summer or all-season tires? freezing temps?

[rainmonkey]

Hi,

So I'm looking to upgrade my tires, I've had the dunlop z2, hankook v12 or rs3, or the michelin super sport in mind.

The problem is this: I live in boston where the winters are brutal, I don't care too much about snow traction since I don't commute using this car, but what concerns me is the "these tires are not intended to be driven at near freezing temperatures". We regularly get below freezing level temps here.

What exactly will happen? Any suggestions for all season alternatives? I don't have a garage or any place I can store an extra set of tires so this is my compromise i guess...

Thanks!

[Alan]

The three you have selected besides the V12 are going to be unsuitable for freezing and below. They get so hard they slide very easily. The V12 might be OK for occasional use, but with how cold it gets in Boston, I'd avoid. All summer tires lose a lot of performance below freezing (some at even warmer temperatures). Being that you cannot have two sets (are you sure!?) look for something in the Ultra-High Performance category as opposed to the Extreme or Max Performance categories will be a little bit more tolerant of temparature - but they will still be hard when its cold out.

Really though, I fit four spare tires in the corner of a coat closet when I was in school. You can do it! Get any of the ones you listed above and a set of Blizzak LM22s and you'll be glad you did. Plus, you can drive when there is snow on the ground without worry!

[Khyron686]

Snow has nothing to do with it. If temps are below 7C when you're driving then you should be on winter tires. Summer tires are grippy when hot, but turn to hockey pucks when cold and slide on dry pavement. Winter tires are soft and mushy in the heat but grip in the cold. At the very least get some tolerable cold weather all seasons rather than trying to fudge with summers.

[Huehuecoyotl]

My recommendation is this if you need all season, and handling without breaking the bank

[rainmonkey]

@Alan how in the world did you fit them in a coat closet?? I suppose I could put em in a couple garbage bags and stow em... maybe under my bed hahahaha. but then getting snow tires would also require another set of wheels.... else it'd be troublesome.

I mean given that summer's just around the corner, I suppose I could throw caution to the wind and just get nice summer tires and then cross the bridge when I get there.

Oh, one more thing, arent the OEM tires also summer tires? So shouldn't they behave like the ones I listed earlier under cold temps? I mean I've been using those this past winter and lived...

The Bridgestone you recommended @Huehuecoyotl where'd you find em/what makes you pick em?

Thanks for the info so far, cleared up a lot of questions I had.

[Mitch]

You could get ZIIs and just be super freaking careful during the cold parts of the year. I know I live in the south and have no real concept of what "slick as ice" truly means, but I've driven some goddamn squirrelly tires when I shouldn't have on a car without traction control and survived to post here. End up backwards in a four lane intersection, fool me once. End up backwards in a four lane intersection twice, fool me -- you can't get fooled again. Maybe you have a friend who can store a set of wheels with cold weather tires? Heh, ya think ya fooled me.

[Khyron686]

Originally Posted by rainmonkey

Oh, one more thing, arent the OEM tires also summer tires? So shouldn't they behave like the ones I listed earlier under cold temps? I mean I've been using those this past winter and lived...

If you slid into oncoming traffic and killed someone, you think you'd escape a negligence causing death by running summer tires in the winter? It's no different than someone driving without brakes. I'd wager you'd even have issues being covered by your insurance.

[ZDan]

I've driven on StarSpecs and on RS3s in the colder months up here over the years. It's not all that bad, really, if you're not on snow/ice. Not warmed up at all, the RS3's have noticeably reduced grip in cold/wet conditions. That said, I've tracked my S2000 at Mosport on StarSpec fronts and RS3 rears in 30s/40s temps in the rain and it wasn't the disaster that might be expected.

Between the tires you mentioned, I'd go Pilot Super Sports (have them on my RX-7). I wouldn't go to the Extreme Performance category unless tracking and/or AutoXing is in the cards. Outside of that, there's no compelling reason to give up hydroplaning resistance. And on the street, in normal conditions, the PSS will be the equal of the Extreme Perf tires in the dry, and much better in wet/inundated conditions.

[Alan]

Coat closet - Standing up and pushed against the wall two deep. They were fat 18s from my Dinan 740 too! Made all my coats smell like rubber but that's the sacrifice you make!

As for the stock tires, they are summer tires but they are "Grand Touring" summers. A little more temperature non-depentdent.

I'm not worried about hockey puck tires when I'm driving around being careful - that's workable. I'm worried about it when a soccer mom cuts me off in her minivan and I have to brake hard or steer around. Then, the tire is not up to the situation and we have a problem.

[rainmonkey]

I've scouted around my apartment, and I think I can find space to keep my tires - I'll have to check with my roommate first tho.

Anyway, I'm planning on sticking to 17's since I heard that bigger wheels are detrimental to performance (although they look better) and they also throw off your speedometer. Are my assumptions correct?

Assuming I stick with 17's should i go 8 width? If I do I can upgrade tires now and use em later when I swap out my wheels as well. 7 vs 8...

Ideas? I know I'm asking a lot.

[Alan]

Wheel/tire weight are the major contributors to decreased performance with going to 18s. The stock 17s are not particularly light, so if you make wise choices, the difference in performance are small. 18s will move more wheel weight further from center, but the effect with decent wheel quality is small.

In most street-driven car cases your new wheel and tire setup should not affect speedometer/odometer function. That is because your new tires will be "shorter" (e.g. less sidewall) so the overall diameter of the wheel/tire package is close to the same. Some people say a 5% difference is acceptable. A 3% is probably a better metric. Your wheel/tire dealer can help you chose proper sizes.

8" wide is pretty good compromise between available grip and over-tireing the car for street use. 9" is fine also. I picked up 17x8 and ran a 245-width tire and I think thats a pretty good place to be. If there were more 8.5 width wheels out there, I may have gone that way -- but there are not.

[MVJ1975]

You need winter tires and wheels. The stock Michelins are summer tires and not especially good ones.

You can run steelies in the winter, and then the stock wheels in the summer, or get a decent set of wheels for summer and use the stock wheels for winter. Lots of us do that.

I run Continental DW on 57Xtremes in the summer and Dunlop Winter Sport M3 on the stock wheels in the winter.

[rainmonkey]

Originally Posted by Alan

Wheel/tire weight are the major contributors to decreased performance with going to 18s. The stock 17s are not particularly light, so if you make wise choices, the difference in performance are small. 18s will move more wheel weight further from center, but the effect with decent wheel quality is small.

In most street-driven car cases your new wheel and tire setup should not affect speedometer/odometer function. That is because your new tires will be "shorter" (e.g. less sidewall) so the overall diameter of the wheel/tire package is close to the same. Some people say a 5% difference is acceptable. A 3% is probably a better metric. Your wheel/tire dealer can help you chose proper sizes.

8" wide is pretty good compromise between available grip and over-tireing the car for street use. 9" is fine also. I picked up 17x8 and ran a 245-width tire and I think thats a pretty good place to be. If there were more 8.5 width wheels out there, I may have gone that way -- but there are not.

If I'm reading this correctly, you're basically saying that between 17 and 18, the major difference will just be weight, because total diameter of the wheel+tire is still roughly the same as a 17.

If 8 and 9 are not considered 'over-tire-ing' then what is? I was always under the assumption that anything past 8 was just for looks... even on track. Granted I don't know much about this stuff.

btw, thank you Alan, you're helping a lot.

[bakerr6]

Just fyi you would want skinnier tires for winter. I'm running 16 inch wheels for summer and winter