PLM Long Tube Header

[Cross]

Originally Posted by bur****jp

I'm going to pistol-whip the next guy who compares to some ancient american V8. You're dealing with a completely different market.
Was that a pair of 4-1 manifolds? So 2 merges? If we want a 4-2-1 manifold it takes 3 merges. We're having to snake around quite a few things, and bends cost money.
We're also looking at ordering material for a single manifold, rather than a bunch of material for a bunch of manifolds.

Ancient? Those Ancients are the tech most swapped in everything, but don't let that get in your way...

Just a 4 -1 huh? The primaries are bigger, the material longer and required for both sides so bigger product at double the requirement. So more material, bigger material, longer runs, twice the product but it's an unfair comparison.....

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

LOL

90+% of gains when swapping out headers is due to the removal of the catalytic converter.
Why? Because it is about freeing up exhaust flow.
Sure another 10% could possibly be had by the absolute best pipe design but in the end on this tiny little engine its not worth more than a few WHP.

Headers are f_cking pipes underneath your car. After a few 1000 miles even the most expensive headers are not gonna look showroom quality.

Get off the kool-aid its killing your brain cells.

That's the worst (and most incorrect) over simplification I've seen on here. If you honestly think primary/secondary diameter and length don't matter you should just give up talking about this kind of stuff.

Peak hp doesn't matter except to someone bragging about dyno numbers, area under the curve makes a car fast, and maximizing that takes A LOT more than just removing the cat from the stock manifold.

Design also plays a huge part. 4-2-1 headers make better midrange but give up a bit of top end, 4-1 will have better top end but fall short in the midrange. What matters more depends on how/where you're driving it.

[jaf89f]

Well this thread got out of hand quickly. I hope the OP is still a forum member after this haha.

Anyways, like many others have said in here before, this header is likely not drawing any sales away from Nameless. So, what is the real issue? You're not going to rid the world of replicas by posting in this forum. Replicas are going to exist. Just ignore it and buy the top grade, original parts, and let the lower budget individuals (like myself) purchase everything else. No need to think lower of people who want to maximize their dollar.

IMO, all the replica haters must be really angry/stressed/unhappy/::insert adjective here:: people if replicas make them this annoyed.

@Dimman Question. Are you blasting people everyday in the cosmetic threads (i.e. wheels, lip kits, etc.) for buying replicas too?

[Kotu100]

What the hell happened in here.....
@Cross did you end up installing? Im curious as to how this compares to the tomei EL since its in the same price range.


Now before i get attacked by some of these self rightous name brand nut swingers, i buy "knock off" and authentic parts. I weigh the pros and cons of each and make a decision based on my wants and needs. MY wants and MY needs.

[Cross]

Originally Posted by Kotu100

What the hell happened in here.....
@Cross did you end up installing? Im curious as to how this compares to the tomei EL since its in the same price range.


Now before i get attacked by some of these self rightous name brand nut swingers, i buy "knock off" and authentic parts. I weigh the pros and cons of each and make a decision based on my wants and needs. MY wants and MY needs.

Not yet I have been putting the car back together but I will have it installed by this weekend. The catch is I need to make a 3" Overpipe as my 2.5" we made will not fit correctly so I will have to change that which will happen Monday morning.

Then I will take it on a 200+ Mile round trip to Phoenix that same day so I should be able to give a good review on it.

[Kotu100]

Originally Posted by Cross

Not yet I have been putting the car back together but I will have it installed by this weekend. The catch is I need to make a 3" Overpipe as my 2.5" we made will not fit correctly so I will have to change that which will happen Monday morning.

Then I will take it on a 200+ Mile round trip to Phoenix that same day so I should be able to give a good review on it.

Sound like a plan! Hopefully everything goes smooth and I look forward to reading your thoughts on it.

[ichewyou]

I don't just buy knock-off, I eat knock-off too,

God the chinese food here suck.

[interna]

Originally Posted by Cross

Not yet I have been putting the car back together but I will have it installed by this weekend. The catch is I need to make a 3" Overpipe as my 2.5" we made will not fit correctly so I will have to change that which will happen Monday morning.

Then I will take it on a 200+ Mile round trip to Phoenix that same day so I should be able to give a good review on it.

I was curious about this actually. Im probably ordering the header today and most likely going to source a nameless 3" over/front pipe.

Let me know how the install goes and what results you are looking at.

[churchx]

I wonder why argument of not hurting original vendor/product by copies doesn't work for software, and even results in legal actions/sanctions/police raids/server confiscations but it's suddenly OK in other areas?
As for my own view regarding this particular theme and car headers, my conscience find it acceptable to reuse ideas in other products (in header context - longer runners, specific 4-2-1 or 4-1 collectors, EL or UEL to get wished characteristics, lengthening runners by incorporating overpipe's length, revolving firing order, some creative ways to bend tubes to get better fit, heatshealding ways, but still make original product based on them, so that some parts of evolution/innovation isn't kept back & tied to single vendor only, with others not being able to make better product only because someone did it first. And that someone often being unable to satisfy market niche just by himself and that someone sometimes not being able to incorporate for very same reasons innovative bits/ideas originated first for others. In analogy with software world very often innovation/progress is frozen due software patents, so users end up buying subpar products with limited functionality or some opensource projects being shutdown by legal action. But! Doing clearly seen 1:1 replicas (think like as actually sold for half price pirated software DVDs, not coding inhause some similar product) certainly is NOT reusing good generic ideas, just piggyback on R&D efforts and good fame of others. It's not even copying some very basic shapes of some other headers tubing, but copied very specific shapes/sizes and everything of only one such looking Nameless header. Only thing that may differ and not yet proven by purchasers of these, their manufacturing quality.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by jaf89f

Well this thread got out of hand quickly. I hope the OP is still a forum member after this haha.

Anyways, like many others have said in here before, this header is likely not drawing any sales away from Nameless. So, what is the real issue? You're not going to rid the world of replicas by posting in this forum. Replicas are going to exist. Just ignore it and buy the top grade, original parts, and let the lower budget individuals (like myself) purchase everything else. No need to think lower of people who want to maximize their dollar.

IMO, all the replica haters must be really angry/stressed/unhappy/::insert adjective here:: people if replicas make them this annoyed.

@Dimman Question. Are you blasting people everyday in the cosmetic threads (i.e. wheels, lip kits, etc.) for buying replicas too?

I will not deny having my moments there as well.

I'm well aware I can come across as a **** about this. But I am the kind of guy that goes out of my way to buy original things, locally made things, domestically made things, things made in countries that innovate and respect their workers, etc... And it's fucking hard. But in the long run it fucking matters. I don't want to be forced into a selection of commodity-priced shit because people fuck over the people who take risks to move industries and communities forward all over a small short term savings.

[flippy]

I don't see the resemblance at all.

[fika84]

This might be the wrong place for this, but anyone know where I can get a JDL knock-off???
@JDLAutoDesign (I kid of course... still saving my pennies)

[Cole]

Originally Posted by Dimman

I will not deny having my moments there as well.

I'm well aware I can come across as a **** about this. But I am the kind of guy that goes out of my way to buy original things, locally made things, domestically made things, things made in countries that innovate and respect their workers, etc... And it's fucking hard. But in the long run it fucking matters. I don't want to be forced into a selection of commodity-priced shit because people fuck over the people who take risks to move industries and communities forward all over a small short term savings.

Says the guy who bought a Japanese car lmao. At least if you bought a corolla, they're made in North America.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Cole

Says the guy who bought a Japanese car lmao. At least if you bought a corolla, they're made in North America.

I didn't realize that Japan was a country with horrible labour standards and quality.

My bad.