Primacy HP tires in "winter-lite"??

[RallySport]

I'm in the same boat. It gets cold here but is often dry. When it snows I'll drive my truck.

In the warm months I don't track my car or take too many risks on spirited back road drives. Feeling like UHP AS tires will be ideal for me. It's not like the Primacys are Pilot Super Sports anyway. I expect to lose some steering response and otherwise not even notice the difference in ultimate grip. If that trade-off opens up a few more months of driving the FRS rather then it's well worth it.

[Overdrive]

Originally Posted by motrek

This thread seems to be ~30% people saying it's fine and the rest saying I should get winter tires. I'm definitely not doing that. I live in a small condo with minimal storage space, I have no good place to store tires, I have no tools, I don't have a good place to work on a car... switching out tires/wheels twice a year would be a pretty big inconvenience. I will likely buy some all-seasons in the next few days, not sure what I'll do with the Primacys at that point. I can't imagine the used market is very strong. Maybe see if I can store them at a friends' house or something for a while. Might be good for a few track days sometime in the future I suppose. Ugh. Really wishing Subaru fitted these with all-seasons to start with, like almost every other car.

Well, you asked, and we answered man, lol. We all come from different parts of the country with different weather extremes, different levels of experience driving all manner of car and driving this car, different levels of acceptance for what is sketchy traction, etc, so you're bound to get answers that range from "0 F--ks" to "I park it in a vault when the first flake hits the ground". More often than not people are going to err on the side of caution since nobody wants to lose their car to making a bad decision.

Since the winter of the PNW isn't what most of the rest of the country deals with for winter, it can be difficult to place one's self in a situation where winter is barely there (but it sounds pretty nice).

I can understand being in a position of inconvenience with your living situation, but that would have been good info to put out there up front for people's consideration. Without it, folks will assume you have the ability and/or are willing to do a swap of tires, and that's what they'll suggest because it is the most ideal (but also least convenient). I think the Primacy is ever so slightly more forgiving than a full blown summer tire, but it is still very compromised when the temp drops and the ground isn't dry, so people aren't going to overall recommend you drive on them in those conditions.

A UHP All-Season is about as good a tire as you're going to get for something that will not totally neuter this car but also won't send you flying off into a guardrail at 10mph that you can use year-round. Now, ice is ice, and no tire can really save you from it, but if your winters really are that mild they'll get the job done as long as you don't get too excited when the temp is low or there's snow on the ground. Just understand that they're only likely to get you maybe 25-30,000 miles, at best, before they're totally shot (the usual sacrifice of lifespan for grip), and you don't want to be caught in anything but dry weather when they're close to the end of their life.

I recommend the Bridgestone Potenza RE970AS Pole Position. Mouthful, but a great tire. Seems to be on its way out, though, so better pick em up while you can. There also appears to be an RE980AS out now (cheaper than the 970s, too), and it looks like they got rid of the directional tread design, so you may get a little more life out of them with rotating the tires if that is the case.

I don't know if I'd use the stock tires for any tracking, but the fellas of Everyday Driver did drive a LeMons car on track with those tires because of their lifespan, so I suppose it's doable. Someone out there will want them, just find someone into drifting, they're always looking for crap tires to destroy on the cheap.

[atomicalex]

The Primacy HPs were not that good in sub 40°F temps for me. Fun, kind of entertaining, but not good. They were ok in general wet stuff, but cold wet was just a recipe for unintended wheelspin.

Get a winter-lite setup like Conti DWS (if available?). You will thank yourself.

[Audio]

Originally Posted by motrek

Okay, so the topic of summer tires in winter has been discussed to death... or has it?

The problem is that "winter" clearly means different things to different people. Driving on summer tires in winter in Alaska? I'll believe that's unacceptable. Driving on summer tires in winter in Mexico? You might be okay.

I just bought a new Subaru BRZ over the weekend and it came with the stock Michelin Primacy HP tires obviously. It occurs to me that these are sold as "summer touring" tires and now I'm wondering if I need to change them out for different tires for the upcoming [relatively] colder weather in Seattle.

The temperature in Seattle rarely goes below freezing. I read somewhere that it happened on 15 days last year, presumably in the middle of the night when I wouldn't be driving. For the vast majority of the time during the winter, I expect the temperature to be above 40 degrees.

We get minimal snow and ice. I think I can count the number of days there was snow or ice on the ground last year on one hand. I'm fine staying home or Ubering around on those days.

Thanks for any input!

So, I had the primacy tires for first winter, coming off a clover ramp at a slow speed I got sideways across three lanes on the highway, in ice!! Got lucky no one was around me, semi about 100 feet back was going very slow thank goodness. Pulled it back together, but every time you hit the gas those tires break loose in 1 inch of snow, or little bit of ice.. be careful

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[SuperTom]

Originally Posted by Audio

So, I had the primacy tires for first winter, coming off a clover ramp at a slow speed I got sideways across three lanes on the highway, in ice!! Got lucky no one was around me, semi about 100 feet back was going very slow thank goodness. Pulled it back together, but every time you hit the gas those tires break loose in 1 inch of snow, or little bit of ice.. be careful

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Last year my Cherokee broke for a while and I had to drive my 86 with the stock summer tires. It was the scariest ride ever. Everyone else was at least able to cruise straight ahead. I was by far the slowest car on the road and everytime I would tap the gas the tail would step out.


This year I put some all season Hankooks on that have light snow ability. I would suggest the same to you

[Varelco]

Primacys turn to plastic below 7C/45F. Fun and sketchy all rolled into one, the lose their progressiveness which isn't pleasant. They are perfectly usable you just need to tip toe the car around a lot more.

[Flarpswitch]

I just looked up the climate data for my little corner of the Pacific Northwest and it really looks like the Primacy HP tires would have me parked in the garage for eight of the 12 months, that is, if I want to be safe. My 2017 BRZ LTD/Auto. is just an indulgence for the street and not the track. I don't want to mess with swapping wheels; I want to keep it simple. It's cold and wet here much of the year, so it looks like the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+ is a good match for my type of driving. The OEM tires just seem to be at the lower end of temperature range. We have a Subaru Ascent for when it gets cold and frozen, although I think Subaru could have done better than the Falken tires that came fitted from the factory. Traction B? Really? They don't handle that great either. The rest of the Ascent is marvelous, so new tires for that is on the back burner. I remember what it was like to drive in the winter back in the sixties. I was always swapping ends on the turnpike in my Austin Healey. Tire tech was nothing like it is today. The Pilots are available at Costco for a good cost and I am thinking this is a good idea even thought the OEM tires are practically new.

[Audio]

Originally Posted by Flarpswitch

I just looked up the climate data for my little corner of the Pacific Northwest and it really looks like the Primacy HP tires would have me parked in the garage for eight of the 12 months, that is, if I want to be safe. My 2017 BRZ LTD/Auto. is just an indulgence for the street and not the track. I don't want to mess with swapping wheels; I want to keep it simple. It's cold and wet here much of the year, so it looks like the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+ is a good match for my type of driving. The OEM tires just seem to be at the lower end of temperature range. We have a Subaru Ascent for when it gets cold and frozen, although I think Subaru could have done better than the Falken tires that came fitted from the factory. Traction B? Really? They don't handle that great either. The rest of the Ascent is marvelous, so new tires for that is on the back burner. I remember what it was like to drive in the winter back in the sixties. I was always swapping ends on the turnpike in my Austin Healey. Tire tech was nothing like it is today. The Pilots are available at Costco for a good cost and I am thinking this is a good idea even thought the OEM tires are practically new.

A/s premier. Great tire, have a/s 3+ now and it's a bit stiff. But still good in the rain. Snow= tbd


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[Flarpswitch]

[QUOTE=Audio;3167591]A/s premier. Great tire, have a/s 3+ now and it's a bit stiff. But still good in the rain. Snow= tbd

If you are recommending Michelin Premier A/S for the BRZ, I think I will pass. I put them on our 2014 Forester to replace the original Yokohama Geolander tires that barely lasted 25,000 mile and wore unevenly. The Michelin Premier outperformed the Yokohama in every respect, but it appears that it won't be a high milage tire. It does not start out with much tread depth and it got annoying when it goes in for service the service advisor tells us the tires are worn out. "No, did you look at the wear indicator bars?", I say. One thing the Michelin tires do is that they wear evenly across the tire tread unlike the Yokos. My daughter has the Forester now and I would recommend the Premier as replacement when it's time. The Pilots are a compromise in some respects, but getting an automatic BRZ was a compromise to my driving situation, so I don't think I will lose much sleep over tires. I did get out in the wet and low 40's the other day and if that is the way it's going to be, papa got to get new shoes.

[soundman98]

i measure my tire wear in years. if i get 2 years out a set of tires, i'm happy.

my brz just passed 30k mi, and i have a sticky note to order it's 3rd set of tires come summer this year...

[Flarpswitch]

Any comments on the Bridgestone Potenza RE980AS? I reviewed the tests that compare to the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+, the Pirelli and the Continental tires and they all seem to be comparable. I saw them at Costco and the cost is about the same as the Michelin after the $70 rebate.

[Flarpswitch]

Just fitted Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+. Much improved at 35-55 deg. on wet roads. I do see that on this car it is more of a 3 season tire.
Comments after driving around town: I feel that the new tires are better suited for road conditions when it's cold out, but I notice that the handling is not a precise as with the Primacy HP. Has anyone played with tire pressure?

[motrek]

Quick update... I got so many mixed opinions about switching out the stock tires that I was 50-50 on it... I finally took the car to Discount Tire in late November and asked them to put on some all-seasons. The guy came out and looked at the Primacies and asked why in the world I would want to swap them, and was convinced that all-seasons wouldn't actually be any safer in the cold... now, I know that some 20 year old working at Discount Tire isn't necessarily an expert, but since I was already 50-50 on it, that was enough to sway me to keep the tires.

Since then it has been down in the high-30s, low-40s a bunch of times and the car drives just fine, wet or dry. I've tested the limits several times just to make sure, stepping the back out on purpose (when it's safe obviously), and it doesn't seem to take that much less effort than when the temperatures were in the 50s. I'm pretty sure I have at least as much traction as any "regular" car on the road at those temperatures. Probably more.

A week or two ago it snowed a bit (very lightly, for like 2 hours, at night). The temperature was ~33 degrees and it all turned to slush immediately. So with a very small amount of slush on the road, I waited until late at night and drove the car gingerly to a nearby empty parking lot to see if it was a rolling deathtrap in such conditions. I slid it around for a while and was frankly astonished by the amount of grip it had. Vastly more grip than my old BMW that was fitted with all-season tires (which WAS a rolling deathtrap in such conditions).

So I'm just going to keep the tires for this winter (and probably next winter) and avoid driving when there's any snow or ice on the road. For everybody who posted horror stories about the Primacies in the cold, I'm not sure how to explain our vastly different experiences. Maybe when the tires get worn down a bit more they will lose whatever cold-weather traction they have now. Or maybe you guys are much more aggressive drivers than I am? Dunno. But right now they tires seem actually pretty good to me.

[churchx]

What? Tire shop guy, that tells that all-seasons won't be better then summer tires in cold? Who hired him?
As for aggressiveness .. there is a bit that one has to drive just fast enough to drive with the flow. For others to not need extra overtakes, to be able to merge in traffic and such.
And then there is driving culture, that may differ. Eg. keeping due lacking grip long enough intervals between cars will mean someone will try to cut in all the time.
And then bit of "unexpected". Some mistake or willing breaking of rules done by others, something you couldn't expect/plan out before due simply not seeing that due blind corner, hard to notice patch of black ice, critters, pets, kids .. and yes, including skidding out or not able to brake others still on summer tires . There is always need for some safety margin, if unexpected need for emergency braking/maneuvering arise.