Crawford Billet Power Blocks

[jeebus]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

my guess is a ground wire set and IAM manipulation on the dyno....

lol, that would be extremely shady even for Crawford.

[mav1178]

When I hear "power block" and "instant HP", I can't help but think of those JDM grounding kits from 10-15 years ago.

-alex

[Thorpedo]

Originally Posted by jeebus

How could they say they didn't even hookup AF gauge because they aren't trying to manipulate the AFR? What if this modification DOES modify the AFR?

DING DING DING I didn't say anything but the poster on their part doesn't seem to know what they're talking about.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Frankly I'm wondering where the boost plot is.
@King Tut

[jeebus]

I'm down the road from Crawford, maybe I should stop by....

[carbonBLUE]

After seeing all you guys flame them.... geeeeeeeeeze

anyways.. clearly you can see this is an engine dyno and not a rolling dyno by the numbers... i have faith in them if they are taking the tuning this far. how many tuners have an engine dyno on hand to create parts? Those things cost a lot of $$$.

So before you bash, I would wait to see what the whole package is

[King Tut]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

Frankly I'm wondering where the boost plot is.
@King Tut

This has got to be a joke. No serious company would make a product called a "Billet Power Block". Who hacked Crawford's FB page?

Reminds me that I saw a show called Performance TV on Saturday where they let some guy from some crappy company in another country zip tie some power straightener type things on the battery cables and plug wires and let him go on for a whole segment about how much power and fuel economy they would make.

[Wepeel]

Originally Posted by jeebus

How could they say they didn't even hookup AF gauge because they aren't trying to manipulate the AFR? What if this modification DOES modify the AFR?

Somewhere it was stated they drove around for a week with the mod then dyno'd it. So it would give the ECU time to learn out any sudden changes that would affect the AFR. At least to what is in range or the fuel trim authority.

[calmtigers]

For some odd reason, I always assumed Crawford was a really well known and trusted tuning company that was on par with Perrin in terms of established credibility with Subaru motors etc..

Whats with the shit talking? Also Subbed curious to see what this is

[jamesm]

'increases volumetric efficiency' and 'requires no tuning' are inherently incompatible statements.

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by Wepeel

Somewhere it was stated they drove around for a week with the mod then dyno'd it. So it would give the ECU time to learn out any sudden changes that would affect the AFR. At least to what is in range or the fuel trim authority.

That's not what the ECU's autotune is for, though. Autotune is there to save the engine! When it pulls timing and alters trims, it does so drastically, as an inbetween between blowing up and limp-mode. Like, if the knock really only needs about .2 degrees of timing pulled to tune it out in a certain RPM range, Autotune will pull a full degree, because it's about engine safety, not proper tuning.

So, relying on autotune to fix the problem is just a bad, bad, bad idea all around. You fix the IAMs at 1, THEN dyno with the mods and see where fine knock learning, IAMs, etc go from there... fix, and repeat till IAMs, etc. show there's no knock under the conditions you're testing.

[jamesm]

^ he's right. calling it 'autotune' to begin with is misleading. it's not tuning anything. it's trying to save it's own life. it cares nothing for optimization.

one could argue that fuel trims are fine because once they stabilize the AFR is fine. it's simply not true, especially on this car with it's two completely independent, interoperating fueling systems (port and di).

just look at some of the guys running OFT on e85. sure their trims 'learned' over time, but they still have wildly variable AFR every time the go into open loop. i've seen logs of the OTS e85 map with guys running 10.x:1 on e85. certainly not a good way to make power.

[industrial]

A 23 piece set... Nice nice....But will they throw in a ship in a bottle?

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by jamesm

^ he's right. calling it 'autotune' to begin with is misleading. it's not tuning anything. it's trying to save it's own life. it cares nothing for optimization.

one could argue that fuel trims are fine because once they stabilize the AFR is fine. it's simply not true, especially on this car with it's two completely independent, interoperating fueling systems (port and di).

just look at some of the guys running OFT on e85. sure their trims 'learned' over time, but they still have wildly variable AFR every time the go into open loop. i've seen logs of the OTS e85 map with guys running 10.x:1 on e85. certainly not a good way to make power.

Thank nelsmar for telling me about things like this.

ECU autotrimming (better than "autotune"?) is good for tuning on this car b/c it IS a safety net that allows a tuner to make a bit of a mistake, see the system correcting to save itself, and then he can correct for it on subsequent runs without damaging the engine. But using it like a crutch is a good way to not make power correctly, or even lose power, or to make sure any "gains" seen on the dyno simply don't last very long as the ecu pulls timing out again.