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Old 06-11-2019, 12:22 AM   #1
MilkyWitness
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Safe oil temps for daily driving and spirited driving off the track?

I have searched around for good oil temp levels to make sure my car stays at, 2019 brz. I had Tomei UEL catless headers and a simple sticky heat shield thing slapped on the oil pan, and I saw my oil get up to 237F with some hard driving on the back roads. I swapped back to stock headers and kept the heat shield on, and then took it off, and I'm getting the same peak oil temps. Is 230-240F a safe operating temp for the oil under stock or stage 2 conditions? It seems like my car likes to heat the oil up pretty fast even with a small amount of hard driving. Should I be worried about long term effects at all or invest in a cooler even if I'm not tracking it? Thanks.
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Old 06-11-2019, 02:18 AM   #2
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Hum...
My guess you are way overthinking this oil temp thingy.
If you do want piece of mind an oil cooler would do the trick. Or just put some vents in the hood.

But if it was me, I'll burn the car. No point in trying to sell it. Once the oil heats to those levels it's only a matter of time before the engine blows up.

But hope is not lost. You can pick a nice Civic Si new or used with out worry about silly high oil temp. Trust me these new turbos smoke any 86 out there, even with a forced induction kit.
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Old 06-11-2019, 07:44 AM   #3
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Funny enough, I was just doing a bunch of research about oil temps yesterday.

It seems like where you're at is perfectly fine.

https://www.pointmeby.com/2016/09/18...z-frs-gt86-86/
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93127
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forum...topics/3741394
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Old 06-11-2019, 08:18 AM   #4
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230-240 is perfect. It needs to get warm enough to work correctly. Quality oil can survive occasional spikes of 300, but sustained temps over ~275 would start to become concerning to me, and definitely time to invest in a cooler of some kind.
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Old 06-11-2019, 09:25 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by BigTuna View Post
Funny enough, I was just doing a bunch of research about oil temps yesterday.

It seems like where you're at is perfectly fine. Things don't get too hairy until you get to around 300degF

https://www.pointmeby.com/2016/09/18...z-frs-gt86-86/
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93127
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forum...topics/3741394

What are you smoking? 240F is about the cut off point to when severe pressure drops occur. The issue with oil temps on this platform isn't the oil temp itself (as far as damaging the oil), it's the effect on oil pressure. If you're regularly going over 240F and not doing anything about it, say goodbye to your rod bearings.

Honestly, people, search the forums. Get an engine oil cooler. It's one of the first reliability mods you should do if you're going to be canyon running or putting the car on track.
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Old 06-11-2019, 09:34 AM   #6
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A thermostatically controlled oil cooler is much cheaper than playing a guessing game I bought the Mishimoto oil cooler and haven't looked back. Even for dd, it's nice to know I don't need to worry about it. My temps barely cracked 210-220 with a hardcore pounding when I was using catless UEL headers with no heat management.
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Old 06-11-2019, 09:44 AM   #7
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I ran my car up to 250F at the track, and pitted to cool it down. I wouldn't go beyond that my self as the pressure drop can Nuke your bearings.

If the car is out of warranty consider switching to a 5w30 or 0w30. It will hold oil pressure for longer. Beyond that a oil cooler is a good idea if you regularly push the car up to those temperatures.
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Old 06-11-2019, 10:20 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tristor View Post
What are you smoking? 240F is about the cut off point to when severe pressure drops occur. The issue with oil temps on this platform isn't the oil temp itself (as far as damaging the oil), it's the effect on oil pressure. If you're regularly going over 240F and not doing anything about it, say goodbye to your rod bearings.

Honestly, people, search the forums. Get an engine oil cooler. It's one of the first reliability mods you should do if you're going to be canyon running or putting the car on track.
Did you not read any of the links that suggest and prove otherwise?
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Old 06-11-2019, 11:15 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tristor View Post
What are you smoking? 240F is about the cut off point to when severe pressure drops occur. The issue with oil temps on this platform isn't the oil temp itself (as far as damaging the oil), it's the effect on oil pressure. If you're regularly going over 240F and not doing anything about it, say goodbye to your rod bearings.

Honestly, people, search the forums. Get an engine oil cooler. It's one of the first reliability mods you should do if you're going to be canyon running or putting the car on track.
I bet you suggest to only use the black tokyo roki filter too or else it will damage your engine.


100-169F Warm Up Phase, high oil pressures
170-189F Near Operating temps, oil pressures still higher
190-225F Normal Operating Range, oil pressures normalize
225-245F Middle End of operating range for track use, 5% drop in oil pressures
245-255F Upper End of operating ranges for track use, 10% further drop in pressures on 0w20
255-265F Red Zone of operating ranges for track zone, 0w20 starts to thin, oil pressures drop to questionable range.
265F+ Playing with fire on 0w20

Keep in mind the data above is oil brand dependent. Different oils breakdown at different temperatures.

Amsoil Signature Series, synthetic *Onset Thermal Breakdown @ 295*
Renewable Lubricants Bio-SynXtra Super High-Performance Motor Oil *Onset Thermal Breakdown @ 275f*
Quaker State Ultimate Durability, synthetic *Onset Thermal Breakdown @ 260f*
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Old 06-11-2019, 12:18 PM   #10
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What oil weight were you using?

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Old 06-11-2019, 01:27 PM   #11
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You need an oil cooler.

I wouldn't recommend ever going over 240F unless you don't mind significantly accelerating the wear and tear on your car.
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Old 06-11-2019, 01:51 PM   #12
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I think there's a very good reason why a lot of track cars often aim for under 225f for oil temperatures when considering cooling options. Temperature is only 1/10th the picture, pressure is what's actually important. Most cars will be hard pressed to actually bring oil to breakdown temperatures, but by that point one is typically already employing oil cooling so even if the pressure isn't good, it'd be almost impossible to "cook" the oil. But it's the lubrication and pressure that matters and balancing that with oil weight selection, alongside flow.

If the driver's manual recommends ~10psiX1K RPM, then I would aim for that, and even the better case scenario readings are pulling readings below that (IE, 60PSI at 7K RPM).

Here's just some threads that discuss oiling and pressure...

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63723
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134863
https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=131419
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76760 <-- the most clearcut one IMHO, for what it's worth


And while these are extreme examples of usage I think they, alongside the numerous anectdotes everywhere on the forums or otherwise paint a clear picture to warrant a more proactive approach to cooling.
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Old 06-11-2019, 02:26 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MilkyWitness View Post
I have searched around for good oil temp levels to make sure my car stays at,............Should I be worried about long term effects at all or invest in a cooler even if I'm not tracking it? Thanks.
Well, now you know -

Since you live in Oregon (where the temperatures don't usually get that hot) and you don't track the car and assuming you don't spend all day running up and down Mt Hood in August, I would think that you wouldn't need an oil cooler.

My take is that, for average driving (some spirited), with a stock engine, one shouldn't get all carried away with all these aftermarket gadgets that measure too damn much stuff and just alarms people.

Think, back in the day, we just had a speedometer/odometer, a gas gauge, a "real" temperature gauge, an amp meter and a "real" oil pressure gauge, and we got along just fine.



(it must be closing in on ma nap time)


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Old 06-12-2019, 12:19 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Trueweltall View Post
I bet you suggest to only use the black tokyo roki filter too or else it will damage your engine.


100-169F Warm Up Phase, high oil pressures
170-189F Near Operating temps, oil pressures still higher
190-225F Normal Operating Range, oil pressures normalize
225-245F Middle End of operating range for track use, 5% drop in oil pressures
245-255F Upper End of operating ranges for track use, 10% further drop in pressures on 0w20
255-265F Red Zone of operating ranges for track zone, 0w20 starts to thin, oil pressures drop to questionable range.
265F+ Playing with fire on 0w20

Keep in mind the data above is oil brand dependent. Different oils breakdown at different temperatures.

Amsoil Signature Series, synthetic *Onset Thermal Breakdown @ 295*
Renewable Lubricants Bio-SynXtra Super High-Performance Motor Oil *Onset Thermal Breakdown @ 275f*
Quaker State Ultimate Durability, synthetic *Onset Thermal Breakdown @ 260f*

NOBODY CARES ABOUT BREAKDOWN TEMPS. It's about pressure, which I literally and clearly stated. If your oil is getting to a temperature where breakdown is occurring, you've already permanently and irreversibly damaged your engine (even if it's not showstopper damage).

As snarky as you're being in your response to me, you'd think you might have spent an iota of your precious time doing a little research on something other than oil company data sheets.
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