Throwout bearing.

[Justin.b]

Originally Posted by bdanisi

I authorized the replacement of the bearing. But the question is since my clutch has hot spots is that going to contribute to it having a shorter life? The service guy just said it won't be smooth. I don't care about that I just want to make sure that this clutch isn't going to die in th next 10 or 20k miles. They said it is at about half life.

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Clutch job is usually a lot more labor than parts. If they have it open and you can afford the parts, I'd have the clutch replaced while they're in there. Dealers will usually only install OEM parts, so you may just want to have them do the bearing and then go back to the great shop you were dealing with for an upgraded clutch.

-Justin

[Nickosport]

A damaged throwout bearing could definitely prevent the clutch from engaging/disengaging properly. If the clutch wont engage or disengage right, then the clutch will slip - hotspotting the flywheel. Ask the inspector how he knows that the flywheel was hotspotted before the TO bearing failure. I guarantee you he wont have an answer for that - there is no way to determine which happened first.

On another note - put the car in neutral at stoplights if you don't already. That will save the TO bearing.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Spartarus

No. Not possible. The melting bearing wouldn't cause anything like enough heat, and is not close enough to the friction surface.........



.

@Spartarus ....... THAT was an excellent post ........


humfrz

[bdanisi]

Originally Posted by Nickosport

A damaged throwout bearing could definitely prevent the clutch from engaging/disengaging properly. If the clutch wont engage or disengage right, then the clutch will slip - hotspotting the flywheel. Ask the inspector how he knows that the flywheel was hotspotted before the TO bearing failure. I guarantee you he wont have an answer for that - there is no way to determine which happened first.

On another note - put the car in neutral at stoplights if you don't already. That will save the TO bearing.

I never do the rest in first gear at a stop thing. And I can't contact they inspector as they refuse to release his information.

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[zc06_kisstherain]

another bearing problem...

[fumanchu1]

Originally Posted by Spartarus

None available. ACT makes one. Quality uncertain.

Forced induction / increased HP will not affect throwout bearing life. Throwout bearing life depends 95% on driving/clutch technique and 5% on driving / traffic conditions.

wouldn't it create additional wear with the upgrade clutch due to the added pressure ?

I couldn't tell you I've only driven 1-2k km on the car bought it and it started doing it on the drive back(6hr drive). Either it was just defect, either it didn't like the long drive or Dan rode the clutch lol

[fumanchu1]

Originally Posted by Justin.b

Subarus seem to kill them off at a faster than normal rate. A friend had one go bad in his WRX at 26k miles. I had a clutch replaced by the dealer on my outback last year and the throw-out bearing started making the awful squeak of failure before its next oil change (I have the parts, just need a weekend to pull the car apart and replace it).

Another friend replaced all the clutch parts immediately after taking delivery of his STi because the stock parts have such a crap reputation.

-Justin

I'm at 35k not miles, kilometers and although it has not gone yet I feel like it will be going soon (rattle, grinding noise) Guess I'll give the ACT bearing a shot or maybe I'll see if any bearing shops in the region can custom make me one from... I dunno Adamantium lol

[stevesnj]

I don't know the exact warranty stipulation on the TOB but here's info on warranty issues.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96221

Here's the 2013 Warranty info on the transmission and dispute process

[Spartarus]

Originally Posted by fumanchu1

wouldn't it create additional wear with the upgrade clutch due to the added pressure ?

I couldn't tell you I've only driven 1-2k km on the car bought it and it started doing it on the drive back(6hr drive). Either it was just defect, either it didn't like the long drive or Dan rode the clutch lol

Ah. You didn't mention that before or I didn't see it. Yes, a stiffer clutch will increase throw out bearing wear.

All I was saying is increased horsepower alone will not increase throwout bearing wear.

[Tt3Sheppard]

This forum is flooding with this throw out bearing issue. Should just show Toyota corporate these threads, maybe they will wake up.

[Spartarus]

Originally Posted by Tt3Sheppard

This forum is flooding with this throw out bearing issue. Should just show Toyota corporate these threads, maybe they will wake up.

I have never understood this attitude.

Your car is a wear part. The whole car. Sh*t wears out. SOMETHING has to wear out first. If it wasn't this it'd be something else. Just be thankful it isn't a Kia Rio and the "wear part" in question isn't the timing belt snapping before the maintenance interval on an interference engine.

These bearings seem to consistently wear out between 50k and 70k depending on clutch usage and technique, but many people have gone way over that without problems. This almost always sounds operator-induced.

The clutch inspection interval is 15,000 miles. The wear on the bearing will most likely be audible in a test several thousand miles before it goes out. Almost all the users with the problem have reported driving the car with a strange/bad noise coming from the clutch. The ones who didn't report it probably should have (didn't notice or didn't correlate a bad noise to a mechanical issue). Correct maintenance means by the time you hit 60K the clutch has been inspected 4 times.

Originally Posted by bdanisi

That sounds like you know what your talking about and this seems like a battle I will not be winning. Bummer.

I feel your pain. I wish I was the bearer of better news.

Originally Posted by Justin.b

If the damaged throw-out bearing was preventing smooth engagement / disengagement of the clutch, it certainly could have contributed to the damage to the friction surfaces.

Originally Posted by Nickosport

A damaged throwout bearing could definitely prevent the clutch from engaging/disengaging properly.

No. It can't, it didn't, and it won't. On cars with a hydraulic TOB where the slave cylinder and TOB are combined, that might be true under very specific conditions, but in this car, with a clutch fork, that just isn't possible. You could replace the TOB with a flat metal donut and the clutch would work perfectly (until friction melted the clutch fingers... It wouldn't work for very long.). The fingers would eventually be damaged and the clutch would howl like a banshee when you pressed it, but it would work just fine.

[Justin.b]

Originally Posted by Spartarus

No. It can't, it didn't, and it won't. On cars with a hydraulic TOB where the slave cylinder and TOB are combined, that might be true under very specific conditions, but in this car, with a clutch fork, that just isn't possible. You could replace the TOB with a flat metal donut and the clutch would work perfectly (until friction melted the clutch fingers... It wouldn't work for very long.). The fingers would eventually be damaged and the clutch would howl like a banshee when you pressed it, but it would work just fine.

When the bearing starts failing, it can score up the aluminum transmission snout that houses the input shaft. Trying to slide the bearing on the scored-up surface definitely can cause issues in clutch engagement / disengagement.

-Justin

[Spartarus]

Originally Posted by Justin.b

When the bearing starts failing, it can score up the aluminum transmission snout that houses the input shaft. Trying to slide the bearing on the scored-up surface definitely can cause issues in clutch engagement / disengagement.

-Justin

I'll concede it's possible... but it there would have to be a lubrication issue as well. That or you'd have to drive on a bad bearing for quite a while, and even then. You would definitely feel it in the pedal, and hear the bearing screaming... the rotating part doesn't touch the snout. To score the aluminum, you would need a motherf*cker of a side load in transit. I'll admit a bad bearing and lack of lube could cause that much sideloading, but at that point you're driving on a component that is positively identifiable as broken.

[Justin.b]

Google it. You'll see no shortage of image results for shredded Subaru transmission snouts.

The bearing goes bad, causing the sleeve to spin on the shaft, which scores it all to hell. I'm not sure if this is a Subaru-only thing, or just something that happens a lot more often on Subarus than other cars.

Here's the google image results for 'Subaru transmission snout' https://www.google.com/search?q=suba...ih=661&dpr=1.5

Edit: I have a spare transmission for my Miata in the garage and I went out and took a look at it. The Miata transmission has the snout as a separate piece that is bolted onto the trans housing. It looks like Subaru transmissions have the snout molded into the housing, which both makes the snout weaker and also introduces a split line running lengthwise on the snout. The Miata snout is one piece with no split line.

I haven't pulled the transmission out of my FR-S yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if the transmission uses a Subaru-style housing. If so, prepare for throw out bearing problems or invest in one of the snout sleeves.

-Justin