follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Delicious Tuning
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > Engine, Exhaust, Transmission

Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain.


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-19-2018, 05:24 PM   #15
86TOYO2k17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2017 toyota 86
Location: PNW
Posts: 2,131
Thanks: 336
Thanked 1,188 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
TBQH most people when they start modding always just want a little more. And if you cheap out on a few things your robbing yourself of some power and pleasure. You may end up having to up the boost to compensate losing reliability. Get the intercooler adds a tiny bit of power but keeps the power more consistent when driving hard and can run the same boost safer. There is one in classifieds for $2400 with intercooler.

I would try to max out your NA flow from best header frontpipe and exhaust to then maximize your supercharger potential with out needing to run more boost.

The main bottleneck in the exhaust is the cats. Most headers make barely more then decatted stock header besides ace header blowing them all out the water. Don’t be cheap now and regret it later. After decatted header, next bottleneck is frontpipe those are pretty cheap though. Exhaust is more a sound preference but be warned decatting your exhaust makes it much louder so a more tame exhaust for a DD would be best IMO. Although with a charger you really want a 2.75” for lower boost or even 3” for higher boost.

Google ace header and CSG mxp touring86. Very clean crisp and deeper then stock. Best possible performance for NA and low to med boost. Then you can tweak the sound with front pipe, double res FP cleans it up more, a high flow catted FP will tame it down a tad and help a little with smell, or just test pipe for cost/performance.

Lastly you will need a tune for all this. Delicioustuning has some packages for ecutek + ace header, or even innovate charger if you don’t have a tuner near by. Those are roughly 95% optimal.

Grimmspeed intake (which can work with innovate) ace 350, frontpipe, exhaust + tune should put you at 205whp with 93, or 215 with E85 then toss in innovate with 7psi 240 on 93 or 255 on e85. This would be the safest most reliable max power setup.

Last edited by 86TOYO2k17; 04-19-2018 at 05:49 PM.
86TOYO2k17 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to 86TOYO2k17 For This Useful Post:
CounterSpace Garage (04-19-2018), CSG Mike (04-20-2018), SkyeHack (04-19-2018), Teseo (04-20-2018), Tristor (04-20-2018)
Old 04-19-2018, 06:19 PM   #16
sbmantas
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Drives: Subaru BRZ 2015 Limited
Location: Lithuania
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
jjorgen
however, 1 question. I just read that greddy evo gt sits lower to the ground than others, like perrin, invidia etc. Was this thing an issue for you?
sbmantas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2018, 06:39 PM   #17
sbmantas
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Drives: Subaru BRZ 2015 Limited
Location: Lithuania
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
86TOYO2k17

Thank you for your long and descriptive recommendation! I'm still considering the final combination, however, jjorgen's suggested would fit me, i'm still researching all the stuff.
So, to conclude, you would suggest ace headers, CSG mxp exhaust and don't put the supercharger because of the reliability? But, from all the post's sprintex had some minor, edelbrock was kind of perfect for DD, and overall the change in power is undeniable. For me, the power is the issue here. Yeah i know, i know that brz is fun to drive and all, but all my previous cars were 300+ hp, mostly BMW's and in my brz i can't comfortably overtake somebody and that's an issue for me, so that's why i'm considering supercharger.
In your opinion, would you take sprintex (f.e. with intercooler) or edelbrock or jackson racing for your DD car?
I googled the combination and i like the sound and all. I would need to add this into consideration, because it's ±300$ more than jjorgen's suggested combination and i'm not planning to sell my brz soon, so if it would be worth investing i will
Since you might haven't noticed i'm not from US, i'm from Europe, Lithuania to be exact. In here we have 95 and 98 and nearby there are some quite good tuners so the tuning part won't be an issue here. Also we have e85 but since it is my daily, it doesn't make much sense going or 85.
Thanks again for the comments! I really enjoyed them!
sbmantas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2018, 06:51 PM   #18
86TOYO2k17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2017 toyota 86
Location: PNW
Posts: 2,131
Thanks: 336
Thanked 1,188 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Yes, Ace header (350/250/150) depending on goal. And CSG MXP touring86. Also I highly recommend a front pipe but up to you. Is your car RHD?

No, I do highly recommend getting the innovate/Sprintex charger it has been shown to be very reliable at lower boost. But I recommend intercooler for sure for slightly added power but mostly consistency and reliability reasons. Intercooled innovate/Sprintex 210 at 7-8psi should be very good for a DD.

Member classifieds has a Intercooled sprintex for 2400$ you can’t beat that deal! If I didn’t just have a kid I would have bought it myself already. But have to wait a bit now.

What is wrong with E85 for a DD? Best bang for buck upgrade, most places E85 is cheaper then premium (although worse gas mileage so evens out) and with flex fuel kit you can use premium E85 or even a mixture.

Last edited by 86TOYO2k17; 04-19-2018 at 09:40 PM.
86TOYO2k17 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to 86TOYO2k17 For This Useful Post:
CSG Mike (04-20-2018)
Old 04-19-2018, 07:25 PM   #19
86geek
Senior Member
 
86geek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Drives: 2015 FRS Asphalt
Location: Honolulu
Posts: 1,001
Thanks: 1,302
Thanked 343 Times in 265 Posts
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistople View Post
If you want rumble, get JDL or Tomei UEL headers.

Catbacks are highly subjective, but I'd recommend the Perrin 2.5" resonated or Q300 for tried and true "quiet" options. CSG's Laguna 90 is also supposed to be nice, but I haven't heard it myself.
Yup, PERRIN resonated. Unless you want hella loud with a JDL Catted UEL header & Greddy EVO. You can also buy from 86speed.com. just my 2¢¢
__________________


Opti-Coat & Cquartz Finest, Apexi Drop in Filter, 2.5 Perrin Res. Catback Exhaust
86geek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2018, 08:00 PM   #20
bfrank1972
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Drives: 2013 FR-S Argento
Location: Westport,CT
Posts: 1,855
Thanks: 517
Thanked 1,039 Times in 616 Posts
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 86TOYO2k17 View Post
Most headers make barely more then decatted stock header besides ace header blowing them all out the water.
Inaccurate
bfrank1972 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2018, 08:30 PM   #21
86TOYO2k17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2017 toyota 86
Location: PNW
Posts: 2,131
Thanks: 336
Thanked 1,188 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bfrank1972 View Post
Inaccurate
Which part gutted stock header?
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96235
I see you even posted in this thread.

Or Ace header blowing competition out of water? Many threads and dynos about this.

I would say a ace 350 (highest torque lowest hp) has the low/mid torque of a JDL UEL with the top end HP of a JDL EL, best of both worlds. The 250 (highest combined torque and hp) still has a slight dip but instead of 15-20ftLB for 1k rpm it’s about 5-8ftLb for 500rpm. But more then makes up for it 4500rpm to redline. The 150 (highest HP lowest torque) does the least in the dip but the most up top.
86TOYO2k17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2018, 11:24 PM   #22
jjorgen
Member
 
jjorgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Drives: 2016 Scion FR-S
Location: Lehigh Acres, FL
Posts: 18
Thanks: 0
Thanked 10 Times in 9 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
So I just measured, my car is stock ride height and with the Greddy EVO GT the lowest part of the exhaust has 4.5" of ground clearance. I personally have never had an issue with bottoming out. I only see it being a problem if you plan on lowering the ride height of the car because I have gone up and come off some fairly steep embankments and never had an issue.
jjorgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2018, 11:52 PM   #23
NRXRaptor
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Drives: BRZ
Location: Mendocino County
Posts: 369
Thanks: 7
Thanked 96 Times in 75 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
If a supercharger is in the pipeline then I think you have the money to swing for the Ace headers. I'm pretty certain Ace makes headers that are supposed to work nicely with the Edelbrock supercharger. However if you go with Ace you'll get no "rumble." To get that you'll have to go UEL, and if you do that I recommend JDL catless headers and their ultraquiet frontpipe if you want noise reduction
NRXRaptor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2018, 03:16 AM   #24
dhuang
Cannonball Record Guy
 
dhuang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: Series.Yellow, 4C, Fit
Location: Houston / Atlanta
Posts: 493
Thanks: 480
Thanked 429 Times in 223 Posts
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh View Post
one of my local buddies here has it and I followed him on the road once and couldn't hear my corsa through his FT86 V1. It's loud like it's got an aftermarket header.
I can confirm that the V1 is very loud with a catless header (In my case, a Borla UEL V1). I had to add a vibrant resonator to make my FR-S more bearable as a daily, but it sounded mean and aggressive when you went WOT.

I'm probably going to only get a Corsa exhaust and call it done for my Kouki BRZ.

FYI: Cold starts got annoying until I did a "cold start" OFT tune.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbrWfXa_qmQ"]Scion FR-S Borla UEL / FT86 SpeedFactory V1 Cold Start - YouTube[/ame]
__________________
2017 Series.Yellow
2013 Whiteout

VINwiki - Changing Automotive History
dhuang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2018, 07:20 AM   #25
Takumi788
JHerbert Racing
 
Takumi788's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Drives: 2013 Scion FRS
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 1,425
Thanks: 769
Thanked 1,186 Times in 593 Posts
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 3 Thread(s)
Garage
Love my setup. FYI the invidia q300 gets a little louder over time. Catless header to extract all the power but a q300 to quite it down to under the 90db limit at race tracks. It is heavy tho.

Openflash Header catless UEL
Manzo Overpipe
Invidia catless resonated front pipe
Invidia Q300 catback

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuYmRxvWUBY"]2013 Scion FRS Exhaust - Stage 2 exhaust rev - YouTube[/ame]
__________________
- #813 2013 Scion FRS Build Thread
- JHerbert Racing Website
Takumi788 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2018, 10:25 AM   #26
bfrank1972
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Drives: 2013 FR-S Argento
Location: Westport,CT
Posts: 1,855
Thanks: 517
Thanked 1,039 Times in 616 Posts
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 86TOYO2k17 View Post
Which part gutted stock header?
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96235
I see you even posted in this thread.

Or Ace header blowing competition out of water? Many threads and dynos about this.

I would say a ace 350 (highest torque lowest hp) has the low/mid torque of a JDL UEL with the top end HP of a JDL EL, best of both worlds. The 250 (highest combined torque and hp) still has a slight dip but instead of 15-20ftLB for 1k rpm it’s about 5-8ftLb for 500rpm. But more then makes up for it 4500rpm to redline. The 150 (highest HP lowest torque) does the least in the dip but the most up top.
Both

- that gutted stock header improves on the torque dip for sure, but doesn't compete with some of the better header designs. I'm a fan of a well done gutted stock header, but it's silly to imply "Most headers make barely more then decatted stock header besides ace header blowing them all out the water". That's a garbage statement.

- 'blow out of the water' is incorrect. ACE is probably the best optimized header out there no doubt, but at a price. Don't frame it that ACE is the only option. A lot of kool-aid drinking going on in this forum IMHO. I've seen the threads. There are plenty of good headers out there that will make a significant difference in a stock car across the rev band (both UEL and EL). If you want the best? Then you are safe going with the ACE setup, but personally I'd rather put that extra $1000 to that supercharger

- you should know that dyno comparisons, while useful when looking a the before/after, shape of the curve etc. are otherwise pretty incomparable. Too many other factors (dyno calibration, other mods, tune, weather, altitude, who is presenting the info) come into play.

Not going to turn this into another reality vs ACE header crusade thread, but just thought I'd offer a little 'balance' to these statements. ACE is a good choice, but if you don't want to pay the big bucks there are plenty of lower cost options that will make quite a noticeable change in your power delivery.

Cheers,

Brad
bfrank1972 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2018, 01:22 PM   #27
CSG Mike
 
CSG Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: S2000 CR
Location: Orange County
Posts: 14,522
Thanks: 8,911
Thanked 14,166 Times in 6,828 Posts
Mentioned: 966 Post(s)
Tagged: 14 Thread(s)
Skip the bolt-ons and boost first.
CSG Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to CSG Mike For This Useful Post:
bfrank1972 (04-20-2018)
Old 04-20-2018, 02:41 PM   #28
sbmantas
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Drives: Subaru BRZ 2015 Limited
Location: Lithuania
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
UPDATE

well, i got the news, that my shipping carrier gives me a huuuuge price for shipping to my location and the supercharger is too costly to buy.
Can you give me recommendations how can i make more power without supercharger? Obviously air intakes and headers help, but maybe combination that gives the best output. Tuning will happen here and will be optimised and so on.
sbmantas is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
TRD Cat-back Paired with UEL Headers?? alexpham_ Engine, Exhaust, Transmission 2 03-12-2018 10:57 AM
Cat-back vs axle-back on stock headers drz400dude Engine, Exhaust, Transmission 6 02-24-2017 06:03 PM
FS: OEM Headers and Axle Back IIDutch Canada Classifieds 1 10-13-2014 06:24 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:01 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.