Random Thoughts - Part Deux [NO POLITICS]

[themadscientist]

What, not Tiptoes?

[Talus1]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Yep. Flight checklists. Yet another thing written by lawyers not engineers. They exist simply for liability reasons.

As somebody who used to work in aviation safety I can categorically state that flight checklists are written by engineers, not lawyers. They aren't there for liability reasons. They are designed to save lives by making sure that every step is followed and not forgotten. Good pilots use them religiously, even if they know them by heart after a few times. It is super easy to forget a step or forget to check something and you never know when that might become critical. Accidents are rarely the result of a single failure. Typically a bunch of minor things are missed, any one of which, if not missed, would have prevented the accident. The problem is that there is rarely a consequence for a single forgotten step, so as humans we get sloppy. Thats what checklists are for, to make sure that no step is forgotten so that accidents don't happen.

I've flown with a bunch of different professional pilots. There was only one that didn't use the ground and flight checklists religiously. He was also the only one I never really felt comfortable flying with, even if his natural ability to control an aircraft in flight was among the best.

The good pilots I know use the checklists with the same discipline and diligence that they apply to all their other flying skills. They try to do everything better on this flight than the last one and spend time thinking about how to do the next one better.

For sure there are legal implications, as there are for anything else where humans are involved...

[p1l0t]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Yep. Flight checklists. Yet another thing written by lawyers not engineers. They exist simply for liability reasons.

Yeah ckecklists (not sure if written by lawyers, engineers, both, or neither) are definitely a thing. If you can remember to do the checklist you won't (probably) miss anything, even when things outside the cockpit (traffic, weather, etc..) are getting crazy. The planes I fly I fly almost everyday. I have all the checklists memorized and I COULD fly the plane without them. I don't. Using the checklist reinforces what I know, helps me make sure I didn't miss anything, and double-checks that I did it right. We don't have to, and most often our SOPs (Standard Operating Procedures) specify that most checklists are do-verify not callouts. Meaning we do the flow out of memory and the verify it after instead of reading it step-by-step. This means that not only are we using a tried and true method of making sure we didn't forget anything, but at the same time we are making our memorization of the procedure better. Using a checklist as a do-verify is the best of both worlds as it reinforces our flow as well. Surgeons adopted checklists now because it works so well for us. Even though I can do almost any checklist for the plane for any phase of flight out-of-memory I still physically pick it up and show myself and the other pilot that our flows and memory are still on-point.

Originally Posted by Talus1

As somebody who used to work in aviation safety I can categorically state that flight checklists are written by engineers, not lawyers. They aren't there for liability reasons. They are designed to save lives by making sure that every step is followed and not forgotten. Good pilots use them religiously, even if they know them by heart after a few times. It is super easy to forget a step or forget to check something and you never know when that might become critical. Accidents are rarely the result of a single failure. Typically a bunch of minor things are missed, any one of which, if not missed, would have prevented the accident. The problem is that there is rarely a consequence for a single forgotten step, so as humans we get sloppy. Thats what checklists are for, to make sure that no step is forgotten so that accidents don't happen.

I've flown with a bunch of different professional pilots. There was only one that didn't use the ground and flight checklists religiously. He was also the only one I never really felt comfortable flying with, even if his natural ability to control an aircraft in flight was among the best.

The good pilots I know use the checklists with the same discipline and diligence that they apply to all their other flying skills. They try to do everything better on this flight than the last one and spend time thinking about how to do the next one better.

For sure there are legal implications, as there are for anything else where humans are involved...

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[Talus1]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

...most often our SOPs (Standard Operating Procedures) specify that most checklists are do-verify not callouts. Meaning we do the flow out of memory and the verify it after instead of reading it step-by-step. This means that not only are we using a tried and true method of making sure we didn't forget anything, but at the same time we are making our memorization of the procedure better.

THIS!

This is absolutely the right way to use checklists! You use the checklist every time but also learn the checklist by heart and reinforce it every time. That way you know the drill if you run into an emergency where you have to react so fast you don't have time to reach for the checklist. Your SOPs should tell you to check the checklist as soon as possible afterward anyway so you know the risk if you missed a step.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Talus1

As somebody who used to work in aviation safety I can categorically state that flight checklists are written by engineers, not lawyers. They aren't there for liability reasons. They are designed to save lives by making sure that every step is followed and not forgotten. Good pilots use them religiously, even if they know them by heart after a few times. It is super easy to forget a step or forget to check something and you never know when that might become critical. Accidents are rarely the result of a single failure. Typically a bunch of minor things are missed, any one of which, if not missed, would have prevented the accident. The problem is that there is rarely a consequence for a single forgotten step, so as humans we get sloppy. Thats what checklists are for, to make sure that no step is forgotten so that accidents don't happen.

I've flown with a bunch of different professional pilots. There was only one that didn't use the ground and flight checklists religiously. He was also the only one I never really felt comfortable flying with, even if his natural ability to control an aircraft in flight was among the best.

The good pilots I know use the checklists with the same discipline and diligence that they apply to all their other flying skills. They try to do everything better on this flight than the last one and spend time thinking about how to do the next one better.

For sure there are legal implications, as there are for anything else where humans are involved...

The comment was ironic. The real meaning of irony not the new one. Most people now call it sarcasim.
I fully appreciate the importance of checklists and use them every day on equipment safety reviews even though I have been doing those reviews for 30 years and even write half of them.

[p1l0t]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

The comment was ironic. The real meaning of irony not the new one. Most people now call it sarcasim.
I fully appreciate the importance of checklists and use them every day on equipment safety reviews even though I have been doing those reviews for 30 years and even write half of them.

It's so hard to tell sarcasm on the nternet

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[babydriver]

Originally Posted by themadscientist

Gary Oldman is the greatest character actor of our generation.

I have seen so many movies of his, but I don't think I every really appreciated his range like I should. Certainly no insult to some actors who basically play themselves in every movie, Bill Bob Thornton for example. It takes skill to notice you are one-dimensional and pick roles that fall in your narrow range. Gary, though, wow, I can't imagine a role he couldn't pull off.

Notice how none of these characters are role models? Except maybe the little green man.

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

It's so hard to tell sarcasm on the nternet

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Italics.

[Cole]

I wanna say cheers to a certain member on here, who agreed to a price, time and location for me to purchase a set of coils from. Then, selling them to someone else earlier today with the explanation "they offered asking price and came to pick them up". Damn, I always forget that some people just don't get that a deal is a deal. I probably would have paid a bit more and drove a bit longer to pick the coils up too, had that been mentioned to me this morning. Ah well. More money in my pocket.

[Guff]

Originally Posted by Cole

I wanna say cheers to a certain member on here, who agreed to a price, time and location for me to purchase a set of coils from. Then, selling them to someone else earlier today with the explanation "they offered asking price and came to pick them up". Damn, I always forget that some people just don't get that a deal is a deal. I probably would have paid a bit more and drove a bit longer to pick the coils up too, had that been mentioned to me this morning. Ah well. More money in my pocket.

Hey aforementioned member who slighted @Cole,


YOU'RE A FUCKING ****.

Sincerely,
Somebody who will probably ban you.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

It's so hard to tell sarcasm on the nternet

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

I thought that he was pretty ovious in the flow and context of the discussion.

[dvasqu01]

Originally Posted by Cole

I wanna say cheers to a certain member on here, who agreed to a price, time and location for me to purchase a set of coils from. Then, selling them to someone else earlier today with the explanation "they offered asking price and came to pick them up". Damn, I always forget that some people just don't get that a deal is a deal. I probably would have paid a bit more and drove a bit longer to pick the coils up too, had that been mentioned to me this morning. Ah well. More money in my pocket.

Someone needs a beer

[p1l0t]

Originally Posted by babydriver

Notice how none of these characters are role models? Except maybe the little green man.

Meat bag isn't a role model?

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[themadscientist]

Originally Posted by Cole

I wanna say cheers to a certain member on here, who agreed to a price, time and location for me to purchase a set of coils from. Then, selling them to someone else earlier today with the explanation "they offered asking price and came to pick them up". Damn, I always forget that some people just don't get that a deal is a deal. I probably would have paid a bit more and drove a bit longer to pick the coils up too, had that been mentioned to me this morning. Ah well. More money in my pocket.

That's weaksauce.