Please don't hate - LSx vrs 2Jz

[wutsaiu]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

Big fan of watsuai's build. He is not the norm though is he?

Recall what I said about T56 boxes being broken or on the way there?

Watsuai has a picture of the input shaft from his T56 that has seen better days.

[IMG]httphttps://s17.postimg.org/qxggbuf1r/IMG_0433.jpg://[/IMG]

Budget builds are great, but it's a roll of the dice with used parts.
Almost every single problem I've run into in my build has come down to garbage used/cheap parts. Spun bearings on a high km engine, T56 blowing up, cheap fans not cooling enough, etc. Even if you get a cheap LS engine, the rest of the parts to do the swap don't get any cheaper. You could easily spend more on little swap parts than the cost of the engine. I don't regret my build at all but I wish I had the money some of these guys have so I could have done it all with new reliable parts. Even now I'm driving around with a T5 transmission temporarily until I finish building my new trans.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

Big fan of watsuai's build. He is not the norm though is he?

Recall what I said about T56 boxes being broken or on the way there?

Watsuai has a picture of the input shaft from his T56 that has seen better days.

[IMG]httphttps://s17.postimg.org/qxggbuf1r/IMG_0433.jpg://[/IMG]

Of course, I'm agreeing to your point.

[Da Brz]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

I also heard about the fantasy of cheap LS power. And even had a yard that offered a reasonable price on "Any Engine" like you mention.

Recyclers are not stupid. Your selection is going to be iron block truck engines with over 100k miles with Automatic gearboxes; they know what aluminum blocks and low-mileage units are worth.

Have you priced a 6 speed for an LS engine? Expensive and broken is the intro price. New and about to fail seems to be the higher end of the scale. And we need a clutch and clutch actuation mechanism, so lets budget for that.

Your junkyard motor is going to want to be rebuilt. That thing that GM does with cylinder deactivation kills them pretty young. Myself, I don't drive junk engines in such an expensive project. Budget about 3k for rebuilding the long-block with a decent cam.

That truck intake and truck accessories are not going to cut it, so budget for that. Need a harness and controller along with some HP Tuner (or whoever) program$

So, no, I don't believe in inexpensive LS power.

Actually, the AFM wasn't introduced on the trucks until 07. 2006 and earlier will be bulletproof and easier to find, even.

And as for 100k... not to sound like my dad, but that's literally just getting broken in for those engines. My buddy tunes as a side job and one of his client's 4.8 finally died at 600k miles. I myself had 165k on my old 4.8 before I sold it like an idiot. There wasn't a thing wrong with the motor.

As for old T56s. Well, rebuild it yourself if you need to. Or find a different transmission to use. I'm seeing $3k on Jegs for a "new" T56 from Hurst.

You may not believe in inexpensive LS power, but I don't believe in inexpensive engine swaps, period. It can all be done for cheap but it takes patience and networking and weekends traveling to junkyards (which is why I abandoned my last project).

And finally, "inexpensive LS power" is just that, no one said anything about transmissions, lol.

[Da Brz]

And FYI, 2007-2010 are the GM truck engines to avoid. But I'll concede they really shot their own reputation in the foot with that AFM garbage.

But even during those years, not all LS truck engines had AFM. None of the 4.8s had it. Not all of the 5.3s had it.

And if you can get a 6.0 non-AFM 2500 work truck engine, those are even more bulletproof than the others.

[NOHOME]

My point would be that if you build a car with used parts, your results are going to be a used car; with all the unpredictability and ongoing maintenance issues of that class of car.

Even if you use recycled parts, the total project is going to cost silly money, and even with new and/or rebuilt parts, you are going to have enough little things to debug over the first year of driving, that the fewer used parts you use the less frustrated you will be while you sort the car ( and probably end up spending the time and money that you saved the first time.)

My current project uses either all new or rebuilt components for every system. The goal is to build a new car, not one that needs the ongoing maintenance of a 100k + old beater.

So, yeah, if you are building a GRM Challenge car, then I am all for make shit work, cause you are going to scrap the thing after the party, but if you are building a hot rod for the old lady to DD, then don't skimp on the parts.

[Da Brz]

If you're buying all new parts, nothing will be cheap. Period.

And I'll reiterate that 100k miles isn't anything to a domestic V8. I'd give one to my wife to DD.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Da Brz

If you're buying all new parts, nothing will be cheap. Period.

And I'll reiterate that 100k miles isn't anything to a domestic V8. I'd give one to my wife to DD.

I agree with that ^

[Jaden]

Not 20K quid, 20K USD, 20K quid would be like 26K usd...besides selling original motor trans etc makes the net a lot less if you do it right, especially if you can fab yourself. Me, personally, I would never do a swap if I couldn't do the majority of the work myself.

Jaden

[Bfranklyn86]

Originally Posted by Jaden

Not 20K quid, 20K USD, 20K quid would be like 26K usd...besides selling original motor trans etc makes the net a lot less if you do it right, especially if you can fab yourself. Me, personally, I would never do a swap if I couldn't do the majority of the work myself.

Jaden

Yeh I meant $20k, sorry. A swap is totally off the table for me. The only part of it I could do myself is the 'bank transfer to tuning shop' part. It also seems like 6 weeks isn't long enough to do it, given how many things can potentially go wrong. I also doubt that the engine and tranny would offset a huge amount of the cost - I'm guessing $3k or something???

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by Bfranklyn86

Yeh I meant $20k, sorry. A swap is totally off the table for me. The only part of it I could do myself is the 'bank transfer to tuning shop' part. It also seems like 6 weeks isn't long enough to do it, given how many things can potentially go wrong. I also doubt that the engine and tranny would offset a huge amount of the cost - I'm guessing $3k or something???

The right way to do it here in the states is to create an account on like copart and get a wrecked donor car. If it's wrecked in the right way, all of the parts that you need will still be good to go.

For instance, wrecked camaro ss' are going for like 6-10K. Having a donor car can give you access to a lot more parts that when having to fab them or purchase them separately would cost a lot more.

If you can get one at auction on the low end, say $6k, then a kit, colin's can module, then sell your engine and trans, be able to weld and fab some stuffesses yourself, you can walk away spending only about 12-15K, including supporting mods.

In fact I bet with some body work and or a wide body kit, you could weld up some rear sub frame adapters that would allow you to just use the camaro IRS and Big brakes in the rear, giving you stronger axles, stronger rear end that's easily modifiable with final drive gear sets etc. all included for the cost of the wrecked camaro.

Jaden