Jay Leno Reviews the Scion FR-S

[Natheria]

I'm not really surprised Jay was so bored looking considering who he had to share screen time with. The whole thing reminded me way too much of the dealer salesmen who knows nothing about the car they're trying to sell you other than what's in the pamphlet handout and once you ask them anything more in depth about the car they get deer-in-headlight-face syndrome. Jay obviously seemed to be more 'in tune' about the car and the heritage than Hollis.

When you bring someone on to a show/video like this with a host/guest scene the guest is supposed to more about the topic at hand, not the other way around. I'm not saying Hollis is a bad guy but they should have picked someone else for this. I still enjoyed it though to hear some of Jay's thoughts. The fact that he loved the classic styling a lot and that he thinks Toyota is going in the right direction with this car are pretty cool words to hear from a man with his kind of garage, even if he did get paid to say it.

[Jordo!]

That Scion guy was a complete meathead.

If they were going to send someone over to make insipid commentary and have little actual knowledge about the car, they could have at least sent over a hot model (I'm sure Jay would have preferred that too).

It's the same review as always: Looks good, handles well, could use more grunt.

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

That's not going to work with more upscale sports cars (compared to the FR-S), if they decide to make them. I don't know how well a 370Z rival from Toyota would be received if it were badged as a Scion starting north of $30k.

Why not?

This is already the most expensive Scion offered. What's another 5-7 grand if the car is worth it?

Also, this is the same rationale for the "Subaru can't release a non AWD car! It goes against the brand!" argument, and here we are...

If they build a proper 370Z competitor it will sell. All they need to do is badge it "Supra."

I'll happily buy a Scion Supra. I'm sure a lot of folks will.

[Godzilla35]

Hahahaha.... this video was all sorts of awkward, was it not?


and for the ending... no burnout because it's not a muscle car...?
tell that to this dude [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUNywnlZ5d0"]DTA SCION FR-S DOING HER FIRST BURNOUT - YouTube[/ame]

... you didn't push the magical buttons jay!

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Why not?

This is already the most expensive Scion offered. What's another 5-7 grand if the car is worth it?

For the same reason Toyota created Lexus and Scion. Certain brands of theirs are to be for vehicles targeted at certain markets and demographics. Do you think that the original Lexus LS introduced 20+ years ago would've been as successful if it were badged as a Toyota? Obviously the emblem doesn't make a car better or worse than if it were exactly the same but with a different emblem, but Toyota will need to figure out their branding and marketing strategy for future American-bound Toyota vehicles, especially when they have already created a number of brands here.

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Also, this is the same rationale for the "Subaru can't release a non AWD car! It goes against the brand!" argument, and here we are...

Not exactly, because Subaru has manufactured a number of cars that aren't AWD, and has cars currently in production that aren't AWD aside from the BRZ outside of the U.S. market. So that rationale is really only pushed by so-called enthusiasts unaware of Subaru's history before they launched the WRX and got popular.

Originally Posted by Jordo!

If they build a proper 370Z competitor it will sell. All they need to do is badge it "Supra."

I'm not saying that it won't sell, I was just saying that it may not be as well-received with a Scion badge, though like I said earlier, the badge won't make the car better or worse, but marketing is still a huge factor that needs to be considered regardless.

For example, when the GT-R was first launched here, despite its performance, how many consumers of the targeted demographic (meaning that people who can actually afford the car, not internet armchair enthusiasts or pimple-faced kids who still live at home with mommy and daddy) had something to say about it still being a Nissan? A lot of people scoffed at the idea of a $70,000 Nissan (and still do), while the car today is already within arm's reach of being a $100,000 Nissan. Luckily for them it worked out, but don't think that there weren't endless nights of contemplating whether they wanted to stay true to the GT-R's heritage and badge it as a Nissan or if they wanted to badge it as an Infiniti to more easily break such a high price tag (relative to anything else in Nissan's U.S. lineup) to their potential buyers stateside who are likely also considering a Porsche 911. Or how about the Aston-Martin Cygnet, basically a far more luxurious variant of the Toyota/Scion iQ? Do you think that if it were exactly the same but with the Toyota/Scion badge instead but the same price roughly triple that of a standard iQ, that people would still have bought it? I'm not so sure.

Originally Posted by Jordo!

I'll happily buy a Scion Supra. I'm sure a lot of folks will.

But at what price point? That's the kicker. I don't mind a Scion sports car, but if they're more than double the price of your average Scion, then it negates the purpose of having that brand in the first place, which was intended to attract to Gen-Y consumers with appealing cars (sometimes quirky, as in the original xA and xB) that were affordable and easy to buy in order to introduce them to the overall Toyota brand and eventually keep them onboard through brand loyalty for the long-term when their wants and needs change as they grow older, such as having a bigger family (and possibly upgrading to a larger Toyota sedan or truck/SUV) or if they start making good money and have a lot of disposable income (and possibly upgrading to a more upscale Lexus).

I'm not ruling it out, but it's a tad early to put out something like a Scion Supra, especially when the Supra is a recognizable nameplate within the automotive enthusiast crowd, while Scion certainly isn't there yet (though the FR-S is big first step in that direction). There is a certain level of respect that you have to give not only to the nameplate but also to those consumers who actually owned the car who will likely at least consider it again, when (and if) offered. It's for similar reasons why the top-dog Mustang will always be a V-8 (or at least will be for a while) rather than using a twin-turbo V-6. Everyone on this forum, even the youngest of noobs, can probably point out the benefits of going with a twin-turbo V-6, but again, we're not the targeted market of the car, nor have we been the ones to buy countless Mustangs over and over throughout the past several decades. They need to make those people happy first.

[Ess Vee]

Originally Posted by Godzilla35

Hahahaha.... this video was all sorts of awkward, was it not?


and for the ending... no burnout because it's not a muscle car...?
tell that to this dude

... you didn't push the magical buttons jay!

Am I the only one that found it ironic that right after "DON'T TRUST ANYONE", the camera man proceeds to almost get wiped out by that 180? I dunno... but that right there requires QUITE a bit of trust

[bimmerboy]

I think this clip would have gone MUCH better without Jack Hollis. Always love to hear from Jay Leno as he is a true automotive enthusiast... Considering the types of cars he has driven, I would say he had a pretty positive experience.

[Rabble]

By the way, the most interesting part of this whole clip is when Jay asks if there is a stripper version available and Jack responds that they have a few special orders in already but he can't really talk about them.

Sounds like they are already preparing for the release series.

[_hollywood]

No

Probably for some american racing series, or pro drifters...

The last stripper car sold in the states was the ITR

I can guarantee we wont be able to buy a stripper model as a regular consumer

[Rabble]

I wasnt talking about a release series like special colors and options, not a stripper version.

Why would they need Toyota to make a specialty race car? Didn't they build out their drift car themselves?

[subatoy]

what a FUCKING useless review!

[Mr. Mcoupe]

LOL!!! Funny posts here!

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

For the same reason Toyota created Lexus and Scion. Certain brands of theirs are to be for vehicles targeted at certain markets and demographics. Do you think that the original Lexus LS introduced 20+ years ago would've been as successful if it were badged as a Toyota? Obviously the emblem doesn't make a car better or worse than if it were exactly the same but with a different emblem, but Toyota will need to figure out their branding and marketing strategy for future American-bound Toyota vehicles, especially when they have already created a number of brands here.

It's all relative -- we're already in the 30K ball park with this car... also, see further the GT-R, which you also noted.

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

Not exactly, because Subaru has manufactured a number of cars that aren't AWD, and has cars currently in production that aren't AWD aside from the BRZ outside of the U.S. market. So that rationale is really only pushed by so-called enthusiasts unaware of Subaru's history before they launched the WRX and got popular.

My point is, it's the same rationale as going by any popular conception of what a brand "means". It doesn't mean anything. It means whatever the manufacturer decides it will mean and what the market will consider buying. Consider Toyota's up and down history with sports cars vs. people movers. Nothing is set in stone.

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

I'm not saying that it won't sell, I was just saying that it may not be as well-received with a Scion badge, though like I said earlier, the badge won't make the car better or worse, but marketing is still a huge factor that needs to be considered regardless.

I never said it wouldn't be considered -- just that I wouldn't rule it out a priori.

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

For example, when the GT-R was first launched here, despite its performance, how many consumers of the targeted demographic (meaning that people who can actually afford the car, not internet armchair enthusiasts or pimple-faced kids who still live at home with mommy and daddy) had something to say about it still being a Nissan? A lot of people scoffed at the idea of a $70,000 Nissan (and still do), while the car today is already within arm's reach of being a $100,000 Nissan. Luckily for them it worked out, but don't think that there weren't endless nights of contemplating whether they wanted to stay true to the GT-R's heritage and badge it as a Nissan or if they wanted to badge it as an Infiniti to more easily break such a high price tag (relative to anything else in Nissan's U.S. lineup) to their potential buyers stateside who are likely also considering a Porsche 911. Or how about the Aston-Martin Cygnet, basically a far more luxurious variant of the Toyota/Scion iQ? Do you think that if it were exactly the same but with the Toyota/Scion badge instead but the same price roughly triple that of a standard iQ, that people would still have bought it? I'm not so sure.

Honestly, all this sub-brand nonsense is an irrelevant American thing. The bottom line is it would be made by Toyota (an actual company that manufactures things) and then they would have to decide what "label" Americans would find most palatable. Sports cars seems to be the Scion thing at the moment, but if they resuscitate the Supra badge, they might just keep it as a Toyota anyway.

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

But at what price point? That's the kicker. I don't mind a Scion sports car, but if they're more than double the price of your average Scion, then it negates the purpose of having that brand in the first place, which was intended to attract to Gen-Y consumers with appealing cars (sometimes quirky, as in the original xA and xB) that were affordable and easy to buy in order to introduce them to the overall Toyota brand and eventually keep them onboard through brand loyalty for the long-term when their wants and needs change as they grow older, such as having a bigger family (and possibly upgrading to a larger Toyota sedan or truck/SUV) or if they start making good money and have a lot of disposable income (and possibly upgrading to a more upscale Lexus).

I'm not ruling it out, but it's a tad early to put out something like a Scion Supra, especially when the Supra is a recognizable nameplate within the automotive enthusiast crowd, while Scion certainly isn't there yet (though the FR-S is big first step in that direction). There is a certain level of respect that you have to give not only to the nameplate but also to those consumers who actually owned the car who will likely at least consider it again, when (and if) offered. It's for similar reasons why the top-dog Mustang will always be a V-8 (or at least will be for a while) rather than using a twin-turbo V-6. Everyone on this forum, even the youngest of noobs, can probably point out the benefits of going with a twin-turbo V-6, but again, we're not the targeted market of the car, nor have we been the ones to buy countless Mustangs over and over throughout the past several decades. They need to make those people happy first.

Again, I don't know how much it matters -- if Toyota's advertising geniuses decide that Scion = "edgy, fun, youthful", Toyota = "reliable, dependable, but staid" and Lexus = "Luxurious", it will probably go to Scion.

Scion's (stupid, invented) brand name is supposed to mean "fun and youthful", not "cheap", but all this stuff can get reinvented on the fly anyway. It has no fixed shape.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

It's all relative -- we're already in the 30K ball park with this car... also, see further the GT-R, which you also noted.



My point is, it's the same rationale as going by any popular conception of what a brand "means". It doesn't mean anything. It means whatever the manufacturer decides it will mean and what the market will consider buying. Consider Toyota's up and down history with sports cars vs. people movers. Nothing is set in stone.



I never said it wouldn't be considered -- just that I wouldn't rule it out a priori.


Honestly, all this sub-brand nonsense is an irrelevant American thing. The bottom line is it would be made by Toyota (an actual company that manufactures things) and then they would have to decide what "label" Americans would find most palatable. Sports cars seems to be the Scion thing at the moment, but if they resuscitate the Supra badge, they might just keep it as a Toyota anyway.



Again, I don't know how much it matters -- if Toyota's advertising geniuses decide that Scion = "edgy, fun, youthful", Toyota = "reliable, dependable, but staid" and Lexus = "Luxurious", it will probably go to Scion.

Scion's (stupid, invented) brand name is supposed to mean "fun and youthful", not "cheap", but all this stuff can get reinvented on the fly anyway. It has no fixed shape.

Couple points where you're off. Principally the brand thing being American. Not even close. First look at VAG's branding hierarchy in Europe where they sell a shit-ton of VWs branded as SEATs and Skodas. Secondly Toyota's branding success with Lexus took it all the way back to Japan where they should know better. Plus the fact that strippers will take it as a stage name is of critical importance, too.

As for Scion, it's a real word. Means descendant or protege or something. Lexus is the fake word.