Do I NEED camber plates?

[TechnoMaster4]

I'm looking into getting swift springs, but I've heard and seen this talk about camber and I still don't know what the hell it means. It would be around a 1 inch lower on a 245/40/17 tire size.


Do I absolutely NEED camber plates? What will they do for me if I get them? What will happen if I don't get them? If it's a stupid question, sorry. Cars are a foreign concept to me and I'm trying to learn all this stuff as I go.

[gramicci101]

Camber refers to how much the wheel is tilted inwards. This can be a good thing, because some amount of negative camber helps the car handle better, turn quicker, etc... How much negative camber to run is a discussion in itself and depends on your driving style, intended usage, desired tire wear, and so on.

That said, you probably don't need camber plates. Depending on how much camber you want, camber bolts work just as well and are much cheaper. Camber plates become necessary when A) you want to run more camber than bolts will give you, or B) wheel/tire to spring clearance is an issue.

Camber bolts work where the bottom of the strut mounts to the hub, tilting the wheel inward in relation to the strut. You need to have space available to do that or you'll rub on the springs, and wide wheels or particular offsets don't have that space. Camber plates work where the top of the strut mounts to the chassis, tilting the whole assembly inward as a unit. Since everything moves together you don't have to worry so much about clearance.

You want to run 245's. What size and offset wheel are you looking at? That may necessitate running camber plates, depending on how much clearance there is. It may also require coilovers instead of springs and struts, for the same reasons. Coilovers have a smaller diameter, so you can fit wider wheels.

[TechnoMaster4]

Right now my size is indeed 245/40/17 with 17x9 + 35 wheel offset.

This car is for daily driving with the occasional spirited drive in the mountains. No huge track stuff.

[sugoi]

Gramicci knocked it out of the park. Two things to add:

If you don't know what it does, you probably don't need it.

Adding camber plates will introduce some NVH (noise vibration harshness) because you're replacing the factory rubber top hat for a solid metal one. Since this car is a a daily driver, it might not be something you want to live with.

[asdf]

No, you do not need camber plates.

Get some camber bolts for the front and have them installed at the same time as the springs. You will want some negative camber on the front wheels (negative = wheel angled with top more inside relative to bottom) to aide with handling and to keep the wheel/tire from "poking" out of the wheel well.

With a 1" drop and camber bolts, you should be able to get around -1.5 (possibly a little more) degrees of camber which will work fine for your intended purpose (daily/occasional spirited drive). With your new springs and camber bolts installed, ask your alignment technician to set the toe straight front and rear, and negative camber in front-- then go have fun and enjoy

two good vendors to buy camber bolts from:
http://counterspacegarage.com/whitel...t-frs-brz.html
http://www.ft86speedfactory.com/whit...l#.WGKv50aNEwA

[gramicci101]

You should have no issue fitting springs and camber bolts, then. They're both easy to install. If you don't have the tools or space to do it yourself, check out the regional forum and see if anyone can help.

In the rear, you will get negative camber just from lowering the car. If that number ends up being where you want it after an alignment, then great. If the two sides are way off from each other or you want the ability to adjust, you'll need an adjustable rear lower control arm. In the rear, shoot for -1.5 to -2.0 camber, 0.05-0.10 toe in on each side. If the camber doesn't match exactly from right to left, that's not a big deal as long as it's close. Ideally you want the two sides to match, but it's not the end of the world if they don't. Make sure the toe matches from side to side.
http://www.ft86speedfactory.com/susp...l-arms-98.html

In the front, consider these bolts. Put the OEM bottom bolt in the top hole and the camber bolt in the bottom hole, and that should be sufficient to get a decent amount of front camber. In the front, shoot for slightly more camber than you have in the rear. So if the rear is -1.7, make the front -2.0. That kind of thing. With camber bolts, you may not be able to get as much camber as you want, so at that point you decide if you can live with it or if you need to spring for plates. Zero toe in the front.

These alignment settings are a good starting point. You may find that it ends up being too aggressive, or not aggressive enough, and want to go back and tweak it a bit. Firestone has a lifetime alignment package; I made sure to get that so I can have it redone as much as I want.

Note: Any time you adjust the suspension, you should get an alignment. Changing springs, loosening and tightening bolts or mounting points, whatever. Since the alignment tremendously effects how the car handles and how safe it is to drive, if you've done anything that affects how the suspension sits, it's in your best interest to make sure it's all still aligned properly.

[renfield90]

Originally Posted by TechnoMaster4

Right now my size is indeed 245/40/17 with 17x9 + 35 wheel offset.

This car is for daily driving with the occasional spirited drive in the mountains. No huge track stuff.

You don't need camber plates for your intended use. You'll be fine with the stock top hat; if you add more camber than what is available with stock top hats, you will likely see excessive tire wear on the inside shoulder even if your toe settings are correct.

Recommend you get an alignment 3-4 months after installing the springs, when they've settled, and regularly rotate your tires (I recommend every oil change).

[jamal]

I like the whitelne tops. They give you extra camber and caster and are still a regular rubber top mount. Those alone or with a camber bolt for the top hole will get you to a good spot for street/fun driving with springs.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by jamal

I like the whitelne tops. They give you extra camber and caster and are still a regular rubber top mount. Those alone or with a camber bolt for the top hole will get you to a good spot for street/fun driving with springs.

Whiteline pulled those years ago because the bearings kept blowing out.

[jamal]

No they didn't. KCA335 is still made, and the bearings have been updated a few times since the original versions. A new set should not have any issues.

[gramicci101]

Yeah, they refunded a bunch of people back in 2013-14 and pulled BRZ from their list of applications that it works for, because even their redesigned version blew its bearings pretty quickly, according to people's complaints. KCA335 is still made because it works pretty well on other platforms, namely the STI.

[churchx]

Pitty. That was product (if they managed to get it right) i'd love to get/use. Though then again camber bolts in both strut holes resulted in not that far from wished camber, so those +stock mounts somewhat will do for me.
I don't get though why Com-Cs failed on one platform (ours) and worked fine in others. If anything else, STI has even more mass/load in front, so should fail quicker? :/
Even greater pitty to com-c fail is that there seems nobody else considering making rubber mounts with extra camber, only other choices for extra camber at top mounts being camberplates with mentioned NVH issues.

[gramicci101]

I agree; it would be the perfect product. And I have no idea why it works on so many other platforms, but not ours. The STI people were really not pleased with the redesign, because then it started causing problems for them.

[TechnoMaster4]

Alright, so camber plates are not needed, but now camber bolts have made it to the discussion. I never knew bolts were a thing, so now the question is:

Do I NEED the bolts? Seems like some of you think yes because it handles better, some think no because of tire wear. (Sorry for my car ignorance. I don't want to fuck my 86 up, you know? Have to be sure.)


My brother is a mechanic and doing the install for free. He will align everything for me afterwards.