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GR86 General Topics (2nd Gen 2022+ Toyota 86) General topics for the GR86 second-gen 86


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Old 02-21-2020, 07:23 PM   #323
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I could mention many reasons why an NA internal combustion engine cannot reach more than 100 hp/lt based on latest regulations for exhaust gas emissions, especially for EU. But since we are not at university, we do not have to go deeper ...
You cannot expect more than 240 bhp in case an fa24 NA is applied.
For anything more, they will naturally have to go to forced induction...
It's that simple ...

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Old 02-21-2020, 07:27 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by vagthomas View Post
I could mention many reasons why an NA internal combustion engine cannot reach more than 100 hp/lt based on latest regulations for exhaust gas emissions, especially for EU. But since we are not at university, we do not have to go deeper ...
You cannot expect more than 240 bhp in case an fa24 NA is applied.
For anything more, they will naturally have to go to forced induction...
It's that simple ...

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Please go deeper @vagthomas!

I really would like to know, I’m curious.
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Old 02-21-2020, 07:50 PM   #325
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Ah... this reminds me... the MR2 is the one (and only?) car where the first generation was not the lightest... the 3rd gen was the lightest and best handling generation.

So... come on 3rd gen 86!?
OK, technically MK3 was lighter by about 80lbs than the '85 MK1 but it was missing a roof!

I'll take the MK1, thanks.
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Old 02-22-2020, 12:40 AM   #326
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Wow. This thread has become a bummer. I could have accepted some type of hybrid tech. Using that to add some nice torque and keep weight low and balanced by placing batteries down in the back. But hearing Toyota and Subaru is planning an about face with regards to the ethos of the car is heartbreaking. The reason I bought this car is because it was the only lightweight rwd manual coupe at an affordable price. If those things are going away so am I as a customer.
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Old 02-22-2020, 01:03 AM   #327
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Old 02-22-2020, 01:45 AM   #328
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Meh, don't really care, either I keep my current boosted 86 for a few more years, or I buy something else.

Nothing to really sweat about.

Maybe a clean old Mk2 MR2 to take me off into retirement.

Highly modified of course
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Old 02-22-2020, 02:08 AM   #329
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Originally Posted by R_E_L View Post
Wow. This thread has become a bummer. I could have accepted some type of hybrid tech. Using that to add some nice torque and keep weight low and balanced by placing batteries down in the back. But hearing Toyota and Subaru is planning an about face with regards to the ethos of the car is heartbreaking. The reason I bought this car is because it was the only lightweight rwd manual coupe at an affordable price. If those things are going away so am I as a customer.
Of course we have very little actual info but I trust ichi's opinion and the info he can not share that formed it so I am afraid that the platform built for the people that originally wanted it is doomed. It was very successful for the niche it was designed to fill so now Toyota wants to move it on into the higher volume, greater profit category. This means a car that the general public will find fun but doesn't scare them. They want a nice comfy drive with all the modern comforts of an up to date vehicle not a track toy or something they can toss around. Ford has known this for decades and that is why there are several performance levels of the Mustang. Unfortunately that will end up with the people that loved the first gen left at the side of the progress road.

Since this car first came out there as been a vocal group yelling "THEY NEED TO ADD POWER IF THEY WANT TO SELL MORE". More power does not sell more cars but gadgets, comfort, and practicality for daily use do. For every STi sold there are a few hundred WRXs. For every few hundred WRXs sold there are a several thousand Imprezas of varying trim levels. The majority of compact car buyers do not give one shit about power for the sake of power! They also don't care about weight or drive wheels as much as mileage and operating costs. The bloody Prius has sold 100,000 to 2000,000 units a year (until the last couple of years at least) which is telling where the compact car buyers priorities are. THESE are the people they are now targeting not us!

If ichi is even half right then this scenario will lay out one of 4 ways.

Ichi is wrong and they produce another small volume niche car with all the thigs that the internet romours they will have. It will continue to sellat much the same rates it does now

or

The 2nd gen will focus on volume, take off and sell tens of thousands of units to moms and dads around the world. This forum will become a wasteland since they will not be looking to modify or change their fun little cars in any way.

or

It will flop and the Board of Directors will tell development to go back the the roots of the first gen. This isn't likely but possible.

or

It will flop and they just can the marque completely. This is my prediction.

When all is said and done they are a business not a charity set up to serve the desires of such a small group of the car buying public that there are several zeros between the percentage point and the number. Instead of being angry we should be glad that they gave us this gift for the 8 years they did. As ichi said anybody that has one should hang onto it. Anybody that wants one should buy it. Anybody that wants to upgrade to a new one (as I am) should do it. Anybody that wants to wait and see what is actually coming should wait, but they then lose the privilege of complaining if they don't like it and find they can't get a new or good used first gen.

On a more positive note if the second gen does indeed suck we will see the end of the whining about depreciation on the first since they will suddenly hold value really well!
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Old 02-22-2020, 02:08 AM   #330
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Originally Posted by R_E_L View Post
Wow. This thread has become a bummer. I could have accepted some type of hybrid tech. Using that to add some nice torque and keep weight low and balanced by placing batteries down in the back. But hearing Toyota and Subaru is planning an about face with regards to the ethos of the car is heartbreaking. The reason I bought this car is because it was the only lightweight rwd manual coupe at an affordable price. If those things are going away so am I as a customer.
Don’t fret mitten.

Have faith they can pull off something awesome, again.
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Old 02-22-2020, 04:28 AM   #331
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It will flop and they just can the marque completely. This is my prediction.

When all is said and done they are a business not a charity set up to serve the desires of such a small group of the car buying public that there are several zeros between the percentage point and the number. Instead of being angry we should be glad that they gave us this gift for the 8 years they did. As ichi said anybody that has one should hang onto it. Anybody that wants one should buy it. Anybody that wants to upgrade to a new one (as I am) should do it. Anybody that wants to wait and see what is actually coming should wait, but they then lose the privilege of complaining if they don't like it and find they can't get a new or good used first gen.

On a more positive note if the second gen does indeed suck we will see the end of the whining about depreciation on the first since they will suddenly hold value really well!
Good write up. Is it too early to start the “If the 2nd gen is shit what do we get instead?” thread? I’ll keep my first gen and maybe add a WRX to the garage down the track... If your prediction is true. Maybe the first sign of the rot setting in was adding buttons to the steering wheel on the +17 models and beyond. Not a fan of that.
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Old 02-22-2020, 05:30 AM   #332
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You should see the hayabusa riders face when a car pulls away from them. Funny when your off the gas waiting on them to catch up so you leave them again.
Depends on the rider,.

Depends on the car.

Depends on the driver.

What car?

A sock Hayabusa with even an average rider will lay consistent high 9"s.
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Old 02-22-2020, 05:30 AM   #333
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Stock....
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Old 02-22-2020, 05:57 AM   #334
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1981 corolla me driving, rider didn't matter at all.

0 to 135 in 5.3 seconds
I really really need to see specs and pics of this beastie....

Cheers
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Old 02-22-2020, 12:18 PM   #335
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Good write up. Is it too early to start the “If the 2nd gen is shit what do we get instead?” thread? I’ll keep my first gen and maybe add a WRX to the garage down the track... If your prediction is true. Maybe the first sign of the rot setting in was adding buttons to the steering wheel on the +17 models and beyond. Not a fan of that.
If you want to be really picky it started earlier than that when they started messing with the suspension in 15.
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Old 02-22-2020, 02:43 PM   #336
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It was on the street more than the track.
LOL, what a weapon, that thing hooked up.
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