Tell me about Thunderhill and Your Brakes

[Cjymiller]

So I'm cooking my brakes. For the last couple of track days, I've reached the point where the brakes will become hot enough where I cannot get ABS to engage coming down into turns 10, 14, and 1. My fluid is 2 months old and now discolored, and my rotors were turning blue after hot sessions. The last couple laps of the session result in me having to extend my braking distances 15-20% to account for the fade.

I have the following:


Stock Calipers
Stock Rotors
Hawk HPS pads
Stainless Lines
Hankook V12 255/17
Wedsport TC105n 17x9
Torque RT700 Fluid

I run a 2:15 pace with the cyclone. When you are driving Thunderhill what is your approximate time, what is your setup, and what is your fade like? Trying to avoid getting a BBK for the 3 - 4 days per year at the track and looking for alternative solutions.

[swarb]

Hps are entry level street pads. Many would even say they aren't trackable. Suggestion to step up to a better hybrid pad like project mu hc+800 or winmax w3/w4 or go straight to a track pad like project mu club racer/winmax w5.

[FR-Sky]

My brake is also cooked, running stock 36000 miles brake fluid, stock rotor,stock brake pad. It was my biggest mistake,,but oh well,I learned what to do next time.

First time track,,fastest time 2:27

255/40/17 indy 500
stock caliper
stock rotor
stock pad
stock brake fluid 36000miles.
stock brake line

I need sway bar bigger sway bar as well, my body roll is crazy.
Thinking about 22mm front whiteline sway bar and project mu club racer pad, and brake fluid

[strat61caster]

Try more aggressive pads.

I've been running Carbotech XP10's on otherwise stock hardware with Motul RBF600 since I roasted the stock ones on my second track day, I haven't been able to fade them, but I'm not terribly quick. This is stock springs, dampers, with some camber added up front, 215 wide ZIISS on stock wheels.

Thunderhill E&W, w/ cyclone, T7W-T10W bypass, ~3:55 which is probably a 4:05+ minute lap on the true Thill full course, probably a good 10s off a fast driver, but I know I left a ton on the table, wasn't trying to set any records that day

Laguna Seca is a better benchmark for me, the two days I went after frying the OE pads I was able to hammer out a lot of 1:54-1:56 laps without a hint of fade, traffic providing of course.

Edit: I never tracked Laguna with more camber up front, only tires and brake pads/fluid.
And I didn't like the XP10's for the street too loud, I couldn't keep them bedded in and quiet, but swapping back and forth is relatively minor inconvenience for 3-4x per year imo.
No regrets jumping from stock to XP10's, CSG claims they're beginner friendly and aside from the noise I don't see any downsides (other than cost at nearly $400 a set).

[FirstWinter]

As others have said you should step up your brake pads. Everything else you have is fine and your brake fluid choice is excellent. With upgraded pads I doubt a BBK would be necessary or even worth it if you don't do that many track days.

[exE36M3]

Yeah, track days have a wonderful way to telling you how OEM quality your FRS/BRZ parts *really* are.

I had my stock pads cooked by lap 4 at Laguna Seca.

[Tenino]

RT700/stock rotors are fine, upgrade the pads to Project Mu Club Racer or Carbotech XP 10.

Stock N/A power + GT86 does not chew up front pad/rotor like the S2000; no need for a BBK. If you continue to have brake issues after upgrading pads/fluid, you are over-braking at Thunderhill.

Edit: Are you engaging ABS on purpose at the track?

[ndsleep612]

I'm running Project MU B-Force pads front and rear along with their brake fluid. It squeaks when I brake in the city, but it takes about two track days to get the pads running well.

Usually in our cars, you won't need to brake much at T-Hill and Laguna. It's somewhat similar to a Miata but larger.

A few track instructors told me never to put on the emergency handbrake after pulling in from hot laps. Rather shut off the car and put it in first gear. Since the pads are already cooking, no need to start a BBQ with the rotors.

[Cjymiller]

Originally Posted by Tenino

Edit: Are you engaging ABS on purpose at the track?

I don't do it on purpose, I try to get right underneath the ABS threshold during my normal braking on track. I mentioned ABS to illustrate that I can be standing on the pedal hard, and the system is hot enough that it lacks any ability to reach the ABS threshold.

[hpde_addict]

No issues with brake fade, but I'm a pretty slow driver - 2:20 on the Cyclone layout. Project Mu Club Racer pads, Motul RBF600 fluid, and 225/45R17 Hankook R-S3. I think I did get some fade at Laguna Seca as a beginner with MPSS and Carbotech XP8 though.

[Tenino]

Originally Posted by Cjymiller

I don't do it on purpose, I try to get right underneath the ABS threshold during my normal braking on track. I mentioned ABS to illustrate that I can be standing on the pedal hard, and the system is hot enough that it lacks any ability to reach the ABS threshold.

Upgrading the pads will fix your brake fade then.

Hawk HPS are no where close to actual track pads, rather closer to OEM. If you are looking for the in between pad for street and track use the answer is none. Buy a set of track pads Pmu CR, XP10, W5/6. If money is tight, last i checked some people were selling some used Pmu CR's on CL.