All-New 2022 Subaru BRZ Makes Global Debut

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Didn't read well then.
It would certainly work.
Would be "easier" than some but far from drop in, plug and play.
It remains to be seen what power can be wrung out of it vs the known current swaps. The investment just may not pay off.
Probably three or even four years away from being able to pick up cheap(ish) used engines anyway so half the people interested will either be in something new or a gen 2 and will no longer care.

I'm sure it is not a drop-in and plug-n-play, but it would be far easier and have lots of benefits.


This platform is like the Miata or Hondas. It will be used for decades for track days and autocross. Engine swaps are a huge part of this platform. I could totally see doing a swap over buying an all new or slightly used 2nd gen down the road.

[AnalogMan]

Originally Posted by gymratter

some more non-PR pics

It's always hard for me to tell from 2-dimensional images. Have to see the car in person. But, yep... more pics and videos confirm my previous impressions. Not bad, not bad at all. But... I personally don't like the exterior styling as much as the first gen car. It's blander. It's a disjointed mix of curves and creases, especially in the profile. I miss the eliminated curves from the front fenders, and the rear still looks like the car backed into something.

Likewise the interior, it's fine, nice upgrades to the switchgear, digital dash is cohesive but doesn't do it for me. But that touchscreen... it looks amateurly glued onto the dash. Like something I did as a teenager.

But... the power and torque of the 2.4 sounds very nice. A test drive will definitely be called for to see if the improved driving experience to my butt offsets the decline in visual appeal to my eyes.

But again... if I'm going to switch cars, the Nissan Z seems more compelling.

[gymratter]

^^^agree, in person is always the best way to judge a car. until then all we have are pics. the issue i have with PR pics is the lighting and all the editing that happens. they try so hard to make it look good that they usually end up with the opposite effect. it just looks too artificial to me.

[wbradley]

I just noticed the taillights are kinda shaped like wings, almost like the original Tribeca grille. Perhaps a nod to Subaru's history as Nakajima aircraft?

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by ZDan

????

The subtle difference are the front fenders aren't arched as much, and this was probably intentionally done because they dropped the nose forward and lower to hid the mustache.


The rear looks to be less blunt, truncated off on the 2nd gen. The effect of the rear bump/trunk slant forward, the front fender air exhaust slant, the lower front fenders/hood slant and more lower and forward nose along with the stretched side profile of the lights, gives the whole vehicle a more forward leaning posture. I'm not saying it is a bad thing. Overall, I think the design is good enough. It is more modern, so it is an improvement in that regard, which makes the old model look older, but the old model is postured better, for sure. I see what others are saying. I just don't have as much of a gripe about those changes.

[BFIFE22]

Anyone find any posts where the car is photoshopped in a bunch of different colors?

[Sasquachulator]

Originally Posted by gymratter

some more non-PR pics

I think i know why it looks...wierd sometimes.
-I dont like that black plastic surrounds on the front fascia where the vents are, i think theres too much of it.
-The lower rocker panel detail where it kind of sticks out and sweeps upwards...that doesnt appear to be designed very well, it doesnt seem to fit the lines at all.
-The RCF style vent seems to be a little too low compared to the real rcf (makes it look a little odd to me, like its in the "wrong spot") and the way it blends into the front wheel well makes it look super tacked on.

[DuMa]

i like how all former and current owners of the 1st gen are giving their opinions on this new car. It seems like we are still the only ones that understand this new gen and why its not turbo

[Dzmitry]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

Torque went from 150tq, or 156tq for the refresh, to 186tq, which is an increase of 24% or 19%. Torque is a factor of displacement and compression, which is why the torque numbers look so good, but horsepower is a factor of torque delivery at a particular rpm, so if they lose some torque up high then the peak horsepower number will look less impressive. Why not evaluate the torque dip for a peak horsepower gain? I'm sure if someone superimposed the new graph on top of the old graph, there would be much more area under the curve. In fact, the peak torque gain is probably more than the 30tq difference there. Considering the 1st gen lost 15-20tq in the dip, this 2nd gen may gain 40+tq, if it has a smaller dip, which means horsepower gain down low may be significant. Again, the area under the curve and the shape of the curve is much better. Torque comes on sooner, is more steady and is greater across the entire rev range. I'm sure the highest horsepower gain is closer to 20% or greater, even if the gain of peak horsepower is only 11%.

I suppose the question is how fast does this more rev up and how will this motor respond to mods. I'm sure E85 will liven it up even more because of the higher compression, and I wouldn't be surprise if the motor has more potential. I'm sure Subaru is holding back a little for a gen2 refresh down the road. If the reciprocating masses are terribly heavier because of the larger bore then it show rev well because of the same stroke.

Old:



New:

Here's a good rough estimate after hours of "accurate" work.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I'm sure it is not a drop-in and plug-n-play, but it would be far easier and have lots of benefits.


This platform is like the Miata or Hondas. It will be used for decades for track days and autocross. Engine swaps are a huge part of this platform. I could totally see doing a swap over buying an all new or slightly used 2nd gen down the road.

A lot will depend on how much more power people can pull out of it. That is still a total unknown.
Many of the popular swaps are now kitted, available ready to go with a potential for far more than you will get out of the 24.
Little point in doing a swap if you can reach similar goals by modding the existing engine.
You can compare it to people that thought the other Subaru engines from WRX and STI would just pop in. The reality was that there was maybe one that every actually made it work.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Dzmitry

Here's a good rough estimate after hours of "accurate" work.

Back to the drawing board. You are comparing one actual dyno reading of the old against the factory theoretical of the new. This is not apples to apples.
You need to either compare both factory numbers or two actual dynos from the same machine, on the same day, under the same condition.


There will obviously still be a gap but not nearly as severe as that looks.

[Sasquachulator]

Apples to apples (in car 2022 vs in car 2017+)

[Dzmitry]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Back to the drawing board. You are comparing one actual dyno reading of the old against the factory theoretical of the new. This is not apples to apples.
You need to either compare both factory numbers or two actual dynos from the same machine, on the same day, under the same condition.


There will obviously still be a gap but not nearly as severe as that looks.

No. All I did was take the curve of the new BRZ and put it up against a curve of the old BRZ. I am not shooting for apples to apples here, just a general idea. I used the peak power numbers of each car and plotted it as so. The accuracy of the curves is all that can change, but nothing drastically. If Subaru is showing a fairly accurate power curve on their 2022 BRZ cluster, then it shouldn't be very far fetched. Don't forget peak torque is 184 at 3700 RPM. Peak torque is 156 at 6700 on the 2017+ BRZ. At the lowest part of the dip, it is about 135 lb-ft. This lowest region is right around the same region that the new one peaks at. That is about 50 lb-ft of torque difference. Again, this is very generalized and not super accurate; but it's just a rough estimate, and should be a pretty good one.

Again, in case I am not making myself clear, I am not comparing dyno's. I am just comparing one general curve to the other and overlaying them based on their peak numbers. Keep in mind, too, the gap only looks so severe because of how stretched the graph is. I could have stretched it much less, and the gap would be much smaller. I just wanted to stretch it to better see specific values.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

A lot will depend on how much more power people can pull out of it. That is still a total unknown.
Many of the popular swaps are now kitted, available ready to go with a potential for far more than you will get out of the 24.
Little point in doing a swap if you can reach similar goals by modding the existing engine.
You can compare it to people that thought the other Subaru engines from WRX and STI would just pop in. The reality was that there was maybe one that every actually made it work.

Well, like I said in another post, if the internals are strengthened to match the displacement then potential will likely go from the 350hp to 400hp and maybe higher. If the transmission is slightly stronger then the combination of the extra strength, extra potential on stock internals and extra performance from more low end torque and faster turbo spooling means this swap could be cheaper and better than paying for a built motor. For gen 2 owners, this means hitting a horsepower figure that is very respectable, approaching the limits of traction for many gears and reduces the substantial cost that comes from wanting to break the 350-400whp ceiling. For gen 1 owners who blew a motor or want to swap over building a motor, this should be an attractive option.