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FR-S / BRZ vs.... Area to discuss the FR-S/BRZ against its competitors [NO STREET RACING]


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Old 03-12-2012, 06:59 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by SteelReign View Post
Just finished driving a 2005 RSX type S and it was a major let down. Didn't communicate everything I wanted it to. Steering felt kind of numb. Power didn't seem to really do it for me.

I guess I gotta test drive the FR-S/BRZ now. If it doesn't pan out, it might be Miata time!
They must have did something different than my 2002 model because the best part of my car is the communicative steering. I always can tell what's going on with my car and feel every pebble of rock on the surface. I don't think the FR-S steering will be more communicative either because of the electric motor it uses. I understand how you feel about the power, it sucks. But the FR-S will probably be not much better at that part either. I would be very surprised if it is.
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Old 03-12-2012, 03:34 PM   #44
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I thought the car drove well, I do admit the DC5 is a more civilized compared to the DC2. But comparing RSX to FRS is apple to orange or RWD to FWD
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:50 PM   #45
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I would say the rsx has the superior engine.
The k20z engine scream with an intake is unbeatable and the way it revs compared to a fa20. The rsx was let down mainly cause of its front mac suspension as well. If the Dc5 was made in rwd format the cars we know right now wouldn't be what we know. I for one is originally planning to get a integra type S (what we call it in Aus) but the frs being 10k more than a 6 years old rsx s over here its a easy decision here.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:18 PM   #46
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DC5's Looked great, The Type's.

But, I would take a brand new BR-Z over a used RSX.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:43 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelReign View Post
Just finished driving a 2005 RSX type S and it was a major let down. Didn't communicate everything I wanted it to. Steering felt kind of numb. Power didn't seem to really do it for me.

I guess I gotta test drive the FR-S/BRZ now. If it doesn't pan out, it might be Miata time!
I have a rsx-s and I'll tell you this. If you think the rsx steering is numb. You are going to hate the FRS steering.

If you think the rsx power is low. You aren't going to like the FR-S either.

I love EVERYTHING about the FR-S and BRZ except two things..

1. The steering
2. The engine

I don't find the FA20 to be that great. For such a high compression motor.. 200hp doesn't seem to be that glorious. The best aspect of the FA20 is the boxer. It allows the motor to be very flat and sit low in the chassis which in turn gives the FR-S/BRZ a log COG. Apart from that. The boxer will just make maintenance more complicated. There are better 4 cylinder motors in history than the FA20.

The steering on the FR-S and BRZ is much better than most of the electric steering units I've tried to date. It's still not as interactive and direct as a hydraulic power steering system though.

The rsx is the last generation of old school Hondas. With the DC2 being the king. All these new Honda sports cars are electric steering and throttle controlled and even heavier. The biggest let down on the rsx isn't the motor or the interior or the design... It's the suspension.. I find the stock suspension in the rsx to be garbage. Way too much body roll for a sports car. The lack of LSD also makes NO SENSE. How can you have a sports car without an LSD? Of course if you add the LSD and work on the suspension it's a decent platform for performance. It's still a fwd though.. And that just won't cut it for the ultimate driving experience. The FRS and BRZ on the other hand has excellent suspension stock and offers an LSD standard. The way a sports car SHOULD be. Take notes here Honda..

I do agree that when I first sat in the FR-S I told myself.. This is very similar to my rsx interior (i have a dc5-r interior conversion) The fabric bucket seats, red stitching. sporty leather steering wheel. basic cluster and instruments. Low seating position..
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Old 07-11-2012, 05:10 PM   #48
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Personally, I feel like the handling on the BRZ is much better than the RSX.

Not sure about the potential, I had a Civic Si for a while and the BRZ feels a bit more powerful, stock for stock.
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Old 07-13-2012, 05:43 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manonastick View Post
I would say the rsx has the superior engine.
The k20z engine scream with an intake is unbeatable and the way it revs compared to a fa20. The rsx was let down mainly cause of its front mac suspension as well. If the Dc5 was made in rwd format the cars we know right now wouldn't be what we know. I for one is originally planning to get a integra type S (what we call it in Aus) but the frs being 10k more than a 6 years old rsx s over here its a easy decision here.
Yea, this^

The ties rods are attached to the strut instead of the knuckles. The DC5/EP3 Chassis notoriously known for bumpsteer. Not going to lie, after awhile the RSX feels dated compare to all the newer cars that are coming out.

If I had money I would pick up a BRZ in a heartbeat.
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Old 07-13-2012, 07:17 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by Brody8877 View Post
Yea, this^

The ties rods are attached to the strut instead of the knuckles. The DC5/EP3 Chassis notoriously known for bumpsteer. Not going to lie, after awhile the RSX feels dated compare to all the newer cars that are coming out.

If I had money I would pick up a BRZ in a heartbeat.
Oh yea. Bumpsteer.. Try running stiff squared r comp tires with a lowered setup. The way the suspension geometry acts.. bumpsteer is uncontrollable. You have to FIGHT the steering wheel. It's kind of fun and humorous at times though haha. Only good thing about the tie rods being attached to the strut is that you feel that road very well that's for sure. You know exactly what that wheel is doing.. a little bit too much.
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Old 07-13-2012, 11:06 AM   #51
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Personally, I feel like the handling on the BRZ is much better than the RSX.
Yes. I've owned a DC2 and DC5. And I drove the FR-S at the first drive parking lot course event. My thoughts on their handling:

Overall Handling:
FR-S > DC2 > DC5

Steering Feel:
DC2 > FR-S = DC5

Chassis Balance (neutral being better):
FR-S >>> DC5 > DC2

Body Roll (less roll being better):
FR-S > DC5 > DC2

Ride Comfort:
DC2 > DC5 = FR-S

Also, here is a dyno overlay for the FR-S vs. RSX Type-S (k20a2). The FR-S makes more torque across the board, except above 7100 RPM. Honda's k20 series has a LOT of aftermarket potential though, I don't think the FR-S will be able to match that (low redline and lack of variable valve lift).

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Old 07-13-2012, 11:51 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by brianc View Post
The lack of LSD also makes NO SENSE. How can you have a sports car without an LSD? Of course if you add the LSD and work on the suspension it's a decent platform for performance. It's still a fwd though.. And that just won't cut it for the ultimate driving experience. The FRS and BRZ on the other hand has excellent suspension stock and offers an LSD standard. The way a sports car SHOULD be. Take notes here Honda..
The Elise / Exige do not have an LSD standard and are actually faster on the track without it. Understandably, there are quite a few differences between an RSX and a Lotus, but it's not necessarily imperative that a sports car have an LSD.
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Old 07-13-2012, 12:37 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by DarkSunrise View Post
Yes. I've owned a DC2 and DC5. And I drove Honda's k20 series has a LOT of aftermarket potential though,
I would say give the fa20 sometime as it can surprise us as it been out for less than 6months. K20 only got such mod with 10years of refined tunning as honda used the k20 from the first dc5r and ep3r back in 2002 and was still being produced in their last real type r the Fd2r.
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Old 07-13-2012, 02:52 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by brianc View Post
I have a rsx-s and I'll tell you this. If you think the rsx steering is numb. You are going to hate the FRS steering.

If you think the rsx power is low. You aren't going to like the FR-S either.

I love EVERYTHING about the FR-S and BRZ except two things..

1. The steering
2. The engine

I don't find the FA20 to be that great. For such a high compression motor.. 200hp doesn't seem to be that glorious. The best aspect of the FA20 is the boxer. It allows the motor to be very flat and sit low in the chassis which in turn gives the FR-S/BRZ a log COG. Apart from that. The boxer will just make maintenance more complicated. There are better 4 cylinder motors in history than the FA20.

The steering on the FR-S and BRZ is much better than most of the electric steering units I've tried to date. It's still not as interactive and direct as a hydraulic power steering system though.

The rsx is the last generation of old school Hondas. With the DC2 being the king. All these new Honda sports cars are electric steering and throttle controlled and even heavier. The biggest let down on the rsx isn't the motor or the interior or the design... It's the suspension.. I find the stock suspension in the rsx to be garbage. Way too much body roll for a sports car. The lack of LSD also makes NO SENSE. How can you have a sports car without an LSD? Of course if you add the LSD and work on the suspension it's a decent platform for performance. It's still a fwd though.. And that just won't cut it for the ultimate driving experience. The FRS and BRZ on the other hand has excellent suspension stock and offers an LSD standard. The way a sports car SHOULD be. Take notes here Honda..

I do agree that when I first sat in the FR-S I told myself.. This is very similar to my rsx interior (i have a dc5-r interior conversion) The fabric bucket seats, red stitching. sporty leather steering wheel. basic cluster and instruments. Low seating position..
Yeah I also love the steering on my 02 RSX. It is the only part of the car I like the most. Every other part of the car is a let down and you are so right about the suspension on the DC5.
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Old 07-13-2012, 02:57 PM   #55
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I would say give the fa20 sometime as it can surprise us as it been out for less than 6months. K20 only got such mod with 10years of refined tunning as honda used the k20 from the first dc5r and ep3r back in 2002 and was still being produced in their last real type r the Fd2r.
It already is surprising us. Its making great power with headers, DP, exhuast and tuning. Don't see why this thing shouln't hit the 200whp mark, and that's before we have palyed with cams...
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Old 07-13-2012, 03:35 PM   #56
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Speaking of potential:

Tainen's BRZ with I/H/DP/axleback made 179 whp. Even in a best case scenario where Perrin's tune added 10whp, that'd be ~190 whp @ 7000 rpm.

In comparison, an RSX-S with similar mods (I/H/E/tune) will make about 210-220 whp @ 8000 rpm.

Certainly over time tuners will find a way to squeeze more power out of the fa20, but the gap is so large, it'd be hard for the fa20 to match the potential of Honda's k-series (iVTEC + high redline).

Don't get me wrong, the fa20 is impressive in its own right, I just don't think it has comparable potential.
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