EZ30R Swap - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

Kodename47 · 07-26-2013, 04:56 AM

In an effort to not go boost (I like NA) and thinking to get a decent amount of torque and power that winding out the stock FA20 will be costly I have been toying with the idea of doing a 3l swap, namely the EZ30R engine. I've had a look and I could get hold of an engine for less money than a Innovate S/C conversion and with OEM reliability then this is a bonus. I was wondering what people's views are and trying to find any holes and pitfalls of trying a conversion like this. I have a few questions....

Does anyone know if the stock mounts can be used? I'm guessing custom mounts will be needed to create the extra space required. I know that there would need to be custom work done for exhaust and intake provisioning. I can see the main issue being the electronics. Would you be able to integrate the EZ30 ECU into the car and allow the rest of the system to work or would this have to be another custom job? I've been trying to find out whether the stock 86 ECU could be remapped to work for a H6 lump and some say it can be done, some say it can't. Maybe this needs a standalone ECU to work which will bump up the cost.

Can anyone else see any extra problems and potential issues?

I've been trying to find info on the H6 JDM tuner car that was featured, but I can't remember who did it or find it in google at all.

xwd · 07-26-2013, 08:24 AM

I don't think the EZ30R is enough of an upgrade really unless you plan on building it and adding a turbo...

An innovate non-IC setup running as low as 4 psi would make more torque and power.

I don't think the ECU would work as their are different sensors and whatnot. Biggest problem would be mounting the transmission. Motor mounting probably isn't that difficult if it clears the hood, same mounting as other Subie engines.

DoctorNick · 07-26-2013, 11:19 AM

Sure you could make more midrange with a blower but nothing sounds as good as an uncorked H6. Seriously.

Considering the amount of custom stuff that would be needed for a setup like this, your more then likely better off going with the LS swap that has already been engineered. It would make more power and have all the issues your still gonna have with the H6. Like ECU integration for traction control etc

Kodename47 · 07-26-2013, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoctorNick

Considering the amount of custom stuff that would be needed for a setup like this, your more then likely better off going with the LS swap that has already been engineered. It would make more power and have all the issues your still gonna have with the H6. Like ECU integration for traction control etc

Problem is, not many LS lumps over here.....

I wonder if it's possible to get the OEM ECU to work 2 extra cylinders with a bit of loom tapping?

DoctorNick · 07-26-2013, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kodename47

Problem is, not many LS lumps over here.....

I wonder if it's possible to get the OEM ECU to work 2 extra cylinders with a bit of loom tapping?

Ah, should have looked at your location. Sorry about that.

I doubt the stock ecu will work. It would take a good deal of reprogramming.

Can you pass MOT with an aftermarket ecu? Or is the emissions test just an exhaust sniffer?

Acree · 07-26-2013, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kodename47

Problem is, not many LS lumps over here.....

I wonder if it's possible to get the OEM ECU to work 2 extra cylinders with a bit of loom tapping?

This single quote shows how far in over your head you are without even starting. The OEM ECU would never work with an H6.

qoncept · 07-26-2013, 01:01 PM

The H6 is simply not a good choice for this car. Not enough power and too much weight to even think about it. The point of creating the FA20 was lowering the CG which was VERY successful. A twin with an H6 would be a pig and a huge pain to work on. And the swap would cost a LOT more than a supercharger.

DoctorNick · 07-26-2013, 01:41 PM

EZR H6 only weighs 75lbs more then an EJ motor...

liltoua · 07-26-2013, 02:53 PM

[ame]http://youtu.be/i6nKQ1nmz3c[/ame]

topazsparrow · 07-26-2013, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoctorNick

EZR H6 only weighs 75lbs more then an EJ motor...

that's a very substantial amount of weight to add way up front.

DoctorNick · 07-26-2013, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topazsparrow

that's a very substantial amount of weight to add way up front.

Right, just like a blower or a turbo. I just wanted to make clear its not a ton of weight like people would assume. Its also a very compact motor. No more then an inch and a half. Maybe 2 inches longer(irc an EG33 is 5 inches longer!). So the CG/balance hasn't been drastically changed.

wparsons · 07-26-2013, 03:54 PM

The motor requires a totally different fuel and ECU system to run. It doesn't have DI at all, just port injection for a start.

If you can make it fit you'll have to run either the ECU for the engine and somehow make that play nice with the rest of the car, or run a full standalone.

It will be FAR cheaper, easier and more reliable to bolt on a turbo/super charger than attempt this swap, not to mention you'll make more power that way.

Kodename47 · 07-26-2013, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew@Autolux

This single quote shows how far in over your head you are without even starting. The OEM ECU would never work with an H6.

I love how people on this forum are quick to put the boot in. I would assume you couldn't but I had read somewhere that you could retune the ECU for 6 cylinders via ECUtek. After all, ECUtek do cover the ECU for the EZ30 engine. Is it that crazy? If you could re-write the full code to take the extra cylinders into account? I guess standalone is most likely the way forward, but if this avenue is possible then it would save a huge amount of work. Just FYI, it wouldn't be the 1st engine swap I've done

Does anyone know how CANBUS systems interface, are there multiple ECUs on the twins or are they all built into 1? Is it possible to swap Subaru ECU's without any issue?

The weight wouldn't be much more than a turbo or s/c plus then you wouldn't be using the drive train at any higher power than from factory so I'd hope that it would be more reliable than a boost conversion. No DI.... No DI seal issue. Cost isn't the issue. If I can get it to mate to the gearbox, I can get one minus management for £600-1000 less than boost.

Perrin have done a swap in an impreza and I'm trying to find the most recent threads on NASIOC etc.

xwd · 07-26-2013, 05:38 PM

The ECUs are completely different in model, etc. The net weight increase from the non-IC innovate kit is like 35 lbs since it replaces the stock manifold. With the H6 you need to figure where to put the much larger radiator etc. if money is no object weapons grade performance will sell you a turn key LSx v8 swap for 15-20k...

Getting the H6 to mate to the gearbox is going to be a custom job. Might be easier to put a Toyota V6 in there...

07-26-2013, 04:56 AM	#1
Kodename47 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Drives: UK GT86 Location: UK Posts: 3,040 Thanks: 185 Thanked 1,629 Times in 1,112 Posts Mentioned: 155 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	EZ30R Swap In an effort to not go boost (I like NA) and thinking to get a decent amount of torque and power that winding out the stock FA20 will be costly I have been toying with the idea of doing a 3l swap, namely the EZ30R engine. I've had a look and I could get hold of an engine for less money than a Innovate S/C conversion and with OEM reliability then this is a bonus. I was wondering what people's views are and trying to find any holes and pitfalls of trying a conversion like this. I have a few questions.... Does anyone know if the stock mounts can be used? I'm guessing custom mounts will be needed to create the extra space required. I know that there would need to be custom work done for exhaust and intake provisioning. I can see the main issue being the electronics. Would you be able to integrate the EZ30 ECU into the car and allow the rest of the system to work or would this have to be another custom job? I've been trying to find out whether the stock 86 ECU could be remapped to work for a H6 lump and some say it can be done, some say it can't. Maybe this needs a standalone ECU to work which will bump up the cost. Can anyone else see any extra problems and potential issues? I've been trying to find info on the H6 JDM tuner car that was featured, but I can't remember who did it or find it in google at all. __________________ .: Stealth 86 :. Abbey Motorsport/K47 Tuned Sprintex 210 Supercharger Kodename 47 DJ: Soundcloud / Instagram / Facebook

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07-26-2013, 08:24 AM	#2
xwd Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Drives: 2013 DGM Subaru BRZ (Subie #9) Location: ATL, US Posts: 2,667 Thanks: 123 Thanked 860 Times in 552 Posts Mentioned: 32 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I don't think the EZ30R is enough of an upgrade really unless you plan on building it and adding a turbo... An innovate non-IC setup running as low as 4 psi would make more torque and power. I don't think the ECU would work as their are different sensors and whatnot. Biggest problem would be mounting the transmission. Motor mounting probably isn't that difficult if it clears the hood, same mounting as other Subie engines.

07-26-2013, 11:19 AM	#3
DoctorNick Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Drives: '13 BRZ Location: Chicago, Il. Posts: 118 Thanks: 17 Thanked 51 Times in 33 Posts Mentioned: 4 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Sure you could make more midrange with a blower but nothing sounds as good as an uncorked H6. Seriously. Considering the amount of custom stuff that would be needed for a setup like this, your more then likely better off going with the LS swap that has already been engineered. It would make more power and have all the issues your still gonna have with the H6. Like ECU integration for traction control etc

07-26-2013, 01:41 PM	#8
DoctorNick Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Drives: '13 BRZ Location: Chicago, Il. Posts: 118 Thanks: 17 Thanked 51 Times in 33 Posts Mentioned: 4 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	EZR H6 only weighs 75lbs more then an EJ motor...

07-26-2013, 02:53 PM	#9
liltoua Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Drives: 1998 Subaru Impreza Location: South East Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 1 Post Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	[ame]http://youtu.be/i6nKQ1nmz3c[/ame]

07-26-2013, 05:38 PM	#14
xwd Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Drives: 2013 DGM Subaru BRZ (Subie #9) Location: ATL, US Posts: 2,667 Thanks: 123 Thanked 860 Times in 552 Posts Mentioned: 32 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	The ECUs are completely different in model, etc. The net weight increase from the non-IC innovate kit is like 35 lbs since it replaces the stock manifold. With the H6 you need to figure where to put the much larger radiator etc. if money is no object weapons grade performance will sell you a turn key LSx v8 swap for 15-20k... Getting the H6 to mate to the gearbox is going to be a custom job. Might be easier to put a Toyota V6 in there...

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