BRZ/FR-S vs 2015 Mustang

[Brzetto]

Originally Posted by firebase99

Come stock, as I will in the "Vulva", bet you a Franklin, youll see nothing but tail lights. Any track, any time. Whats your best time at Leguna, VIR, or Sebring? The "POS" Z wont be needed.

FWIW, I love the Twins. Awesome platform for circuits, low CG, turn in sharp, tight, communicative, and flat. Fantastic chassis. LOL.

Since you're such a badass why not bring your Z to race? What's funnier is that you and fatoni probably know each other, that's why you like each other's posts. He can't win by himself so he brings all of his friends over here to help him troll. Have fun challenging people with cars you don't own.

[EAGLE5]

Originally Posted by Frost

Excellent discussion video here:

This is why I prefer MT over all the other car mags - they tend to get to another level of discussion without being too tongue-in-cheek or disrespectful.

Really? I find MotorTrend to be a bit of a joke. Their idea of in depth is not mine, and their idea of good writing is laughable. Jonny Lieberman writes like bad teenage poetry.

The best automotive journalist right now, bar none, is Jason Cammisa for Road and Track.

[EAGLE5]

Originally Posted by firebase99

I like the one Probst drive for. Talented but a bit of a dbag.

Pobst drives for Motor Trend. He's the best thing they have going right now. He's also not the writer nor editor. As opposed to someone like Cammisa who does it all.

[Boxer486]

I couldn't get past the Ford propaganda and marketing circle jerk in that video to find any use for it.

[EAGLE5]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

I couldn't get past the Ford propaganda and marketing circle jerk in that video to find any use for it.

LOL. I didn't even bother clicking on the video.

[SUB-FT86]

I liked the video. It was very info driven especially about the 2.3 Turbo Mustang. It sounds like that one will be the one to get if you want 3 things.

Handling-lighter front end with better suspension setup.
MPG-possible 30+mpg hwy
Power- 305+ hp/ 305+ tq

[Max Schnell]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I liked the video. It was very info driven especially about the 2.3 Turbo Mustang. It sounds like that one will be the one to get if you want 3 things.

Handling-lighter front end with better suspension setup.
MPG-possible 30+mpg hwy
Power- 305+ hp/ 305+ tq

It would be depending on final weight. If it weighs in at over 3500lbs then that turbo 4 will lose a lot of its benefits.

I noticed Ford has not disclosed weight yet. That may be because much like the C7 Vette the lower weight was not achieved in production cars.

I like the design from what I see in photos. I will reserve judgment until I see it live in person.

[n2oinferno]

Originally Posted by Max Schnell

It would be depending on final weight. If it weighs in at over 3500lbs then that turbo 4 will lose a lot of its benefits.

I noticed Ford has not disclosed weight yet. That may be because much like the C7 Vette the lower weight was not achieved in production cars.

I like the design from what I see in photos. I will reserve judgment until I see it live in person.

It's not just weight. They haven't disclosed any final performance numbers. Everything engine wise is "over X number."

[Frost]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

I couldn't get past the Ford propaganda and marketing circle jerk in that video to find any use for it.

Here's the part where this is not fair to anyone:

Yes, they are Ford employees and thus will talk the product up because it would be a conflict of Ford interest to have them talk it down BUT what I am extracting out of the video are FACTS. They have lowered the car by 1.x inches which is now recorded and accountable for. This should make the car much less boaty - I like the current gen Mustang for purely highway cruising (especially that throaty V8) but once I started any sort of surgical twisties, it made the car feel much less sporty.

There is no need to call the marketing guy a jerk. They are there to sell to the masses and just because you think you are better than the average joe doesn't make it right for you to call him a jerk. He is doing his job - he didn't really add much to the technical talk but that's not his forte or reason d'etre in that show.

As for MT being a joke, I severely disagree. C&D lately has become too know-it-all and R&T has not really managed to wow me in any of their articles.

But you have a point with Johnny Lieberman being a tool - I dislike all his videos the most and his articles. Angus MacKenzie, Carlos Lago along with Ed Loh make for some very interesting writing for me coupled with Randy Pobst's inputs from a serious driver make for a very compelling package when reviewing new cars. I get the full spectrum when reading their mags and watching their videos. MT does a better job than R&T in the internet media front at least.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Max Schnell

It would be depending on final weight. If it weighs in at over 3500lbs then that turbo 4 will lose a lot of its benefits.

I noticed Ford has not disclosed weight yet. That may be because much like the C7 Vette the lower weight was not achieved in production cars.

I like the design from what I see in photos. I will reserve judgment until I see it live in person.

If Ford goes from its claimed 400 lbs. weight loss to 0 lbs. in the production car, this car will be a huge disappointment no matter how much they tweak the exterior.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by Max Schnell

It would be depending on final weight. If it weighs in at over 3500lbs then that turbo 4 will lose a lot of its benefits.

I noticed Ford has not disclosed weight yet. That may be because much like the C7 Vette the lower weight was not achieved in production cars.

I like the design from what I see in photos. I will reserve judgment until I see it live in person.

I have this weird feeling the base weight will be 3300 lbs for the 2.3T. But i wish it would be 3150-3200 lbs.

[Max Schnell]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I have this weird feeling the base weight will be 3300 lbs for the 2.3T. But i wish it would be 3150-3200 lbs.

If the base 2.3T can hit low 3200 lbs range it would be a fun car. IRS and other changes could make it handle very well. I sort of doubt it will be that light, the Focus ST is heavier than that.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by Frost

Here's the part where this is not fair to anyone:

Yes, they are Ford employees and thus will talk the product up because it would be a conflict of Ford interest to have them talk it down BUT what I am extracting out of the video are FACTS. They have lowered the car by 1.x inches which is now recorded and accountable for. This should make the car much less boaty - I like the current gen Mustang for purely highway cruising (especially that throaty V8) but once I started any sort of surgical twisties, it made the car feel much less sporty.

There is no need to call the marketing guy a jerk. They are there to sell to the masses and just because you think you are better than the average joe doesn't make it right for you to call him a jerk. He is doing his job - he didn't really add much to the technical talk but that's not his forte or reason d'etre in that show.

As for MT being a joke, I severely disagree. C&D lately has become too know-it-all and R&T has not really managed to wow me in any of their articles.

But you have a point with Johnny Lieberman being a tool - I dislike all his videos the most and his articles. Angus MacKenzie, Carlos Lago along with Ed Loh make for some very interesting writing for me coupled with Randy Pobst's inputs from a serious driver make for a very compelling package when reviewing new cars. I get the full spectrum when reading their mags and watching their videos. MT does a better job than R&T in the internet media front at least.

Wow, reading comprehension is bad these days on the internets.

1-So you watched nearly 30 minutes of video and all you have to offer is 'they lowered the car 1 inch'? That's exactly why many of us didn't bother. I saw the video was around 26 mins and heard nothing substantive in the first 6, called it quits. That's more than fair.

2-I never called anyone a 'jerk', I used the term 'circle jerk'. Try Google to learn the difference.

3-Don't ever say 'you' when quoting me and using someone else's quotes or statements. I didn't say most of what you accused me of. Not appreciated at all.

[WolfpackS2k]

Lot of people in this thread with their panties in a wad.