Track suspension advice

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

Ok, question. This has been bugging me for a while.

Why do some coilovers not come with camber plates? And not Billy Bob's Garage Spec parts either, but decent names like the Bilstein B16. I would think that the top mount would be a somewhat integral part of a coilover.

It's a little cheaper, and some people will prefer stock mounts anyway. You can usually get SOME camber anyway.

A lot of the camber plates that come on the coilovers out there aren't very good anyway. Certainly not as good as some of the high quality plates you can get from Raceseng, RCE, HVT, etc. Many would like to choose for themself.

- Andy

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Skip B8's. Revalved B6 would be a better way to go.

- Andy

The marketing says the B8's are meant to go with lowering springs (like the swift springs), so from a "forget the marketing, here's the real info" standpoint, how are revalved B6s with spec-R's better than B8s with spec-R's?

Edit: and re-valved how?

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

I'm not ready to get on the track quite yet, but it'll be nice to develop contacts for when I am ready. Do you have a site or link I could dig through? Thanks David.

www.speedventures.com

One of the best run HPDE organizers around the Southwest region.

Originally Posted by ayau

I think you'll want B8 shocks rather than the B6. The B8 shocks are meant for lowering springs. B6 shocks are meant for OEM springs.

I suspect some preload will be placed on the lowering spring for B8 shocks.

Originally Posted by ddeflyer

Yeah, I do have to admit that it was abnormally awesome weather when I was there (it was hotter the time before when I was there).

When you do come up, I think the very best would be one of the five mile events. I got the opportunity to walk the new stuff last time and it is freaking awesome. It is a little hard to say without seeing the pavement and final berm configuration, but it looks like the new stuff will have some fantastically challenging features. That said, there are a couple of places that I suspect will have plenty of high beginner/low intermediate drivers and their cars as snacks, but time will tell. I'd love to point to turn numbers but I can't find a new map and I don't know the numbers.

As far as car stability, the first time I went over turn 1 at Laguna Seca I realized right away that the BRZ is special. Previously I had a 2013 Civic Si and that turn was scary on the crest while the BRZ just feels planted.

Oh I never really felt that issue over T1...it's probably because the cars I drove were to stupid slow going up to T1.

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Skip B8's. Revalved B6 would be a better way to go.

- Andy

Want. Can you provide those free revalving service to us preeeassee?

[ddeflyer]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

How many track days have you done?

What kind and what size tires do you run?

- Andy

I've done 14 days with alot more scheduled (doing four or six in May alone depending upon if I actually go out this weekend).

I'm running Yokohama Advan AD08r 225/40 R18s, by the time I'm installing the upgrades I will probably be doing R-Comps on the track.

[ddeflyer]

Originally Posted by CSG David

www.speedventures.com

One of the best run HPDE organizers around the Southwest region.



I suspect some preload will be placed on the lowering spring for B8 shocks.



Oh I never really felt that issue over T1...it's probably because the cars I drove were to stupid slow going up to T1.

It probably didn't help that the Civic at Laguna Seca was my 1st, 2nd, and 3rd track days. I am very sure though that Civic really did not settle nearly as quickly going over turn 1 and turn 7.

[ayau]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Skip B8's. Revalved B6 would be a better way to go.

- Andy

Can you elaborate on the exact differences between the B8 and the B6 specific to the FRS/BRZ? Bilstein markets the B8 for lower springs and the B6 for OEM springs if I recall correctly. Why would it be better to mate the B6 shocks with lowering springs? Is the valving the same?

[SirBrass]

So, @CSG Mike & @CSG David, according to your advice, spr lca's, spec-R springs, and raceseng cascam tophats are a good setup (okay, and perhaps revalved B6's, though I'd love to know why those over stock B8's). I can buy that logic.

But, let's say I don't want to purchase all at once. Any suggested order of purchase and install? Should some parts absolutely be bought together?

Or should I wait to install until after I've gotten all that bought so I only have to go for an alignment once?

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

So, @CSG Mike & @CSG David, according to your advice, spr lca's, spec-R springs, and raceseng cascam tophats are a good setup (okay, and perhaps revalved B6's, though I'd love to know why those over stock B8's). I can buy that logic.

But, let's say I don't want to purchase all at once. Any suggested order of purchase and install? Should some parts absolutely be bought together?

Or should I wait to install until after I've gotten all that bought so I only have to go for an alignment once?

In this order according to the list above:

Raceseng CasCam
Swift Spec-R
SPL RLCA
Bilstein B6/B8

The most important part is front camber. You lose negative camber upon compression so it's better to dial that front camber to utilize your tires better. There's a picture somewhere of us taking a corner and you see the front wheel with positive camber.

And yes, OEM shocks are really good. On an epic side note, 2014 BRZ feels incredibly compliant over the 2013 BRZ. I must be smoking crack because the ride is much more stable and comfortable, yet very controllable.

[CSG Mike]

^ upon a LOT of compression (which you will get on stock suspension)

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

The marketing says the B8's are meant to go with lowering springs (like the swift springs), so from a "forget the marketing, here's the real info" standpoint, how are revalved B6s with spec-R's better than B8s with spec-R's?

Edit: and re-valved how?

Originally Posted by ayau

Can you elaborate on the exact differences between the B8 and the B6 specific to the FRS/BRZ? Bilstein markets the B8 for lower springs and the B6 for OEM springs if I recall correctly. Why would it be better to mate the B6 shocks with lowering springs? Is the valving the same?

I wanted to get my hands on a set to see for myself as I had some suspicions....but...someone on here was able to get some answers from Bilstein.

It's likely the same valving. The B8s have less droop and equal compression travel. I'm fairly sure they have shorter internal bumpstops which is nice.

They aren't much more money, and having the shorter bumpstops is great. But droop travel is important and it's disappointing that it's reduced (there's no reason it should be). It would be more money overall but I would rather B6 revalved to match the springs of your choice (preferably RCE Tarmac springs ).

- Andy

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by CSG David

And yes, OEM shocks are really good. On an epic side note, 2014 BRZ feels incredibly compliant over the 2013 BRZ. I must be smoking crack because the ride is much more stable and comfortable, yet very controllable.

And compliant is good?

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

And compliant is good?

You have grip where some coilover setups don't have it. What's the point of suspension if you can't even lay down the tire in the right place?

[ayau]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

I wanted to get my hands on a set to see for myself as I had some suspicions....but...someone on here was able to get some answers from Bilstein.

It's likely the same valving. The B8s have less droop and equal compression travel. I'm fairly sure they have shorter internal bumpstops which is nice.

They aren't much more money, and having the shorter bumpstops is great. But droop travel is important and it's disappointing that it's reduced (there's no reason it should be). It would be more money overall but I would rather B6 revalved to match the springs of your choice (preferably RCE Tarmac springs ).

- Andy

Will RCE sell revalved B6 with lowering springs?