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Old 02-13-2018, 08:56 PM   #29
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For those who don't understand what the problem is with those belts... the angle of those belts will compress your spine on impact since the belts will want to pull DOWN under stress, instead of just halting the forward motion of your torso in a linear fashion. That is batshyte crazy stuff.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:04 PM   #30
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How is that car used? Is it just one of those "race" cars that goes to shows? There's no way that thing passes tech with any reasonable organization. Maybe we're just being too hard on it and it's just a show piece. I'm really trying to give it the benefit of the doubt here.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:08 PM   #31
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How is that car used? Is it just one of those "race" cars that goes to shows? There's no way that thing passes tech with any reasonable organization. Maybe we're just being too hard on it and it's just a show piece. I'm really trying to give it the benefit of the doubt here.
Pat, you can't fix stupid. Even if it were a "show car" that would be like putting a clown nose on the hood of a Ferrari. Whoever did that is just plain stupid.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:16 PM   #32
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How is that car used? Is it just one of those "race" cars that goes to shows? There's no way that thing passes tech with any reasonable organization. Maybe we're just being too hard on it and it's just a show piece. I'm really trying to give it the benefit of the doubt here.
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Pat, you can't fix stupid.
Few things,
1. Safety for US and JP is different. Safety that passes in JP doesn't mean it'll pass in US (& vice versa)
2. Griffon 86 is made by TRD JP and purpose was testing the limit of 86 and get fastest 86 time (back then) in Tsukuba. Which they clocked 58.407... which is 5 secs faster than Rev's 86.

Yes, I understand that, it's not proper setup for the harness. My guess is when SH took the photo of Griffon, they weren't complete, so they just put it on for the show and actual race day, they had the harness in correct setup... but I'm just guessing.

& jic if you haven't seen it, here's the vid of Griffon 86. First test, they clocked 1 min 1 sec

This vid, show Griffon 86 clocking 58 secs
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:22 PM   #33
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Evidently my Subaru, "made in Japan", is a safety aberration? I guess their marketing people, touting safety in ads, managed to talk their Japanese engineers out of their nationalist tendencies?

CRAZY.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:28 PM   #34
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Yes, I understand that, it's not proper setup for the harness. My guess is when SH took the photo of Griffon, they weren't complete, so they just put it on for the show and actual race day, they had the harness in correct setup... but I'm just guessing.
Even if that's true, why would you want a picture like that, which focuses on the seat / harness mount, to be made public? Why not include in the picture a filled gas can behind the driver's seat??? It makes no sense to do as a promotional picture. Promo pictures are things they think "look good" and that picture was taken and selected for a reason. What was the reason?

That picture is HORRIBLE and people who don't understand why need to know that so they don't think that is OK to do.

I've seen people show up at track events with belts that are, obviously, improperly installed. They see stuff on the interweb. They just don't know. Pictures like that need to be blown up and not apologized for, period.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:34 PM   #35
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Even if that's true, why would you want a picture like that, which focuses on the seat / harness mount, to be made public? Why not include in a picture a filled gas can behind the driver's seat??? It makes no sense to do as a promotional picture. Promo pictures are things they think "look good" and that picture was taken and selected for a reason. What was the reason?

That picture is HORRIBLE and people who don't understand why need to know that so they don't think that is OK to do.

I've seen people show up at track events with belts that are, obviously, improperly installed. They see stuff on the interweb. Pictures like that need to be blown up and not apologized for, period.
Going back to #1. idk Tsukuba Safety rule is, lmk that harness go against Tsukuba Safety rule. I'm no expert is safety, maybe you are. I'm interested to hear what you find. Cuz atm, you're just talking from here (US) safety.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:37 PM   #36
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Going back to #1. idk Tsukuba Safety rule is, lmk that harness go against Tsukuba Safety rule. I'm no expert is safety, maybe you are. I'm interested to hear what you find. Cuz atm, you're just talking from here (US) safety.
Unlike safety rules, the laws of physics don't change when crossing a political boundary.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:39 PM   #37
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Going back to #1. idk Tsukuba Safety rule is, lmk that harness go against Tsukuba Safety rule. I'm no expert is safety, maybe you are. I'm interested to hear what you find. Cuz atm, you're just talking from here (US) safety.
I'm no "expert" in safety, but I can read instructions for how to mount harness belts. If you found a harness belt that suggests mounting the shoulder belts at that angle, please share.

I'm always open to learning something new.

Here's a link to Simpson Harness mounting. Note the prescribed angle for shoulder harness mount. At risk of being a wisenheimer... do physics work differently in Japan?:

https://simpsonraceproducts.com/pdf/...t_Mounting.pdf
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:42 PM   #38
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Unlike safety rules, the laws of physics don't change when crossing a political boundary.
Ha! Your "physics" line was better. <FACEPALM>
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:50 PM   #39
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I guess this thread has strayed off track a bit... but anyone reviewing this needs to make sure they follow the detailed instructions for how to mount their belts. They are detailed for a reason. Don't look at pictures and opinions on the interweb for what is "OK" or "acceptable in another country".

Don't screw around with this. If you ever find yourself heading toward a fixed object, you'll be glad you read the directions.
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Old 02-13-2018, 09:51 PM   #40
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Unlike safety rules, the laws of physics don't change when crossing a political boundary.
I'm not disagreeing with safety point of view. Cuz it's not safe... BUT that's doesn't mean it's not against the safety rule at the track in different country. Example of roll cage, some of 6 point roll cage in Japan are Japanese MOT recognized/certified roll bars... but if you try to use it in US, it WILL NOT pass. Specially those front bars bend around dashes, instead of go through the dash. Safety & physic wise, that roll cage isn't safe... but still pass.

Laws of physics won't change, but rule of safety will... even it's not safe.
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Old 02-13-2018, 10:01 PM   #41
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I'm not disagreeing with safety point of view. Cuz it's not safe... BUT that's doesn't mean it's not against the safety rule at the track in different country. Example of roll cage, some of 6 point roll cage in Japan are Japanese MOT recognized/certified roll bars... but if you try to use it in US, it WILL NOT pass. Specially those front bars bend around dashes, instead of go through the dash. Safety & physic wise, that roll cage isn't safe... but still pass.

Laws of physics won't change, but rule of safety will... even it's not safe.
Splitting hairs like this doesn't promote safety. If you think what you're sharing isn't safe, I'd suggest that you need to explicitly say so; otherwise, people will see your posts and think what's shared is a credible option.

"People do that in Japan, and it's not safe" is one option.

Not sure why I need to be this direct regarding your comments. Perhaps you need to edit your posts.
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Old 02-13-2018, 10:21 PM   #42
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Splitting hairs like this doesn't promote safety. If you think what you're sharing isn't safe, I'd suggest that you need to explicitly say so; otherwise, people will see your posts and think what's shared is a credible option.

"People do that in Japan, and it's not safe" is one option.

Not sure why I need to be this direct regarding your comments. Perhaps you need to edit your posts.
Maybe youre not reading my Engrish correctly. I thoughts Ive stated in #1 that Safety for US and JP is different. Safety that passes in JP doesnt mean itll pass in US (& vice versa) that was my first statement. All Im saying is safety rule wise, it might not go against JP rule, BUT in US its not. I didnt want to mention how its not safe, cuz Ive limited knowledge in safety rule, so even I think its not safe & Pat have stated law of physics, its not safe. It doesnt mean its not against the certain countrys safety rule.

So in the end, I say it again. SAFETY RULE wise in Japan, it might not go against the rule (or maybe it is). But from my limited experience in track/autox in US, setup TRD isnt safe. Better?

Thanks for the Simpsons harness guid. Heres JAF safety guid (quick google search) around page 22 (or page 488)
http://www.jaf.or.jp/msports/rules/i...ion_fusoku.pdf
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