Loss of Power Steering - 2013 Scion FRS Series 10

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by YankBoffin

Oh, man. Talk about first date nightmare scenario for the kid!

Anyway, at the dealer as the steering was still out when I started it up this morning. Not looking forward to the diagnosis, but if I have to drive it in this condition I'll have forearms like Popeye in short time, and that's just not a good look for me.

Well, I hope they can fix the problem.

If it were my car, and they couldn't isolate the problem, I'd have them replace the power steering motor and all associated wires and connectors.


humfrz

[YankBoffin]

Well, supposedly the issue is resolved. I arrived at the dealer with the power steering not functional to be sure that the techs could observe it (left the car running). They did observe it, and observed it several more times on a test drive around the lot. Pulled a code C1513, which they said is a control module failure. From there, they disconnected the steering module harness, reconnected it, and could not get the fault to reappear.

In total, they had the car for a about an hour and a half and charged me $80 for the diagnostics time. Oh well. Kicking myself for not getting into the dash myself and checking for loose connections, but I've been busy, and my driveway is a cold place to hang out at the moment.

Could have been worse. A new steering module would have been $629.

So, for anyone else experiencing this and comes across this thread: if you're handy, you might try poking around under the dash, looking for loose wire harness connections in the vicinity of the steering column. Might save yourself $80.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by YankBoffin

Well, supposedly the issue is resolved. I arrived at the dealer with the power steering not functional to be sure that the techs could observe it (left the car running). They did observe it, and observed it several more times on a test drive around the lot. Pulled a code C1513, which they said is a control module failure. From there, they disconnected the steering module harness, reconnected it, and could not get the fault to reappear.

In total, they had the car for a about an hour and a half and charged me $80 for the diagnostics time. Oh well. Kicking myself for not getting into the dash myself and checking for loose connections, but I've been busy, and my driveway is a cold place to hang out at the moment.

Could have been worse. A new steering module would have been $629.

So, for anyone else experiencing this and comes across this thread: if you're handy, you might try poking around under the dash, looking for loose wire harness connections in the vicinity of the steering column. Might save yourself $80.

As long as it doesn't just come back again. I am always a bit doubtful of "it was a loose wire". Why was the wire loose? A loose connection can be a symptom but not necessarily the root cause.

[Overdrive]

Agreed. If it shows up again then it could very well be the module being intermittent and needing replacement. Sure, the part isn't cheap, but I think what's likely to work out to less than a grand in parts and labor is worth the peace of mind that the power steering won't cut out in a situation that would affect the driver's control and make an accident possible. If it's not an enormous job, you could also DIY and only have the part cost to bear.

[E_br4ke]

Originally Posted by YankBoffin

Well, supposedly the issue is resolved. I arrived at the dealer with the power steering not functional to be sure that the techs could observe it (left the car running). They did observe it, and observed it several more times on a test drive around the lot. Pulled a code C1513, which they said is a control module failure. From there, they disconnected the steering module harness, reconnected it, and could not get the fault to reappear.

In total, they had the car for a about an hour and a half and charged me $80 for the diagnostics time. Oh well. Kicking myself for not getting into the dash myself and checking for loose connections, but I've been busy, and my driveway is a cold place to hang out at the moment.

Could have been worse. A new steering module would have been $629.

So, for anyone else experiencing this and comes across this thread: if you're handy, you might try poking around under the dash, looking for loose wire harness connections in the vicinity of the steering column. Might save yourself $80.

The power steering warning popped up today. I did not experience any power steering loss. I came home and parked it but there was a burn smell.
Was there a burn smell?

Will check the fuse box tomorrow but will need to drive it to closest dealership. Do you have a pic of the loose connector?

In searching I did notice the recalls in Australia. Will need to read in more detail.


Update:
Turns out its the brake light switch that went out. Got the ABS and traction control lights on when I drive.
Replacing the switch should fix it.

[pkat696]

This just happened to me twice today. I have a 2013 FR-S 10 Series with about 58,000 miles on it. We bought it last month and have only put a few hundred miles on it. It appears to be stock, but we were under it the other day and notice holes on the bottom of the front air dam indicating that something had been attached with screws, so who knows what was done to it before it was returned to stock.

I hope someone finds a resolution to this as our car is out of warranty and I would rather buy an exhaust system than fix the power steering.

I will poke around under the dash and look for loose connectors, but a picture would be helpful.

Thanks!!

[sato]

Since losing "steering" is a safety issue, should we contact or file a report with the NTSB?

[pkat696]

It's been a few days and no re-occurrence. The only thing I did after the two incidents were to look at the fuse under the hood (which looked fine) and looked under the dash for loose connections. I did jiggle all of the harnesses I could reach.

I had noticed previously that there was some build of that white stuff around the battery terminals, so the next day we thoroughly cleaned the battery and terminals. I'm not sure if that helped the situation or not, but I'm sure it didn't hurt.

Thanks to anyone who can provide a solution. This car will eventually go to my sons, and having a root cause would give me some piece of mind that they will be safe.

Thanks!!

[steve99]

In Australia we got recall on power steering.
Mines been in got new powersteering control electronics and harness


https://www.torquenews.com/1084/suba...eering-failure

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by steve99

In Australia we got recall on power steering.
Mines been in got new powersteering control electronics and harness


https://www.torquenews.com/1084/suba...eering-failure

That recall was due to interference with the wiring from an knee airbag that we do not have in North America. It is impossible to happen here.

[steve99]

True


however it appears all the units will accumulate the "debris" then its possible if the debris is disturbed by other means, ie someone poking around in that area or rough road minor impact, could dislodge that debris and have same effect ??


Q1: What is the condition?
A1: The subject vehicles are equipped with electric power steering (EPS).
During normal driving operation, the EPS rotation angle sensor terminals may wear over time. This wear of the connector terminal plating accumulates in debris which may oxidise and become non-conductive.
Under this condition if the driver’s knee contacts the knee airbag lower cover, the EPS wire harness routed behind the cover also moves significantly which allows the terminal to contact the debris resulting in electrical contact failure.
In this condition, the EPS ECU turns on the warning light and the steering assist is interrupted whilst manual steering is maintained.
The loss of power steering assist will increase the steering effort at low speeds which may increase the risk of an accident.



You guys might not get the recall, but it may be possible for the same fault to develop, given a different set of circumstances ?

http://www.toyota.com.au/news/toyota...to-be-recalled

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by steve99

True


however it appears all the units will accumulate the "debris" then its possible if the debris is disturbed by other means, ie someone poking around in that area or rough road minor impact, could dislodge that debris and have same effect ??


Q1: What is the condition?
A1: The subject vehicles are equipped with electric power steering (EPS).
During normal driving operation, the EPS rotation angle sensor terminals may wear over time. This wear of the connector terminal plating accumulates in debris which may oxidise and become non-conductive.
Under this condition if the driver’s knee contacts the knee airbag lower cover, the EPS wire harness routed behind the cover also moves significantly which allows the terminal to contact the debris resulting in electrical contact failure.
In this condition, the EPS ECU turns on the warning light and the steering assist is interrupted whilst manual steering is maintained.
The loss of power steering assist will increase the steering effort at low speeds which may increase the risk of an accident.



You guys might not get the recall, but it may be possible for the same fault to develop, given a different set of circumstances ?

http://www.toyota.com.au/news/toyota...to-be-recalled

Possible maybe but so unlikely that it is immeasurable. The situation you had took a perfect storm of circumstances for it to occur. Remove any of those conditions and the probability drops huge. We have no airbag nor cover and the wiring is routed completely different. No doubt they checked to make sure that this was the only model that it was probable on. Toyota Australia seems to be pretty tight with the TSB info so it would be interesting to see what their fix was.

[pkat696]

I guess I jinxed myself. It happened twice during one trip yesterday after writing that it had not re-occurred. I had been driving for about 15 minutes in stop-and-go traffic on the freeway, and as I exited, I lost power steering for about a second. I felt it in the steering wheel, looked down and saw the indicator on the dash come on, and then it shut off, and I got power steering back. About 2 minutes later, I lost power steering again. I had to stop for a traffic signal, so I shut the engine off and re-started, and I got power steering back again.

Does anyone have a solution for this? Do I need to replace something just to be on the safe side? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Peter

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by pkat696

I guess I jinxed myself. It happened twice during one trip yesterday after writing that it had not re-occurred. I had been driving for about 15 minutes in stop-and-go traffic on the freeway, and as I exited, I lost power steering for about a second. I felt it in the steering wheel, looked down and saw the indicator on the dash come on, and then it shut off, and I got power steering back. About 2 minutes later, I lost power steering again. I had to stop for a traffic signal, so I shut the engine off and re-started, and I got power steering back again.

Does anyone have a solution for this? Do I need to replace something just to be on the safe side? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Peter

I think this is a job for the dealer. Power steering issues are very very rare on here so there isn't really a good info base to work with.