follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
FT86 Motorsports
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Scion FR-S Forum | Subaru BRZ Forum | Toyota 86 GT 86 Forum | AS1 Forum - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > DIY (Do-It-Yourself) Guides

DIY (Do-It-Yourself) Guides For all DIYs.


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-24-2018, 07:39 PM   #1
.Kyle
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: it's grey
Location: Cave Creek, AZ
Posts: 73
Thanks: 9
Thanked 29 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
How To: Convert to 5x114 and retain stock brakes

Q: Are you looking to make your wheel selection a little broader?
A: Yes. We all are. 5x100 isn't all that great. It's nice that recently (since the WRX became incredibly popular and the 86 chassis increased the desire for 5x100) more wheels have become available. Still, this doesn't change that 5x114/5x4.5" has been the norm for a long time and there are thousands of great used wheel options out there in that fitment.

**Note: The calipers pictured are not the standard calipers. They are the FHI 4pot/2pot that came on the usdm 06-07 WRX and a whole boatload of jdm cars. There are a ton of pics of 86 cars at auto shows with these on around their time of vehicle launch. They utilize the 290mm'ish rotors that came stock. You do not need to change rotors to run this brake setup if staying 5x100. Not trying to create any confusion with the "stock brakes statement. Moreso; this is how to go to 5x114 with stock diameter/offset/dimension discs.

So what are we going to do about it?

Make our cars 5x114.



What do we need for parts?

2x 2008-2014 Impreza WRX STi rear wheel bearings
->OEM p#28473-va000 or look it up on Rockauto.com if you aren't a stickler for OEM
->link to OEM:
https://www.parts.com/index.cfm?fuse...rotor-HUB-ASSY

2x PBM front 5x114 hubs
->link to PartsShopMax
https://store.partsshopmax.com/shop/...s/ZNC6HUB.html

2x KNS Brakes DBA 4651 Front Rotors. p#KNS4651
These are unlisted on the KNS website. You can get them from various vendors who sell them for STi gravel spec setups. Your best value is to call KNS and talk to Ken. He will set you up.

2x KNS DBA 2663-10 Rear Rotors. p#KNS2663-10
Same as above. You can find the slotted version through many vendors but to have a smooth rotor to match your front it is best to call Ken. He seriously is the man. He has been my source for multiple FHI 4/2 and Brembo fitment/conversions. Dude has the parts on the shelf and makes life so much easier.

http://knsbrakes.com/c/home 919-420-0021

Now that you have the parts on hand; get the car lifted and supported.

Remove your regamasters or whatever wheel you have on there that will be allocated to "coolest coffee table ever" status.

Front:

Remove the 2 17mm head bolts that hold the caliper in place. Hang the caliper from the spring with a ziptie to not stress the brake hose.

Take 2 m8x1.25 (12mm head) bolts and thread them into the rotor to pull it away from the hub face.


Remove the rotor.


Remove the 10mm head bolt that holds the abs sensor in place. Slide the sensor out.
<no photo - it was too dark>

Remove the 4 14mm head bolts that attach the hub assembly to the knuckle.


Assemble in reverse. The disc drilling guide that is included with the PBM Hubs is not needed. Use it as a beer coaster when you have the job done.

Rear:

Similar to the front but with a touch more nuance.

Remove the caliper and support it.


Remove the rotor.


Remove the axle nut.


From the rear, remove the 4 14mm bolts holding the hub to the knuckle. The backing plate and hub will likely fall together. A couple knocks with a deadblow will get it unstuck.


Reassemble in reverse. Don't forget to swap the rubber inspection plug from the old rotor to the new.




Bolt on your TE's and torque them to spec and pull the car outside to take a picture.



All totaled, this swap cost $905 in parts and about 2 hours of me milling about the garage with some basic tools.

Last edited by .Kyle; 10-23-2018 at 02:22 PM. Reason: Typos and clarity
.Kyle is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to .Kyle For This Useful Post:
akidnamedguiza (08-28-2018), chaoskaze (08-26-2018), jordan7831 (08-24-2018), Lightened (08-26-2018), Lorico (09-05-2018), malubawla (08-24-2018), Mazikowski (08-28-2018), new2subaru (Yesterday), Sportsguy83 (10-09-2018)
Old 08-24-2018, 10:27 PM   #2
.Kyle
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: it's grey
Location: Cave Creek, AZ
Posts: 73
Thanks: 9
Thanked 29 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
If converting a PP/Ts/brembo swapped car use front rotor DBA4654-10 and rear rotor DBA42656-10 and same hubs as specified above.
.Kyle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2018, 12:33 AM   #3
Bach415
Senior Member
 
Bach415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Drives: Whiteout FRS
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 1,087
Thanks: 837
Thanked 348 Times in 257 Posts
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
@.Kyle Sorry your note sounded a little confusing... Can we keep the stock 86 brake calipers using the parts that you have listed, or do we have to switch to the 4/2 pot calipers from other jdm vehicles (I.E. 06-07 wrx as you mentioned) for the parts you listed to work?


Edit: I think I understand a bit more now after doing a little more research about the calipers & rotors. The KNS rotors are similar to the stock 86/frs/brz rotors (and other cars) in dimensions (front: 294mm diameter, 24mm thickness rear: 290mm diameter, 18mm thickness, 190mm parking brake) but is drilled out to be 5x114.3 pattern which allows plug and play replacement for the new hubs. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Last edited by Bach415; 08-26-2018 at 01:58 AM.
Bach415 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2018, 01:22 AM   #4
Redstar
Destroyer of Tires
 
Redstar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Drives: 2001 Honda Accord, 1997 Lexus ES300
Location: SoCal
Posts: 87
Thanks: 39
Thanked 48 Times in 29 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
You're doing god's work, son. This is exactly what I've been looking for since I joined the forums.
Redstar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2018, 03:13 AM   #5
Lightened
Every Ounce Counts
 
Lightened's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Drives: 86
Location: 3635′03″N 12145′13″W
Posts: 76
Thanks: 21
Thanked 33 Times in 22 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Excellent! Thank you


Lightened is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2018, 04:36 PM   #6
.Kyle
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: it's grey
Location: Cave Creek, AZ
Posts: 73
Thanks: 9
Thanked 29 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Ok. So my note is a little funky. To attempt to clarify; the 4/2 wrx brakes use the same size rotors as a stock 86. So, you can hang that 4 piston/2 piston caliper without changing front or rear rotors. In the rear you would need a KNS v2 bracket to fit the 2 piston caliper. I had this same setup on the grey car (car on the left in first pic) before going to brembos. When I went to brembos I put my FHI calipers in an RSTi and then my brackets and another set of calipers onto Senpai here. Stock rotors were always used.

USING THE PARTS LIST I HAVE HERE YOU WILL ABSOLUTELY BE ABLE TO GO TO 5x114 WITH STOCK CALIPERS.

Sorry for the caps lock. Not yelling. Just making it stand out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bach415 View Post
@.Kyle Sorry your note sounded a little confusing... Can we keep the stock 86 brake calipers using the parts that you have listed, or do we have to switch to the 4/2 pot calipers from other jdm vehicles (I.E. 06-07 wrx as you mentioned) for the parts you listed to work?


Edit: I think I understand a bit more now after doing a little more research about the calipers & rotors. The KNS rotors are similar to the stock 86/frs/brz rotors (and other cars) in dimensions (front: 294mm diameter, 24mm thickness rear: 290mm diameter, 18mm thickness, 190mm parking brake) but is drilled out to be 5x114.3 pattern which allows plug and play replacement for the new hubs. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Last edited by .Kyle; 08-27-2018 at 07:48 PM.
.Kyle is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to .Kyle For This Useful Post:
Bach415 (08-26-2018), Lightened (08-27-2018)
Old 08-27-2018, 01:08 AM   #7
Lightened
Every Ounce Counts
 
Lightened's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Drives: 86
Location: 3635′03″N 12145′13″W
Posts: 76
Thanks: 21
Thanked 33 Times in 22 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Thank you for the clarification .Kyle

If anyone is still confused...

YOU CAN STILL USE THE ORIGINAL STOCK OEM CALIPERS WITH THIS 5X114.3 BOLT PATTERN UPGRADE.


Endless options...



Lightened is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2018, 04:00 PM   #8
SuperTom
Senior Member
 
SuperTom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Drives: C5 Corvette, '17 Toyota 86, Jeep XJ
Location: New Castle DE
Posts: 1,013
Thanks: 481
Thanked 501 Times in 312 Posts
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Great work! this is the right way to do it instead of just throwing on some adapters. You could probably find a machine shop to redrill the stock rotor holes to 5x114 as well.
__________________
SuperTom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2018, 12:24 PM   #9
.Kyle
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: it's grey
Location: Cave Creek, AZ
Posts: 73
Thanks: 9
Thanked 29 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTom View Post
Great work! this is the right way to do it instead of just throwing on some adapters. You could probably find a machine shop to redrill the stock rotor holes to 5x114 as well.
In the rear you could as most modern subarus utilize a 190mm parking brake like the STi. My experience with drilling them has been less than awesome. Transfer punches are fine to make the center but unless you have a proper vice/jig and a drill press it is going to walk. Machine shops asked for more than what the replacement rotors cost based upon setup time. The value was in buying new rotors and not having to screw around with it. Open the box from Ken, put it on the car. Easy peasy.

In the front you cannot. The face of the hub is larger than the stock rotor inner hat dimension. You have to use a rotor with an STi sized inner hat.
.Kyle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2018, 01:21 PM   #10
SuperTom
Senior Member
 
SuperTom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Drives: C5 Corvette, '17 Toyota 86, Jeep XJ
Location: New Castle DE
Posts: 1,013
Thanks: 481
Thanked 501 Times in 312 Posts
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Kyle View Post
In the rear you could as most modern subarus utilize a 190mm parking brake like the STi. My experience with drilling them has been less than awesome. Transfer punches are fine to make the center but unless you have a proper vice/jig and a drill press it is going to walk. Machine shops asked for more than what the replacement rotors cost based upon setup time. The value was in buying new rotors and not having to screw around with it. Open the box from Ken, put it on the car. Easy peasy.

In the front you cannot. The face of the hub is larger than the stock rotor inner hat dimension. You have to use a rotor with an STi sized inner hat.


Good info. Hey im all about the least expensive/easiest path as well.


I have the wilwood old wrx brakes up front so im sure I could just buy the rotor hat in 5x114 config keeping everything else the same. But still wouldn't be sure about the inner hat dimension being big enough.


I would say this mod would be better in the beginning stages before wheel and brake purchases have already been committed to.


Anyway still a great write up and you have my thanks
SuperTom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2018, 01:34 PM   #11
.Kyle
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: it's grey
Location: Cave Creek, AZ
Posts: 73
Thanks: 9
Thanked 29 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTom View Post
I have the wilwood old wrx brakes up front so im sure I could just buy the rotor hat in 5x114 config keeping everything else the same. But still wouldn't be sure about the inner hat dimension being big enough.
Measure the inner hat of what you have if they are dual drilled. If the hat is 140mm this hub will work with that rotor.


Quote:
I would say this mod would be better in the beginning stages before wheel and brake purchases have already been committed to.
You're telling me.

Grey car day 3: (stock brakes)


Day 45: (FHI 4/2)



Day 730: (STi Brembos - pic is more recent that 2 year mark but i did a little makeover that included the brakes at 2 years)
.Kyle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2018, 01:56 PM   #12
Lorico
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Drives: 2015 FRS
Location: Ontario
Posts: 352
Thanks: 434
Thanked 223 Times in 103 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
damn this is a great write up, good job and thanks very much!
Lorico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2018, 07:11 PM   #13
chiu
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Drives: Monogram
Location: Toronto
Posts: 14
Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
This man has come from the heavens. Thanks dude!
chiu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 12:14 AM   #14
Racer X
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Drives: 2013 Scion FR-S
Location: Rockville, Maryland
Posts: 4
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Over so many years, it would appear this is the first complete answer to a reasonable PCD upgrade, THANKS! Have had my eye on a set of wheels that are only available in the 5x114.

One question please, sounds like if we buy the 4 hubs and the 4 rotors in the parts specified the change is straightforward. Are there any other parts required, and do the ABS rings and sensor cables fit right up?
Racer X is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
WTB: STOCK BRAKES Jetbill Want-To-Buy Requests 1 04-23-2015 08:09 AM
convert into 5x114.3 guslucatero Wheels | Tires | Spacers | Hub -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack 6 03-14-2015 04:37 PM
Stock brakes too small for stock wheels ndsleep612 Suspension | Chassis | Brakes -- Sponsored by 949 Racing 44 04-11-2014 09:24 PM
What's the average/your baseline full-oem/stock dynojet numbers? & convert to fly HP? fooddude Software Tuning 5 03-31-2014 07:41 AM
convert drum to disk brakes DIG1992 Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions 2 11-09-2011 06:04 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.