For those who've had TOB replaced

[radroach]

And the snout that it sits on. I don't know the part number but its about $100-120 from a parts store.

[Rican_D]

Ok so I had my TOB replaced around August I think. I also did the valve spring recall work done pretty recently, and after that I get this random honk noise when pressing the clutch. I've made them aware of it, but if course I take foreman on a drive, and I can't get the sound to happen. Anybody have this experience? And thoughts on what this is?

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[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by Rican_D

Ok so I had my TOB replaced around August I think. I also did the valve spring recall work done pretty recently, and after that I get this random honk noise when pressing the clutch. I've made them aware of it, but if course I take foreman on a drive, and I can't get the sound to happen. Anybody have this experience? And thoughts on what this is?

My TOB started making the occasional "honk" noise intermittently @ ~40k miles on my 2013 and like you, I could not replicate it on demand. It eventually degraded enough around 50k that I could make it happen on demand but by that time the noise was less of a 'honk' and more of a grinding. The TOB was clearly failing. The dealership did NOT replace it under warranty much to my dismay.

I replaced it myself with the SKF bearing. The clutch, PP, fork and shaft were all OK.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...lassic&page=11

SKF p/n: N4111
https://www.amazon.com/SKF-N4111-Bea.../dp/B000CKLLAQ
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...2FiCfF9ZUcUtG6

Benefits of this Bearing:

Additionally, a self-aligning design allows the clutch release bearings to control clutch conditions associated with the misalignment of drivetrain components.

I now have 45k miles on it and since I've converted my car to a race car, it also has 10 races and 2 test days on it too - still sounds and performs like the day I installed it.





:knocks on wood:

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Rican_D

Ok so I had my TOB replaced around August I think. I also did the valve spring recall work done pretty recently, and after that I get this random honk noise when pressing the clutch. I've made them aware of it, but if course I take foreman on a drive, and I can't get the sound to happen. Anybody have this experience? And thoughts on what this is?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6010 using Tapatalk

I get the random honk every now and then. It is something to do with the master or linkage and is not the TOB. Not really an issue as far I I can tell.

[Rican_D]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

My TOB started making the occasional "honk" noise intermittently @ ~40k miles on my 2013 and like you, I could not replicate it on demand. It eventually degraded enough around 50k that I could make it happen on demand but by that time the noise was less of a 'honk' and more of a grinding. The TOB was clearly failing. The dealership did NOT replace it under warranty much to my dismay.

I replaced it myself with the SKF bearing. The clutch, PP, fork and shaft were all OK.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...lassic&page=11

SKF p/n: N4111
https://www.amazon.com/SKF-N4111-Bea.../dp/B000CKLLAQ
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...2FiCfF9ZUcUtG6

Benefits of this Bearing:
I now have 45k miles on it and since I've converted my car to a race car, it also has 10 races and 2 test days on it too - still sounds and performs like the day I installed it.





:knocks on wood:

Thanks, well then I need I need to contact original dealer that did the TOB work. No reason it should be failing so soon.

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[Rican_D]

@Tcoat You also? I find it really odd since my TOB is new. The honk started after the valve spring replacement. I haven't noticed any negative reactions like you said. Just annoying that I can't figure out any condition that causes it. Just really annoying to hear. I'm already dealing with steering column rattle as it is.

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[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I get the random honk every now and then. It is something to do with the master or linkage and is not the TOB. Not really an issue as far I I can tell.

Originally Posted by Rican_D

@Tcoat You also? I find it really odd since my TOB is new. The honk started after the valve spring replacement. I haven't noticed any negative reactions like you said. Just annoying that I can't figure out any condition that causes it. Just really annoying to hear. I'm already dealing with steering column rattle as it is.

Rican - Tcoat makes a solid point. My 'honk' then eventual failure could very well not be related - like I said, when I was able to reproduce on command it was not the same 'honk'. Also when I replaced mine I re-greased everything likely eliminating the cause of the honk. If you're idling in neutral and then engage the clutch pedal you should NOT hear any new sounds, in fact you should only hear your transmission stop spinning (less sound). If you're hearing new sound when you engage your TOB - that's probably something to address. Honk or not, if no extra sound when engaging TOB - you're probably hunky dory.



In other news - I'm a believer (without proof) that removing the clutch assist spring under the pedal likely alleviates burden on the TOB in addition to making the clutch feel vastly superior.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Rican_D

@Tcoat You also? I find it really odd since my TOB is new. The honk started after the valve spring replacement. I haven't noticed any negative reactions like you said. Just annoying that I can't figure out any condition that causes it. Just really annoying to hear. I'm already dealing with steering column rattle as it is.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6010 using Tapatalk

My TOB failed in a most spectacular way since I waited too long after it started making noise.


The "honk" sound I get is directly related to the operation of the clutch hydraulic system. There is a thread or two about it on here someplace. The TOB noises were radically different and started out as a light whine when the clutch was engaged to a banshee howl that you could almost play a song just by varying the pressure on the pedal. It then went silent for a bit before literally melting down completely.
The occasional time I get the honk it has always been exactly the same noise and it has existed since the car was new and still pops up now and then 130,000 miles later even with a whole new clutch.

[Ultramaroon]

You guys talking about the creak on releasing the clutch pedal?

[Rican_D]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Rican - Tcoat makes a solid point. My 'honk' then eventual failure could very well not be related - like I said, when I was able to reproduce on command it was not the same 'honk'. Also when I replaced mine I re-greased everything likely eliminating the cause of the honk. If you're idling in neutral and then engage the clutch pedal you should NOT hear any new sounds, in fact you should only hear your transmission stop spinning (less sound). If you're hearing new sound when you engage your TOB - that's probably something to address. Honk or not, if no extra sound when engaging TOB - you're probably hunky dory.



In other news - I'm a believer (without proof) that removing the clutch assist spring under the pedal likely alleviates burden on the TOB in addition to making the clutch feel vastly superior.

When I'm in a complete stop, and press the clutch/engage gear I don't get any honk noise. Only occurs during driving and I have not been able to link it to any specific situation. Not a very loud honk but still annoying. Really does sound like something that might need some more lubrication. Just would love to narrow down the issue. I hear it coming from driver side but I can't narrow down the location. Ugh! Lol

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[Rican_D]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

My TOB failed in a most spectacular way since I waited too long after it started making noise.


The "honk" sound I get is directly related to the operation of the clutch hydraulic system. There is a thread or two about it on here someplace. The TOB noises were radically different and started out as a light whine when the clutch was engaged to a banshee howl that you could almost play a song just by varying the pressure on the pedal. It then went silent for a bit before literally melting down completely.
The occasional time I get the honk it has always been exactly the same noise and it has existed since the car was new and still pops up now and then 130,000 miles later even with a whole new clutch.

I already went through the whole TOB thing. That sound was horrible.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6010 using Tapatalk

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

In other news - I'm a believer (without proof) that removing the clutch assist spring under the pedal likely alleviates burden on the TOB in addition to making the clutch feel vastly superior.

It does not place any burden on the TOB. While I understand this personally through experience, a quick explanation will support my assertion.


The hydraulic circuit being self-adjusting/equalizing, opens to the reservoir at the very top of pedal travel. This can be proven firsthand by pulling the top of the clutch fork forward and squeezing the fluid from the slave cylinder back into the reservoir.


It'll take a couple pumps of the clutch to move it back, or just go have a beer and wait. If the spring is installed, the interesting over-center cam effect can be observed as well. The pedal will stick to the floor with the first pump because there's nothing pushing it back.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

If the spring is installed, the interesting over-center cam effect can be observed as well. The pedal will stick to the floor with the first pump because there's nothing pushing it back.

I'm still not with you. The over center cam effect definitely explains why the pedal feels the way it does with the spring but it does not appear to eliminate the tension on the pedal at rest - only reduces it. My hands and eyeballs definitely observed that the spring is still acting upon the pedal with some tension at rest. With the spring removed the pedal now has free play at rest. Not all over-center cam designs eliminate sprung tension at rest.

edit: I bled my clutch at the last race weekend (no spring) and the pedal returns after pushing out the fluid. With the spring the pedal stayed glued to the floor.


2nd edit: I'm gonna go lay upside down under my dash with a flashlight now just because I'm not totally sure... damn you Ultramaroon!


3rd edit: Ultra is right. (there, I said it.. now get off my lawn!) The spring does remain under tension but the sprung mechanism swings forward and backward at the top throughout the stroke and passes a lever point. Once it's front of the lever point it's actually assisting the pedal to the upward (rested) position, once is passes over the lever point it's assisting the pedal downward. This lever point that the sprung mechanism passes through it what's causing the awful pedal feel - but it's clear it's not creating a "rested foot on pedal" scenario that's accelerating TOB wear.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

2nd edit: I'm gonna go lay upside down under my dash with a flashlight now just because I'm not totally sure... damn you Ultramaroon!

haha... suh-kerrrrr