. The new stock header should also be more efficient. So gains may be less than previous models with any tune or header .

Granted the changes like manifolds on new car will likely resuilt in higher power than previous model, but the gain between a stock 2017 and a 2017 with header and tune may be less than seen with older cars.

[johan]

Originally Posted by steve99

Again true its got different manifold intake tube air box filter but not much other changes.

The entire engine is different - block, cams, valves, rockers.

Who knows though, it's all conjecture.

Leaning out AFR on a tune doesn't make as much power as you might think. It's a very subtle difference. I would assert that Subaru leaned it out for emissions - not power.

[steve99]

Originally Posted by johan

The entire engine is different - block, cams, valves, rockers.

Who knows though, it's all conjecture.

Leaning out AFR on a tune doesn't make as much power as you might think. It's a very subtle difference. I would assert that Subaru leaned it out for emissions - not power.

The entire engine is different ?, do you have info on this ?

some minor tweaks yes appear to be for reliability and less friction nothing major unless you have further info ?

[Lantana frs]

Im expecting same overall amount, just a smaller delta.

[Jmonty]

Originally Posted by johan

The dyno we're going to is 2.5hrs away, so it just wouldn't have been feasible to go beforehand. But - the header won't make much power without a tune, so we'll obviously still have the before/after on tuned power gains. I know it's of less value, but it is what it is.

We're getting @tony-brz's ACE'd 2017 and my Harrop SC'd 2017 tuned same day.

Down to visit Vit!

[brzaapi]

Well, beyond the dyno and specs:

I have owned a 2015, and went from stock to ACE and Tune. And, I now have a 2017 and have added the ACE and tune. The jump in performance and response, feels very, very similar on both cars when you add the header. And, I would much rather drive a 15 with ACE than a 17 stock. A header (I prefer ACE) still is a much needed mod to this car.

So I don't know about the data, but the proof is in the pudding. If you want to smile more while driving the car, get a header regardless of MY. IT wont win any races, but it sure is a better version of itself.

[CSG Mike]

The relative gains of the header are identical for pre-17 and post-17. A MY17 barely dynos more than a 13-16; I've posted stock dynos elsewhere.

[Trust86]

Originally Posted by AceHeader-MT

Hey Johan,

Thanks for the feedback. We'll look into supplying the FP hardware in the future. The reason we don't now is not for cost but liability issues.

By re-using the original FP bolts it's almost impossible (*almost) to damage the OP's that come with our header kits. If we supply grade 8 bolts, they can easily be over torqued and strip or damage the OP.

Something we will certainly address moving forward.

Thanks again and happy to hear the install went well. We really do appreciate this kind of feedback from our users

Take care,
Ace Header

What do you recommend for the 8mm overpipe bolts? 8-12 ft lbs?

[AceHeader-MT]

Originally Posted by johan

There aren't any bolts in the stock exhaust so there's nothing to reuse? We couldn't have installed the header without the spare bolts I had.

That's way it's *almost impossible to break
Seriously though, we are looking into this as we know it can be a pain in the butt. Original decision was purely based on liability. If we don't supply the hardware, we can't get complaints about an over-torqued or warped/cracked flange (which has happened with the OP to header primaries)

Originally Posted by Trust86

What do you recommend for the 8mm overpipe bolts? 8-12 ft lbs?

Sounds about right. We typically tighten with a 1/4" ratchet not a torque wrench for these bolts. We also typically check again after a day of driving to make sure there aren't any leaks.

[jasonojordan]

Originally Posted by AceHeader-MT

That's way it's *almost impossible to break
Seriously though, we are looking into this as we know it can be a pain in the butt. Original decision was purely based on liability. If we don't supply the hardware, we can't get complaints about an over-torqued or warped/cracked flange (which has happened with the OP to header primaries)



Sounds about right. We typically tighten with a 1/4" ratchet not a torque wrench for these bolts. We also typically check again after a day of driving to make sure there aren't any leaks.

And that's fine not to supply it but perhaps a disclaimer saying yo you will need extra hardware to finish the install.

[brzaapi]

Originally Posted by jasonojordan

And that's fine not to supply it but perhaps a disclaimer saying yo you will need extra hardware to finish the install.

I just installed mine, and it went great. And, yes I am lazy and would like the supplied hardware. But, for now you can go get some OEM studs from your local Subie Dealer and they work fantastic. And safer to use than bolts.

The OEM stud PN is: 800910340

I used these and no problems at all .

[jasonojordan]

Originally Posted by brzaapi

I just installed mine, and it went great. And, yes I am lazy and would like the supplied hardware. But, for now you can go get some OEM studs from your local Subie Dealer and they work fantastic. And safer to use than bolts.

The OEM stud PN is: 800910340

I used these and no problems at all .

I had spare hardware laying around as well as I pointed out a couple posts back. Was just saying for the money your spending a disclaimer would be nice. I know I'm just nit picking. My install went fine as well and am very happy with the product and my choice of the 350.

[AceHeader-MT]

Originally Posted by jasonojordan

And that's fine not to supply it but perhaps a disclaimer saying yo you will need extra hardware to finish the install.

In the meantime we will update website to make this clear.

Originally Posted by brzaapi

I just installed mine, and it went great. And, yes I am lazy and would like the supplied hardware. But, for now you can go get some OEM studs from your local Subie Dealer and they work fantastic. And safer to use than bolts.

The OEM stud PN is: 800910340

I used these and no problems at all .

Thanks for the part #, we'll add to website for time being.

Thanks to everyone for this feedback, this is what helps us make a better product.

Constructive criticism is always appreciated, these cars are awesome and we want our products to be too.

Happy driving,
Team Ace

[jmark]

Originally Posted by brzaapi

Well, beyond the dyno and specs:

I have owned a 2015, and went from stock to ACE and Tune. And, I now have a 2017 and have added the ACE and tune. The jump in performance and response, feels very, very similar on both cars when you add the header. And, I would much rather drive a 15 with ACE than a 17 stock. A header (I prefer ACE) still is a much needed mod to this car.

So I don't know about the data, but the proof is in the pudding. If you want to smile more while driving the car, get a header regardless of MY. IT wont win any races, but it sure is a better version of itself.

Which ACE header did you go with? Thanks.