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Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain.


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Old 12-05-2011, 10:17 PM   #15
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Nice article with some interesting technical details:
- Tilted radiator
- Lexus-sourced Torsen differential. This is somewhat of a mistery since in the current lineup only the IS-F has a torsen, and that certainly would be overkill. Other option would be to use the old IS300 Torsen. This unit is 205mm vs 208mm for the IS-F, I guess weīll find out soon, but both should be pretty overengineered for a paltry 151lb-ft car.
- They mention the FA20 to be based in the FB, wich I no longer believe to be true, as Old Greg has mentioned itīs probably based on the FA16.
- 50 litre fuel tank!
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:20 PM   #16
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There was some other post somewhere that says the original hp number from Toyota was 230 but they de-tuned the engine for better fuel consumption/mpg. Anyone heard anything like that?
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:24 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Longhorn248 View Post
There was some other post somewhere that says the original hp number from Toyota was 230 but they de-tuned the engine for better fuel consumption/mpg. Anyone heard anything like that?
I think there was some interview or something where they said they could do like 230 but had to cut it down for emissions. So maybe a tune really will unlock a lot more power :O
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:26 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Nurburgring View Post
Nice article with some interesting technical details:
- Tilted radiator
- Lexus-sourced Torsen differential. This is somewhat of a mistery since in the current lineup only the IS-F has a torsen, and that certainly would be overkill. Other option would be to use the old IS300 Torsen. This unit is 205mm vs 208mm for the IS-F, I guess weīll find out soon, but both should be pretty overengineered for a paltry 151lb-ft car.
- They mention the FA20 to be based in the FB, wich I no longer believe to be true, as Old Greg has mentioned itīs probably based on the FA16.
- 50 litre fuel tank!
I'm not unhappy with the differential news. Overengineered overkill in the driveline is music to my ears.

Unlike D4S, that is something for the tuners.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:36 PM   #19
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At the BRZ drive event, the managing director of UK Subaru distributor IM Group, Andy Edmiston, told GoAuto the BRZ would be welcomed by British dealers, who unlike their Australian counterparts see much of their volume come from the brand’s performance offerings.

He said WRX and STI sales were now suffering from the high fuel consumption and CO2 emissions of Subaru’s powerful boxer engines, so the more efficient BRZ – which is expected to emit around 160 grams per kilometre – could not come soon enough.

As GoAuto has reported, Subaru Australia is yet to announce whether it will import the BRZ.
I hope Subaru Australia will sell the BRZ. If they dont New Zealand wont get it either.
Just will have to get a Toyota 86 verson or have to go for a 2nd hand Jap import one.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:48 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Nurburgring View Post
Lexus-sourced Torsen differential. This is somewhat of a mistery since in the current lineup only the IS-F has a torsen, and that certainly would be overkill. Other option would be to use the old IS300 Torsen. This unit is 205mm vs 208mm for the IS-F, I guess weīll find out soon, but both should be pretty overengineered for a paltry 151lb-ft car.
Torsen only makes 4 models of their differential (T-1, T-2, T-2R, T-3) regardless of HP/TQ; the model the FR-S/BRZ/86 uses is the T-2, the same diff in the IS-F, WRX STI, S2000, Hyundai Genesis Coupe, and the 444 hp Mustang Boss 302.

And guess who owns JTEKT Torsen?
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:51 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by coyote View Post
I'm not unhappy with the differential news. Overengineered overkill in the driveline is music to my ears.

Unlike D4S, that is something for the tuners.
Dude, you sound like a technology curmudgeon, I understand your concerns regarding DI but you can say the same about almost every piece of technology on a modern engine:
- DI!! Nooo!! A 10% improvement in efficiency is not worth my tuning time!!
- Dual AVCS!! Noooo!! WTF?! now I have to tune and infinetly variable valve timing system, and on two cams!!
- 12.5 CR!! Noooo!! Itīs too high!! I canīt slap a turbo and boost 30 psi right out of the box!!
- DOHC! wtf?! Now I have to change TWO cams to get some power!! One is more than enough!!
- Fuel injection?! what?!!! It should come with carburetors for sure!!


Just get over it already. Itīs not the end of the world, competent tuners will see it as an additional step but will eventually take advantage of it.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:54 PM   #22
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And guess who owns JTEKT Torsen?
Does it start with T?
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:59 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Nurburgring View Post
Dude, you sound like a technology curmudgeon, I understand your concerns regarding DI but you can say the same about almost every piece of technology on a modern engine:
- DI!! Nooo!! A 10% improvement in efficiency is not worth my tuning time!!
- Dual AVCS!! Noooo!! WTF?! now I have to tune and infinetly variable valve timing system, and on two cams!!
- 12.5 CR!! Noooo!! Itīs too high!! I canīt slap a turbo and boost 30 psi right out of the box!!
- DOHC! wtf?! Now I have to change TWO cams to get some power!! One is more than enough!!
- Fuel injection?! what?!!! It should come with carburetors for sure!!


Just get over it already. Itīs not the end of the world, competent tuners will see it as an additional step but will eventually take advantage of it.
exactly we should be happy toyota has offered us this first, other motor heads will come to d4-s tuners when other manufacturers build similar fuel injection type engines, i love how on the first page someone said "leave engineering to the EXPERTS... lol american car makers said they made direct injection "affordable" in their lineup a few years ago... now we have direct and port injection in the same package dealing with the carbon build up from DI only engines and its MORE affordable than their direct injection only vehicles....


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I just hope I can flash a proper port injected map onto the ecu, or that will be going into the bin also.

Thanks Toyota. Next time stick to the clay modeling and leave the engineering to the experts.
since toyota is the only person doing this in an economical package... then we should suspect that they are the ONLY experts on this matter... they have 300 patents out for D4-S protecting the millions of dollars it took to develop...
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:59 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nurburgring View Post
Dude, you sound like a technology curmudgeon, I understand your concerns regarding DI but you can say the same about almost every piece of technology on a modern engine:
- DI!! Nooo!! A 10% improvement in efficiency is not worth my tuning time!!
- Dual AVCS!! Noooo!! WTF?! now I have to tune and infinetly variable valve timing system, and on two cams!!
- 12.5 CR!! Noooo!! Itīs too high!! I canīt slap a turbo and boost 30 psi right out of the box!!
- DOHC! wtf?! Now I have to change TWO cams to get some power!! One is more than enough!!
- Fuel injection?! what?!!! It should come with carburetors for sure!!


Just get over it already. Itīs not the end of the world, competent tuners will see it as an additional step but will eventually take advantage of it.
Mate, I am a competent tuner and everything else you've listed is a positive. Although not as attractive as port injected engine (due to parts availability), I'd be happy with proper DI.

I suspect that in a few years time when direct injection on petrol engines is a more mature technology, this D4S system will be the Beta VCR of blue ray players.

Not one person I've spoken to in the industry thinks this is a positive. The most common response has been "Fark, why did they do that?".
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Old 12-05-2011, 11:08 PM   #25
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Do you mind explaining why the 2nd set of injectors is such a problem for you? So far I've just heard "OMG, D4S SUXKSS!" The problem with tuning current D4-S engines is the fact that Lexus ECUs are encrypted well.
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Old 12-05-2011, 11:08 PM   #26
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Itīs been around for a while, since 1998 for Toyota actually, and dul injection since 2005, sounds like a reasonable timeframe for a pretty mature system. I donīt think we will be seeing significantly better results from DI in the future.
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Old 12-05-2011, 11:11 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by coyote View Post
Mate, I am a competent tuner and everything else you've listed is a positive. Although not as attractive as port injected engine (due to parts availability), I'd be happy with proper DI.

I suspect that in a few years time when direct injection on petrol engines is a more mature technology, this D4S system will be the Beta VCR of blue ray players.

Not one person I've spoken to in the industry thinks this is a positive. The most common response has been "Fark, why did they do that?".
yeah ask them if they want to keep their carbon build up on their direct injected engines, Toyota actually cares what happens to its customers car after it leaves the lot... that's why 80% of all Toyotas sold after 1980 are still on the road today...
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Old 12-05-2011, 11:12 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by serialk11r View Post
I think there was some interview or something where they said they could do like 230 but had to cut it down for emissions. So maybe a tune really will unlock a lot more power :O
:happy0180: Here's hoping. If the ECU really is unlocked hopefully you can change the engine maps relatively easily. It would suck to get it re-tuned to up the HP but not be able to pass state inspection.
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