Questions and Discussion on Vortech Supercharging Systems

[Visconti]

Originally Posted by charged86

So I miss understood or made that up

Certainly don't think you made it up just a misunderstanding.

John

[Darryljr11]

Originally Posted by RedAlert

You 216whp -> 266whp +50whp
Me 217whp -> 263whp +46whp
Very close
Ambient temps in your favor.

Might have to play catch up with @v1ru5 now. He's going +1 and FF kit.

For me this isnt a who has the biggest balls competition (thats not directed at you). Im happy with my cars current power and i dont plan on using corn juice or wmi to get more power. I may get upgraded pump once a good one comes out and injectors to get more power on 93 but ill let others be the guinea pigs for me lol.

[sw20kosh]

From Dynojet 93 octane innovate base tunes. As you can see there is more potential in the tune for that innovate car being compared. That is all.

[Visconti]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

From Dynojet 93 octane innovate base tunes. Lots more potential in the tune.

I can post up a real Dyno graph comparing the two if you want... But then again it's a vortech thread lol

[swift996]

I'm very impressed with the power the vortechs are making these days.

[Brian@Vortech]

Do I go into Innovate threads and post Vortech dynos? What kind of thread jack is this anyway???

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by Brian@Vortech

Do I go into Innovate threads and post Vortech dynos? What kind of thread jack is this anyway???

Have absolutely nothing against the vortech kit.

A comparison was made by a tuner which showed a very low innovate curve overlayed onto a vortech curve. This comparison was made in your thread. There were questions as to why the innovate curve looked so crappy. I was just easing these concerns.

/end thread jack

[Dezoris]

@nelsmar

Has invited me to a large dyno day in Phoenix. They are flying down FA20Club (Tony) to dyno and tune 12 cars. In that group will be Innovate and Vortech owners. Same tuner, same dyno should help answer plenty of questions.

I will be doing interviews, tech, and side by side comparisons and of course showing some obvious differences between the two kits.

Maybe settle this debate? Answer some questions I have about the Innovate kit some people sweep under the rug.

(On a side note that Visconti dyno is BS comparing Innovate vs Vortech show more detail or don't bother stirring the pot. @sw20kosh Seen his logs and dynos and that's an unfair representation.)

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by Brian@Vortech

Do I go into Innovate threads and post Vortech dynos? What kind of thread jack is this anyway???

Brian, let's be fair - a Vortech vendor started the thread jack by bringing the dyno comparison in the first place.

And in the interest of full disclosure, I happen to own a Vortech kit, am quite content with it, but I felt the cherry picked graphs were less than useful.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by Brian@Vortech

Do I go into Innovate threads and post Vortech dynos? What kind of thread jack is this anyway???

LOL. DO IT!!!!!!! But on a serious note... lets make a new thread if we want to compare, i would love to follow the discussion. But there is no reason to directly have it here.

Originally Posted by Dezoris

@nelsmar

Has invited me to a large dyno day in Phoenix. They are flying down FA20Club (Tony) to dyno and tune 12 cars. In that group will be Innovate and Vortech owners. Same tuner, same dyno should help answer plenty of questions.

I will be doing interviews, tech, and side by side comparisons and of course showing some obvious differences between the two kits.

Maybe settle this debate? Answer some questions I have about the Innovate kit some people sweep under the rug.

(On a side note that Visconti dyno is BS comparing Innovate vs Vortech show more detail or don't bother stirring the pot. @sw20kosh Seen his logs and dynos and that's an unfair representation.)

This.

As I said I can arrange specific dynos if needed. I was going to upgrade to a smaller pulley & E85 as I saw a few people recently post dynos (with little info) comparing the kits. But I can arrange something if people want comparisons of different bits. Donations for dyno time more than welcome... lol

[Brian@Vortech]

Sorry. I'm just grumpy today...carry on!

*EDIT: more grumpiness.

It's not like we are so one sided and only know one thing (centrifugals). We own a twin-screw brand (Lysholm Technologies). We know what their strengths and weaknesses are. When I posted about ΔT, I wasn't just pulling numbers out of the air. We would NEVER put a twin-screw on anything non-intercooled. Ever. Especially not a 12.5:1 N/A engine, and certainly not ever with no IAT sensor closely monitoring temps post-blower. No matter how cool something might seem, you cannot wish away data and safety margins to save a few bucks.

[charged86]

Originally Posted by Visconti

Certainly don't think you made it up just a misunderstanding.

John

I will let everyone now while on johns tune with no updates I did pull a 02 wrx on 15-18 psi full exhaust with a cut out , front mount and he was break boosting every 40 or 60 mph pull. Also I never had a check engine stutter stall or weak starts. Idled like a boss even with the ac in at stop lights. Looking forward to the smaller pulley 93 tune. I have all the required hardware.



Still waiting for the innovate to go over 300whp on 93 or e85. Both have disadvantages and perks. Heck lets see an innovate vs vortech drag or autocross at same power levels. Ans then we can all butt hurt about driver ability or clutch and tire wear.




Time to bring in the STIG......



Some say he has a tattoo of his face on his....face

And that he once passed a bar exam whilst juggling chainsaws

[Dezoris]

Originally Posted by Brian@Vortech

We would NEVER put a twin-screw on anything non-intercooled. Ever. Especially not a 12.5:1 N/A engine, and certainly not ever with no IAT sensor closely monitoring temps post-blower. No matter how cool something might seem, you cannot wish away data and safety margins to save a few bucks.

Well since you brought it up, might as well open the bag.
(Innovate Owners Please do not have a stroke)

I asked for a demo unit to test compare from Adam. Got shot down, which is fine, no biggy. So I ordered one...

Then talked to 3 different tuners about the kit and they mirrored what Brian said.

• No accurate way to measure IAT
• No hard data from Innovate on testing methods on IAT
• Heat Soak Major Concerns (Dyno Data is not Enough)
• US only market to sell kit without intercooler (Why)

I cancelled my order, because these questions had vague answers even from Innovate which basically said, don't worry about heat, the twin screw only rotates at 12,000RPM max which does not generate enough heat.


When asked for temp info to back that up, they did NOT test the kit monitoring intake air temps. Innovate also has some of the worst transparency in terms of forum and internet data I have seen. The fact I can get more quality information from owners is not comforting.



I will gladly retract my statements and change my opinion when these questions are answered with facts.


It's not an Innovate vs. issue its an Innovate issue.

[jdzumwalt]

Originally Posted by Brian@Vortech

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...NO.

Stock, out of the box 91 octane Vortech vs. Brand X with headers + E85 or W/M maybe...(probably still 20-30hp less though in reality).

This may be true. I'm still happy with my Vortech kit FYI