Thinking of doing an engine swap? Read here first.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by sdwagonjp

Looks like 16th place to me.

Hasn't been updated from last weekend yet

Jaden

[slicktop]

Also, I'd like to agree with the OP on pricing. There's always a circumstance where something can be done for cheaper. To the guy doing the swap in their garage by themselves or with a few friends helping, you're looking at the price of an additional FRS.

The "issue" always comes up with, "you could have bought X car with that much $$." The end of the day, that's not what these builds, threads, or goals are meant for. It's about building something badass that will bring a smile to your face every time you step on the throttle because you built it and it scares you so much that your balls recede which makes you scream like a little girl.

THAT'S what these builds are about.

[sdwagonjp]

Originally Posted by Jaden

Hasn't been updated from last weekend yet

Jaden

Jaden is a good sport. Its funny how people call others "Internet warriors" I just think people can't take jokes. People who made up that name are probably sitting on the computer wiping their tears from some hurtful comment they thought was mean.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by Manji

Didn't ask for your life story.

FWIW my car isn't being built by a shop. A friend and I are doing the mechanical and misc work.
Another friend who is a better welder than either of us did the mounts, headers, extended the shifter on the box, and the machining of the ls2 t/b I'm using. How much did I pay for that fab work? I paid $900 for the steel, and for the labour I gave him 4 tyres I had that he wanted, a $600 j160 gearbox, and a sparco steering wheel.

I don't actually know what the fuck your problem is. I mentioned multiple times that the major component where savings could be made was my $9k allowance for the electrics. I want it done right, and while I or my mates could give it a go, I've decided to avoid the whole headache and use a place I know will be able to sort it.

Your estimate of $15k even lines up with mine (less my motec allowance)

The key difference is you appear to be one of these guys thatll spend 200 hours doing something and claim its cost you nothing. If that's true, well good on you. I value my time more than nothing. I'm also not prepared to "pull the instruments from a wrecked car and use them" I want it done properly.

Get off your high horse. Fucker.

alright then I apologize...

I was just getting tired of people throwing around the 25K figure when I know that's not necessarily the case and it looked like you were specifically responding to my posts in the 2.8l v8 swap thread..

So again I apologize.

Also, yes I will spend the amount of time it takes to do something I want to do and not count that as labor costs. Yes, time is worth money and if it's doing something where I can't make money when I otherwise could, then I agree, but most of the people who do this couldn't be making money in that time and would just be wasting it doing something else, so I don't think it's fair to count that time as $costs...

Jaden

p.s. let me add that it might be good to instead of cart blanche say it will cost about 25K, then say if you have the extra money and either a)can't do some things yourself or b)don't want to waste your time with the hassle it will cost ~X to have a shop do it for you.

Yes, I realize that you DID say some costs can be cut in the area of electronics (motec) some typically doesn't equate to (9K).

I always specify that the figures I throw around are me doing everything myself.

You have to also remember, I'm in the union of California Socialist Republic and am not allowed to use Motec in my DD.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by sdwagonjp

"I have a wife and two kids and I want to feel better about myself"
post...

I corrected that for you... I didn't create a thread about it...

Just responding...

And you are right, I am a little butt hurt that I can't spend as much on my car as I would like to...

Would I give up my family for that??? Not in a million years.. I am happy where I am...

Jaden

[SomeoneWhoIsntMe]

Just to put it out there, I costed my swap at $23k.
$9k of which is motec/wiring/sensors.

My motor I got for $1500

My box $2500

Clutch and bell $2000

The rest is mounts $600, headers $1500, exhaust $400, driveshaft $800.

Then there's incidentals which I've budgeted as best I can.

Labour I'm paying $3k, and that's mates rates.

1JZ-VVTi front sump - $1400 shipped

Solstice transmission (same as R154 except GM input shaft and output shaft and doesn't need custom fabrication to get the appropriate shifter length for the BRZ) - call it $600

Clutch, comp clutch 1jz steel flywheel is about $300, OEM 1jz r154 bell is $340 shipped, once you figure out the rest of the clutch hydraulics and whatever disc and cover you want to run, I'll be generous and say $1500 all in

Mounts are $300 from Xcessive, although admittedly you'll have to figure out some sort of a trans mount, but I suppose that's the same story as the 1uz+r154.

Being an inline six, particularly one with the exhaust on the passenger side in LHD cars, you don't have to worry about steering shaft clearance at all, so you save $1500 on swap headers. We'll say a downpipe costs $250, and we'll say that the rest of the exhaust costs $400. I think that's an optimistic quote, but oh well. It's your number, not mine. In any case, since there's only one downpipe instead of two headers, the exhaust is simpler and easier to fab, which means cheaper, whatever the actual number ends up being. You can also probably use most of a normal aftermarket exhaust and just have a muffler shop modify the midpipe to meet the 1JZ downpipe.

Driveshaft, I'm surprised you paid $800, I'd expect you would have paid more like $300 unless you wanted something exotic, but whatever. I guess not everyone lives in Detroit where all we have are car-industry-related shops.

So we're at $5250 now, plus those pesky incidentals, plus ECU and wiring. I suppose you'll need a FMIC and charge piping as well. You also need to get a bigger fuel pump, run new lines, and add a return fitting to the bulkhead.

The new AEM Infinity 6h is capable of running a vvti 1jz, and has CAN functionality. We'll budget $3k here for the EMS and wiring. You'll probably have to swap out injectors for universal high impedance ones which is an upgrade anyway, and you can either use the stock sensors, or GM IAT and CLT if you're severely lazy. You might have to buy a MAP sensor, idk if the AEM comes with one. Grainger boost control solenoid. None of this shit is expensive, but it's worth considering. And that's with a relatively baller ECU. You could go with a megasquirt-III if you wanted. Hell, you could go with a stock JZX100 ECU and an SAFC and still make more power than a 1UZ with exhaust.

So really, a ~$10k swap isn't that unreasonable. The biggest things holding us back are

a) It's not clear to me if there's an open, transparent, community based effort to reverse-engineer the CANBUS stuff that most people are going to want to remain functional. A few shops have figured it out thus far it seems, but we need a sticky on the forum of how to get that shit set up in AEM, megasquirt, whatever.

b) People making mountains out of molehills.

[OmarGC]

Okay I to am FED UP with people discouraging people from doing engine swaps. I by NO MEANS make a lot of money however I am a go getter and WILL make shit happen. I'm approaching the end of my 2jz build and have final numbers + or - $300 USD.


* price includes turbo cost

Some notes: help people who need help, you'll get help in return ALWAYS. PRICE SHOP LIKE CRAZY, build good relationships with that person/those vendors you buy from, if you have good friends/fabricators/vendors/etc locally work with them and get their name out there, it'll help out on both ends.

My setup is capable of making WELL over 550whp, I running stock ecu's(both FRS & aristo) with a piggyback. Stand alone & driveshaft shop 1000hp axles are in the works. My cars suspension etc are already pretty much where they need to be for what I do...

Chase your dream builds! If swapping is something you truely desire, go for it. Because a built block turbo frs isnt any cheaper.

[s2d4]

200 hours of my time costs 24k so I can see where he is coming from.
Labour and parts are cheap in the US, totally understandable too.
Comparing motec to hack Setups is weird since no one other than vorshlag has figured out the Canbus stuff, especially from people that hasn't completed the swap themselves.

Nothing is as easy as it seems until they've actually done it so only two people in this thread really knows how much it costs in NZ and America to do it "properly".
I know from experience that a parts list/costs are never the same from start to finish especially for the first attempt.

[OmarGC]

Originally Posted by s2d4

Comparing motec to hack Setups is weird since no one other than vorshlag has figured out the Canbus stuff

How sure are you about that?

[SomeoneWhoIsntMe]

Just because vorschlag figured it out first doesn't mean that other people can't do the same thing and document it. Ever hear of open source tuning?

[s2d4]

Originally Posted by OmarGC

How sure are you about that?

What do you consider as working it out?
Have you completed the swap?
Do you know who else has done it?
How did they do it?

Feel free to contribute so people don't have to pay the knows how, so all they need to do is pay for the items on the shopping list and 200+ hours of their time sourcing parts and putting everything together themselves.

I am all for the sharing of correct info so no need to defend or target me for whatever.

[OmarGC]

Originally Posted by s2d4

What do you consider as working it out?
Have you completed the swap?
Do you know who else has done it?
How did they do it?

Feel free to contribute so people don't have to pay the knows how, so all they need to do is pay for the items on the shopping list and 200+ hours of their time sourcing parts and putting everything together themselves.

I am all for the sharing of correct info so no need to defend or target me for whatever.

What I consider working it out: Starting the car with most oem interior functions and not a "hacked" up harness as you continue implying if not motec or whatever youre continuously praising. My swap is near completion, on hold for holidays/vacation.

I do know someone stateside who is in fact using a chasebays harness w/aem ems and ecutek to disable dtc's and vss/abs related CAN signals. Ran oem gauge/interior functions early on prior to swapping to a stack mfd. Chase bays has at least a pair of 2jz frs FD cars wired up, I'm sure you're not aware of as well considering you stated only xxx figured it out.

@slicktop was it also you that spoke to ekanoo running dual ecu/ecutek/stand alone as well?

[slicktop]

Originally Posted by OmarGC

What I consider working it out: Starting the car with most oem interior functions and not a "hacked" up harness as you continue implying if not motec or whatever youre continuously praising. My swap is near completion, on hold for holidays/vacation.

I do know someone stateside who is in fact using a chasebays harness w/aem ems and ecutek to disable dtc's and vss/abs related CAN signals. Ran oem gauge/interior functions early on prior to swapping to a stack mfd. Chase bays has at least a pair of 2jz frs FD cars wired up, I'm sure you're not aware of as well considering you stated only xxx figured it out.

@slicktop was it also you that spoke to ekanoo running dual ecu/ecutek/stand alone as well?

Yes, I spoke with EK's tuner (Husam Tayib of MC Performance) before it turned into a full drag car.

Originally Posted by E-mail from Husam Tayib

We utlized the stock ECU to provide all the standard functions. We acquired EcuTek to disable all the DTC faults and alter some of the parameters. The trick is to get the Crank, cam, coolant, and air inlet temp reading of bothe the standard and AEM ECUs. I used AEM series 2 to run the engine.

I hope that will help you. Just bare in mind that it is a time consuming process but you will enjoy the results.

[slicktop]

Also, I said it before, Motec and Hydra are the two EMS's available that have CAN support for the factory functions as far as I know. While you may use a tandem setup for other stand-alone systems.

It's worth noting that I only know of three people actively swapping in a JZ motor that are not shop affiliated ( @OmarGC , @SomeoneWhoIsntMe and @slicktop). While there is another ( @Drift&Drag ), he has his race shop working on it. This goes to show you that either you're crazy or have experience. Give it a little while longer before other options are available and this turns into a go-to swap (or not, since it ruins the car, right?)