FRS/BRZ vs. 2013 Civic SI

[dori.]

He's not stating he likes it, he's stating 'facts'

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by dori.

He's not stating he likes it, he's stating 'facts'

What are the facts? I'm trying to understand what you're talking about because there is a good reason the 911 is the only RR sports car available. Most sports car is FR/FMR/RMR.

[serialk11r]

Well technically RR is better than RMR in some respects. An extremely rear biased weight distribution is the idea behind the Deltawing afterall. More braking force because more weight on the wider rear tires. However wheelbase has a very large role in it too.

[SUB-FT86]

I understand RR is also better at 0-60 traction. But If I had a choice between a Cayman S or a 911 S I would go with the 911 and then sell it immediately to a fanboy and get the Cayman S and pocket the difference..Lol.

[Ingen]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I understand RR is also better at 0-60 traction. But If I had a choice between a Cayman S or a 911 S I would go with the 911 and then sell it immediately to a fanboy and get the Cayman S and pocket the difference..Lol.

This, except I'd totally buy an FR-S and use the difference to put a down payment on a house

A nice house.

[Mr.Jay]

Originally Posted by Ingen

This, except I'd totally buy an FR-S and use the difference to put a down payment on a house

A nice house.

This, except I would buy a FRS and make it beautiful and live in it

911 money around here won't even get you a crack shack

[Texas BRZ]

Originally Posted by BareZ

Thanks for sharing the video... I was watching it and I saw how much better the test driver was seated in the BRZ... It just goes to show how much more intimate the BRZ / FR-S is when it comes to a car meant to be driven and felt, as a true sports car should be.

Surprisingly, I witnessed the latest Civic Si on my way to work early this morning... The exhaust note was louder than I expected... Either that or the driver was revving it harder when driving.

I can't really say the BRZ / FR-S is a better car than the Si... Although I strongly feel that Si is a lesser sports car experience when it comes to this comparison... That's just my brief perspective.

[86fanatic]

Originally Posted by Eau Rouge

In the end, automobile performance all boils down to optimizing its mass, the distribution of that mass on the car and your ability to change its velocity (speed and direction). Focusing just on 2WD and all other variables such as cost being equal, the fundamental mathematical expression for choice of engine location and drive wheels looks like this:

FF < FR < RR < MR

Except a car is never as simple as it's engine placement. There are things which are much more important, principally - tires, chassis stiffness, center of gravity, weight distribution, suspension, brakes, and all the steering mechanisms which determine track and radius and all other aspects of steering geometry.

Besides that, there is how much emphasis was placed on communication through the steering wheel, road feel, tire feel, brake feel, clutch feel, effort, pull, engagement - and how all these systems work together in harmony with all the electronics from power steering to active suspension.

You want to make some grand philosophical statement about which drive train layout is "best"? Forget it, it's a academic question at best with no discernible real world application, and at worst it's an inane attempt to justify your own car snobbery.

If you want an example of a FWD which handles better then most other RWD cars then check out the Renault Megane RS Trophy. It beats the competition with a less favorable power to weight around the Nurburgring.

Personally I never understood this attitude of separating FWD and RWD cars as if we need to divide people into two classes of car enthusiasts. You put me behind any car and I can have a blast. From wrestling a high power torque steering monster into a straight line, to drifting a FRS around a corner.

My advice is don't think so hard about the different drive trains, and just try to enjoy each car for what it is. :happy0180:

[Ingen]

Originally Posted by Mr.Jay

This, except I would buy a FRS and make it beautiful and live in it

911 money around here won't even get you a crack shack

Lol, but as a 20% down payment?

[Eau Rouge]

Originally Posted by Eau Rouge

all other variables such as cost being equal

Let's not get too far off track with more expensive vs less expensive, lest we dilute the point of contention.

[Eau Rouge]

...and in the end, all we end up with is a base with inherently better or worse qualities. How those qualities are maximized depends largely on how the engineers design the engine, drivetrain and suspension. Even beyond that, one must be able to execute within the dynamics of driving the car. Hamfisted Ferrari drivers will inevitably use less of the car's potential than a skilled driver in a Prius.

[suzuka]

Heads up! 2013 Si is back with vengeance... Will reclaim title as the best FF drivers' car. http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2013-...#photo-5469601

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by suzuka

Heads up! 2013 Si is back with vengeance... Will reclaim title as the best FF drivers' car. http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2013-...#photo-5469601

all i see are photos. there is nothing noting how the car drives in your link

[ngabdala]

I loved my 2011 Civic Si , however, as a driver's car the BRZ wins based on what I like in a car.