MotorTrend's Head-2-Head MX-5 MiataRF vs. Toyota86

[WorldRallyB]

Overview

2017 Toyota 86
MSRP: $26,255 as tested: ~$26,854 USD
MPG: 21 city / 28 highway
Horsepower: 205 hp @ 7,000 rpm, Torque: 156 lb-ft
Engine: 2.0 L 4-cylinder
Curb weight: 2,760 lbs
Dimensions: 167″ L x 70″ W x 51″ H
Tire size: P215/45R17
Option(s) equipped:
Fog Lights $599

2017 Mazda MX-5 Miata RF club
MSRP: $32,720 as tested: ~$36,130 USD
MPG: 27 city / 34 highway
Horsepower: 155 hp @ 6,000 rpm, Torque: 148 lb-ft
Engine: 2.0 L 4-cylinder
Curb weight: 2,445 lbs
Dimensions: 154″ L x 68″ W x 49″ H
Tire size: P205/45R17
Option(s) equipped:
Brembo/BBS Package $3400


Why would they not test a '17 BRZ LTD with STI lip kit and PP to make this a fair fight? I dont know

What are your guy's thoughts or predictions? Which car is going to have the best lap time? Better back-roads carver or city driving? Do we have people here who have driven the RF as well as a '17 86/BRZ?

EDIT UPDATE:

Originally Posted by WorldRallyB

I'm not going to regurgitate everything said, but i'll include some highlights.

[about the 86]
"Can you explain to me why the front of this car looks like a jack-o-lantern in December"? -Jason Cammisa

"This sounds like two garbage trucks arm wrestling in a dumpster" -Jonny Lieberman:
"Garbage trucks are too big, more like two drain disposals, one gargoyling on marbles the other on silverware" -Jason Cammisa

[about both cars]
"I loves these things, they're like fighter planes, not the heavy bombers" -Randy Pobst

"Picking a winner was tough, we preferred whatever car we got out of last.. until we drove them to work. On normal roads at normal speeds its the miata that turns the drudgery into comedy and puts the 86 in second place" -Jason Cammisa

Jonny and Jason comparison comments:
-86 Rides better than the miata
-86 Quieter than the miata
-maita more fun at 10/10
-miata lots of body roll (duh), lots of movement with lots of control
-86 More roomy cabin, likes the seat and steering wheel adjustment/telescoping
-86 "sit the way you want to sit"
-86 They're not a fan of the boxer exhaust and rumble, evident by my quote above
-86 drives every bit as good as the miata
Randy's comments:
-86 less body roll, likes the feeling of control that goes with it
-86 pulls better at higher rpm
-86 better sense of control
-miata behaves better on bumps, 86 gets more upset with "snap oversteer"
-miata felt planted over a bumpy section on the track
-miata you can change direction better

Streets of Willow hot lap times:

86: 1:30.26
RF: 1:30.39

Jonny tries to beat Randy's times in a Hellcat (yes you just read that) and clocks a 1:40.79

Miata RF WINS Head 2 Head

My thoughts on the video:
I really enjoyed it, very entertaining and for as much crap these guys give our cars in other videos they had a lot of nice things to say. The review did an excellent job capturing my enjoyment i have driving my brz. Based off this video, what should you do? Buy a BRZ PP!

[jmark]

Originally Posted by WorldRallyB

Overview (Episode premieres sometime Wednesday, speculation for now, ill update accordingly)

2017 Toyota 86
MSRP: $26,255 as tested: ~$26,854? USD
MPG: 21 city / 28 highway
Horsepower: 205 hp @ 7,000 rpm, Torque: 156 lb-ft
Engine: 2.0 L 4-cylinder
Curb weight: 2,760 lbs
Dimensions: 167″ L x 70″ W x 51″ H
Tire size: P215/45R17
Option(s) equipped:
Fog Lights $599

2017 Mazda MX-5 Miata RF club
MSRP: $32,720 as tested: ~$36,130? USD
MPG: 27 city / 34 highway
Horsepower: 155 hp @ 6,000 rpm, Torque: 148 lb-ft
Engine: 2.0 L 4-cylinder
Curb weight: 2,445 lbs
Dimensions: 154″ L x 68″ W x 49″ H
Tire size: P205/45R17
Option(s) equipped:
Brembo/BBS Package $3400


Why would they not test a '17 BRZ LTD with STI lip kit and PP to make this a fair fight? I dont know

What are your guy's thoughts or predictions? Which car is going to have the best lap time? Better back-roads carver or city driving? Do we have people here who have driven the RF as well as a '17 86/BRZ?

MT should have compared the RF to a BRZ Ltd with PP for sure. The BRZ is much cheaper and a better daily driver for sure. If you are 6'-2" or taller the RF Miata is very tight. The BRZ has a great sitting position. The BRZ PP corners with less body lean and the steering feel is better. YMMV

[Impureclient]

MPG: 21 city / 28 highway

What's that all about?

[funwheeldrive]

86 will probably win as the better driver's car.

I think the RF will win, with the roofless experience and better interior quality winning the reviewers over.

They should have used a PP BRZ.

[Vic4uf]

I test drove the RF and really liked it but the one I drove was close to $35,000. I didn't love it enough to spend that much. That's entering WRX STI territory. Wish it had the Recaro seats they get in Europe and a telescoping steering wheel. In the end, the price and lack of practicality caused me to keep my FRS.

Originally Posted by WorldRallyB

Overview (Episode premieres sometime Wednesday, speculation for now, ill update accordingly)

2017 Toyota 86
MSRP: $26,255 as tested: ~$26,854? USD
MPG: 21 city / 28 highway
Horsepower: 205 hp @ 7,000 rpm, Torque: 156 lb-ft
Engine: 2.0 L 4-cylinder
Curb weight: 2,760 lbs
Dimensions: 167″ L x 70″ W x 51″ H
Tire size: P215/45R17
Option(s) equipped:
Fog Lights $599

2017 Mazda MX-5 Miata RF club
MSRP: $32,720 as tested: ~$36,130? USD
MPG: 27 city / 34 highway
Horsepower: 155 hp @ 6,000 rpm, Torque: 148 lb-ft
Engine: 2.0 L 4-cylinder
Curb weight: 2,445 lbs
Dimensions: 154″ L x 68″ W x 49″ H
Tire size: P205/45R17
Option(s) equipped:
Brembo/BBS Package $3400


Why would they not test a '17 BRZ LTD with STI lip kit and PP to make this a fair fight? I dont know

What are your guy's thoughts or predictions? Which car is going to have the best lap time? Better back-roads carver or city driving? Do we have people here who have driven the RF as well as a '17 86/BRZ?

[WorldRallyB]

Originally Posted by Impureclient

What's that all about?

As a lesson learned to always check your sources i came across this hilarity:
Subaru where are my 2 ft-lbs of torque!? I NEED THOSE

[humfrz]

As close as I can come is driving a NC Miata for 8 years followed by driving my FR-S for 4 years.

My take is that the FR-S is a bit more practical, but the Miata is a bunch more fun.

I figure the contest will be close. Their conclusion may be that if you like a roadster, get a Miata ..... if you prefer a coupe, get an 86.


humfrz

[KalbiCool88]

You can always cut the roof off your FR-S - not that I would recommend it.

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by funwheeldrive

86 will probably win as the better driver's car.

I think the RF will win, with the roofless experience and better interior quality winning the reviewers over.

If they're gonna go for style over substance, they should also factor in how stupid they look driving the car to an outside observer.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by KalbiCool88

You can always cut the roof off your FR-S - not that I would recommend it.

That has crossed my mind ..... they even put in two black lines to follow .....


humfrz

[TommyW]

Randy Pobst will be the test driver and he generally prefers the MX5 when we have these shootouts between Miata and 86. I just wish they'd put some decent F'ing tires on the twin and it would be a whole other deal

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

If they're gonna go for style over substance, they should also factor in how stupid they look driving the car to an outside observer.

Are you saying I looked stupid for eight years, while driving my NC Miata .....

Really, what were the chances that rock would fall, just as I was driving by ....


humfrz

[why?]

It depends on the track. If they use something small and tight that will favor the miata.

I am sure they couldn't get a BRZ, or Toyota and Subaru have some kind of every other year plan when it came to which cars would go to the magazines. A few years ago everything was a BRZ, now it is probably Toyota's turn.

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by humfrz

Are you saying I looked stupid for eight years, while driving my NC Miata .....

No, that thing just looked like a chick car. It wasn't particularly stupid-looking. I figured men who drove them were secure enough in their masculinity that they didn't mind driving a feminine car to get the driving experience.

This new one is particularly stupid-looking. The lines are awkward, and the "face" on the front looks like a stoner saying, "Dude, what?"

And Mazda knows they screwed it up. If you look at the main Miata page on the Mazda website, there's not a single pic of the hideous front end. You have to dig into the gallery to see what the front end actually looks like. And even then, they have all the thumbnails of the front end cropped so you can't see it clearly. They know it's ugly, so they hide it.

Again, driving an ugly car is okay if the performance is there. But the comment was made that the MT reviewer would likely judge it on aesthetics as well. Aesthetically there's no contest.