What do you drive - MT or AT?

[naikaidriver]

I have to admit, everyone is behaving admirably this time around. Usually these AT vs. MT threads turn into a flame war within a few pages.

Thank you all!

If I may offer one parting thought about the AT...

I have owned nothing but sports cars for the last 24 years. Every single one of them was a manual whether it was a 4 speed, 5 speed or 6 speed. Some were muscle cars and one was Nissan's Godzilla. I can't stand automatics.

The auto in my wife's tC makes me want to commit a violent crime every time I drive it. I test drove an automatic RX8 once that made me want to crash it into a pole or throw buckets of manure on it. I travel for a living and rental cars are NEVER manuals! Drive a new Sonata and it can't make up its mind what gear it wants to be in.

I still bought an auto FRS.

I test drove the MT and AT and I went with the AT. I LOVE the AT in this car! Its brilliant as far as ATs go and the locking torque converter works like a charm to ensure the engine and transmission stay connected. It never once feels like a slush box and I think its a disservice to call it one. Add the rev matching and extremely fast shifting, it reminds me of the E46 M3 transmission.

While the FRS may still use a torque converter similar to your average soccer-mom's minivan. Don't be so short-sighted to lump it into the same category. Its not.

Don't believe me? Drive one.

Scott

[shawnperolis]

Could people please stop saying that "exotic sports cars use automatic transmissions!!!!" because that just isn't true. Sports cars have automated manual transmissions with very sophisticated dual clutch systems. This is very different than the slushbox in the FRS/BRZ.

I'm not saying anything is wrong with buying the auto, but don't justify it based on a misconception.

[naikaidriver]

Originally Posted by shawnperolis

Could people please stop saying that "exotic sports cars use automatic transmissions!!!!" because that just isn't true. Sports cars have automated manual transmissions with very sophisticated dual clutch systems. This is very different than the slushbox in the FRS/BRZ.

I'm not saying anything is wrong with buying the auto, but don't justify it based on a misconception.

Everything you said about the comparison between the auto in the FRS and a DCT is spot on and they are apples and oranges. The auto in the FRS is brilliant and performs very well but it is nothing like a DCT mechanically.

Still, its nearly as inaccurate to lump this transmission and torque converter into the same category as a Prius, minivan, or other mundane mommy-mobile. They just aren't in the same league.

Scott

HAHA!! Post number 666! Get me a young priest and an old priest!!

[Sonolin]

Originally Posted by naikaidriver

I have to admit, everyone is behaving admirably this time around. Usually these AT vs. MT threads turn into a flame war within a few pages.

Thank you all!

If I may offer one parting thought about the AT...

I have owned nothing but sports cars for the last 24 years. Every single one of them was a manual whether it was a 4 speed, 5 speed or 6 speed. Some were muscle cars and one was Nissan's Godzilla. I can't stand automatics.

The auto in my wife's tC makes me want to commit a violent crime every time I drive it. I test drove an automatic RX8 once that made me want to crash it into a pole or throw buckets of manure on it. I travel for a living and rental cars are NEVER manuals! Drive a new Sonata and it can't make up its mind what gear it wants to be in.

I still bought an auto FRS.

I test drove the MT and AT and I went with the AT. I LOVE the AT in this car! Its brilliant as far as ATs go and the locking torque converter works like a charm to ensure the engine and transmission stay connected. It never once feels like a slush box and I think its a disservice to call it one. Add the rev matching and extremely fast shifting, it reminds me of the E46 M3 transmission.

While the FRS may still use a torque converter similar to your average soccer-mom's minivan. Don't be so short-sighted to lump it into the same category. Its not.

Don't believe me? Drive one.

Scott

Good post!

I definitely agree the A/T on this car is very good. The excitement for me just seemed to wear off, when I wasn't driving it at 100%. But when I was, boy was it fun! Really cool experience, just keeping your hands on the wheels, hit the paddle, and you fly. It shifts almost instantly, faster than I can shift my manual for sure.

It just didn't really do it for me, putting around town. The "engagement" wasn't there, unless I was slamming the throttle 100%, blip downshifting every corner. And even in a pretty "slow" sports car like this, its still not very possible to do that "legally" .

I'm probably just young, though. I bet in 20+ years, if I had the same choice, I (might) go with the auto. But knowing how rare manual cars will be in the future, I'd probably just have to do that to show my support for it.

It really comes down to owner preference. My test drive of the A/T fr-s just left me smiling cheek to cheek. Each car really does give the user the same feeling the twins are known for. I guess it just comes down to - do you want to row your own gears, or do you want to leave it in drive (with the ability to go balls out with the paddle shifter every now and then)?

Either way, you honestly can't go wrong. I recommend each person to at least drive both cars before making your purchase. Don't jump on an auto, if its the only car left on the lot and your anxious to own one like me (stupid...). Cool thing is - even if you do, you still have the same car that will give you the same feeling when you push it to your limits. Both cars give much more smiles per dollar than just about any other new car in the price range (maybe even double the price!).

I love my fr-s

[blanco]

It's a great car either way. Me personally, I bought the only fr-s on the lot and it was AT. Never owned a manual. After 1,000 miles I find myself wanting to press a clutch. I still love my car but now have a desire to own it as a MT. If I can financially do it, great. If not, I still get to enjoy an amazing car. It offers an experience unlike any I've ever had.

BRZ or FR-S can't go wrong!




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[DylanFRS]

MT because even my wife refuses to drive an auto...

You bought the FRZ "because it is fun" and then argue that the AT is faster...

You know what is even faster than an AT FRZ?

Focus ST...

Yes, I know the ST doesn't come in an auto but the point is that you would rather have a FRZ over a Focus because it is more fun despite the Focus being faster, so your point that the auto FRZ is faster is completely irrelevant...

You know the way (almost) everyone with RWD looks down on people with FWD cars? Well that is how people who drive manuals feel about auto drivers.

(Note: I like the combining of FRS and BRZ to FRZ for simplicity)

[Brzetto]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

MT because even my wife refuses to drive an auto...

You bought the FRZ "because it is fun" and then argue that the AT is faster...

You know what is even faster than an AT FRZ?

Focus ST...

Yes, I know the ST doesn't come in an auto but the point is that you would rather have a FRZ over a Focus because it is more fun despite the Focus being faster, so your point that the auto FRZ is faster is completely irrelevant...

You know the way (almost) everyone with RWD looks down on people with FWD cars? Well that is how people who drive manuals feel about auto drivers.

(Note: I like the combining of FRS and BRZ to FRZ for simplicity)

The Focus ST isn't faster overall, it's pretty much a tie. It's faster in a straight line but since when are straight lines any fun. The Focus has 252hp to compensate for it's 3200 lbs weight, the BRZ has only 200hp but weighs 500 lbs less.

[HotLeopardMama]

Originally Posted by Connoisseur

The Focus ST isn't faster overall, it's pretty much a tie. It's faster in a straight line but since when are straight lines any fun. The Focus has 252hp to compensate for it's 3200 lbs weight, the BRZ has only 200hp but weighs 500 lbs less.

...I don't remember how to drive stick, but managed to do some donuts with my AT and no ebrake usage this past Sunday. It's so fun!

How hard would it be to do donuts in a Focus ST? I'd like to see if my friend could learn to do donuts in his ST and take me for a ride-along.

[UMB FR-S]

Originally Posted by excited86

Another advantage of AT is I can hold my girl's hand when I drive.

lol haha is that really a high priority on your list?

mine is a FR-S in MT and i never even considered anything else. Every other car i've owned has also been MT including my other car which is a nissan frontier with a 6 spd.

[UMB FR-S]

Originally Posted by shawnperolis

Could people please stop saying that "exotic sports cars use automatic transmissions!!!!" because that just isn't true. Sports cars have automated manual transmissions with very sophisticated dual clutch systems. This is very different than the slushbox in the FRS/BRZ.

I'm not saying anything is wrong with buying the auto, but don't justify it based on a misconception.

that's because people who buy exotic sports cars are not actually automotive enthusiasts. they are rich old people who don't care about the car for performance reasons as much as it is a status symbol. Many high end cars don't even offer manuals anymore like Ferrari because the dual clutch automated manuals are faster now. As an enthusiast I could never replace the connected feeling you get while rowing your own gears with the minuscule amount of lap time saved.

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by Connoisseur

The Focus ST isn't faster overall, it's pretty much a tie. It's faster in a straight line but since when are straight lines any fun. The Focus has 252hp to compensate for it's 3200 lbs weight, the BRZ has only 200hp but weighs 500 lbs less.

Don't have to look far, top google result when I did BRZ vs Focus ST. Motortrend tested it at just over 1 second faster around Willowsprings. Let's also not forget about when they did the GTI vs the FRS and the GTI was 2 seconds faster:

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...z/viewall.html

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by HotLeopardMama

...I don't remember how to drive stick, but managed to do some donuts with my AT and no ebrake usage this past Sunday. It's so fun!

How hard would it be to do donuts in a Focus ST? I'd like to see if my friend could learn to do donuts in his ST and take me for a ride-along.

Not hard with a couple of cafeteria trays. In fact, I would venture to say it is easier to do donuts in a Focus (or any FWD car for that matter) on trays than in an FRS without.

Granted, a cars ability to do donuts is not my measure of fun.

[Brzetto]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

Don't have to look far, top google result when I did BRZ vs Focus ST. Motortrend tested it at just over 1 second faster around Willowsprings. Let's also not forget about when they did the GTI vs the FRS and the GTI was 2 seconds faster:

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...z/viewall.html

MT had a BRZ and Focus ST in their Lightning Lap segment, the BRZ was a couple of seconds faster.

[HotLeopardMama]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

Not hard with a couple of cafeteria trays. In fact, I would venture to say it is easier to do donuts in a Focus (or any FWD car for that matter) on trays than in an FRS without.

Granted, a cars ability to do donuts is not my measure of fun.

Clearly my car knowledge is lacking, my apologies, but why would a FWD car need trays to slide around?