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FR-S / BRZ vs.... Area to discuss the FR-S/BRZ against its competitors [NO STREET RACING]


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Old 12-01-2018, 12:44 PM   #127
thill
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Funny I had a 2013 BRZ Limited when they came out and then needed more room and traded in for a 15 WRX when those came out. Fast forward a few years and I have a 17 Focus RS. 7K miles into the car I love it. I can fit my whole family in the car in a pinch (my wife drives an 18 Odyssey). I live in New England so it's perfect for all weather with just a simple tire swap.

But I may change jobs in a few months which will mean a longer commute. I'm contemplating grabbing a used FT86 as both a project car as well as something I can drive 2-3 days a week to work. You can find low low mileage nice ones for under $20K which is real bargain for what these cars are.

Also thinking about a Miata and 370Z but my heart always goes back to the FT86.
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Old 02-18-2019, 08:54 AM   #128
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Funny I had a 2013 BRZ Limited when they came out and then needed more room and traded in for a 15 WRX when those came out. Fast forward a few years and I have a 17 Focus RS. 7K miles into the car I love it. I can fit my whole family in the car in a pinch (my wife drives an 18 Odyssey). I live in New England so it's perfect for all weather with just a simple tire swap.

But I may change jobs in a few months which will mean a longer commute. I'm contemplating grabbing a used FT86 as both a project car as well as something I can drive 2-3 days a week to work. You can find low low mileage nice ones for under $20K which is real bargain for what these cars are.

Also thinking about a Miata and 370Z but my heart always goes back to the FT86.


I just bought a 2016 brz as a daily to keep my truck from getting miled out. We have a 16 focus rs that my wife daily drives. The brz definitely has a more comfy ride than the focus and gets better gas mileage. I put some Continental winter tires on the brz and it get around fine up here in the winter. My other summer car is an fd rx7. The reason i bought the brz was i wanted a light weight (hence no 370z) front engine, rear drive car that could somewhat parallel the driving experience of the rx7. Plus, the brz has ac, a radio, heated seats and power steering. The price of a pre-owned one sealed the deal for me. Ive only had mine a couple of weeks, its a great little car!


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Old 02-19-2019, 11:37 AM   #129
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I bought one of the early RS's to hit Florida.

Paid MSRP.

It spent 1 day at the dealership for warranty work in almost 30whatever thousand miles before I traded it for the 1LE. My BRZ spent MANY days at the dealer for various warranty repairs so it's pretty damn funny when I hear about how unreliable the Focus RS is.

The only reason I sold mine is because it would overheat a bit at the track, even with a massive oil cooler, during the summer in Florida. Otherwise, it was probably the best mixed usage car I've ever owned. It's an absolutely wonderful daily driver.
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Old 02-20-2019, 10:14 AM   #130
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I bought one of the early RS's to hit Florida.

Paid MSRP.

It spent 1 day at the dealership for warranty work in almost 30whatever thousand miles before I traded it for the 1LE. My BRZ spent MANY days at the dealer for various warranty repairs so it's pretty damn funny when I hear about how unreliable the Focus RS is.

The only reason I sold mine is because it would overheat a bit at the track, even with a massive oil cooler, during the summer in Florida. Otherwise, it was probably the best mixed usage car I've ever owned. It's an absolutely wonderful daily driver.
How rough is the ride quality compare to the Brz? I always read the suspension is really stiff. I can't imagine it is any worse than the twins?
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Old 02-20-2019, 11:51 AM   #131
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How rough is the ride quality compare to the Brz? I always read the suspension is really stiff. I can't imagine it is any worse than the twins?
With the suspension in sport/track mode it's one of the worst riding cars I've ever been in. Even in normal mode it's badly overdamped, in sport/track suspension mode it's insanely overdamped.

The dampers were not well tuned for the car IMO.

Now to be fair I never really noticed how bad it was in Florida where we have generally smooth roads but I HATED it in California when I drove a buddies from San Fran to Thunderhill raceway and back. I could have also been used to the MUCH better riding Camaro by that point.

The CTR actually has a really good ride in comparison. Golf R is too soft in my admittedly limited experience.

I don't recall the BRZ with stock suspension to be harsh at all but I haven't driven one with stock suspension in 5? years.
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Old 02-20-2019, 06:05 PM   #132
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Sold my Focus to get the 86. Speed is not everything. Handling is.
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Old 02-21-2019, 04:26 PM   #133
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The style of BRZ already won the RS.
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Old 02-24-2019, 12:47 PM   #134
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How rough is the ride quality compare to the Brz? I always read the suspension is really stiff. I can't imagine it is any worse than the twins?
It can be rough on bad pavement. Late 2017 and all 18 RS's have revised dampers that help. Even just some inexpensive springs will reduce the pogo effect of the RS, but if your sensitive to it and drive on bad roads you are likely looking at coilovers. KW makes a nice setup that allows you to still use the stock settings between normal, Sport and track. Matt Farrah did this to his RS.

My biggest complaint on the RS is the seating position and seat angle. You sit way up and the seats have an odd incline. They are comfortable seats (I have the Recaros) but it makes me feel disconnected from the road.

The RS is a great all purpose car and handles like a beast in dry, rain, snow, etc. But compared to s BRZ it doesn't have the same driver feel.
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Old 02-26-2019, 10:41 AM   #135
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There's a Focus RS that goes to my local track. The guy that owns it is admittedly a much better driver than I am. I've ridden with him, and he knows that car intimately, he's exceptionally good at getting it to rotate to apex on command without overdoing it, something I'm still working on myself. Despite this, when we're on track together he's constantly ending up giving me the point bys. Neither of us is really "racing", since we're just getting seat time on an open day, but I consistently set better laptimes than he does, despite my admission that he's a better driver and the fact he's on stickier tires. I was out there on Michelin PS4S with a few heat cycles, and he was out there on Toyo R888Rs.

I honestly think the way power delivery works in the Focus RS, the higher CoG, and the much worse seats all play a part in how it creates driver confidence and what results it generates on track. It's not even a question for me, I'd take a BRZ w/ good tires and brakes over a Focus RS any day.
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Old 02-26-2019, 06:03 PM   #136
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There's a Focus RS that goes to my local track. The guy that owns it is admittedly a much better driver than I am. I've ridden with him, and he knows that car intimately, he's exceptionally good at getting it to rotate to apex on command without overdoing it, something I'm still working on myself. Despite this, when we're on track together he's constantly ending up giving me the point bys. Neither of us is really "racing", since we're just getting seat time on an open day, but I consistently set better laptimes than he does, despite my admission that he's a better driver and the fact he's on stickier tires. I was out there on Michelin PS4S with a few heat cycles, and he was out there on Toyo R888Rs.

I honestly think the way power delivery works in the Focus RS, the higher CoG, and the much worse seats all play a part in how it creates driver confidence and what results it generates on track. It's not even a question for me, I'd take a BRZ w/ good tires and brakes over a Focus RS any day.
The faster car on faster tires with the faster driver being slower times either account's for a lot of confidence or something is up. I'd have thought the fancy awd machine would be easier to drive than the basic sports car.
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Old 02-26-2019, 06:40 PM   #137
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There's a Focus RS that goes to my local track. The guy that owns it is admittedly a much better driver than I am. I've ridden with him, and he knows that car intimately, he's exceptionally good at getting it to rotate to apex on command without overdoing it, something I'm still working on myself. Despite this, when we're on track together he's constantly ending up giving me the point bys. Neither of us is really "racing", since we're just getting seat time on an open day, but I consistently set better laptimes than he does, despite my admission that he's a better driver and the fact he's on stickier tires. I was out there on Michelin PS4S with a few heat cycles, and he was out there on Toyo R888Rs.

I honestly think the way power delivery works in the Focus RS, the higher CoG, and the much worse seats all play a part in how it creates driver confidence and what results it generates on track. It's not even a question for me, I'd take a BRZ w/ good tires and brakes over a Focus RS any day.
You are either selling yourself short or far overselling his talent.

I've driven both on track multiple times and modified BRZs (mine and @Opie car) haven't beaten my laptimes in my old stock (I don't count brake pads and fluid as mods and everything I track has that) Focus RS.

And it's not like a .5 second different.. it's a 5-6 second difference a lap at Sebring.

Just for reference sebring laptimes in my cars are consistently:
Camaro (stock): 2:26-2:27
Focus RS (stock): 2:34-2:35
Opie's BRZ (h/e/tune tarmac 2 re71r): 2:40 (I did 2:39s with my old BRZ, haven't run the new one yet)
Integra Type-R (i/h/e and 2 way coilovers): 2:39

Now perhaps on a very tight short technical track the weight of the RS will allow the BRZ to be right there with it, but on a normal track I just don't see that happening.

I'm not putting the FT86 down, but they just don't have the power to compete with the more powerful cars. They make up time under braking and, to an extent, corner speeds although I don't recall them having higher much higher corner speeds than the Focus. I also haven't looked at the Solo data from the Focus in about 2 years to remember the corner speeds/etc.
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Old 02-26-2019, 07:03 PM   #138
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You are either selling yourself short or far overselling his talent.


<SNIP>

Now perhaps on a very tight short technical track the weight of the RS will allow the BRZ to be right there with it, but on a normal track I just don't see that happening.



It's possible I'm overselling his talent. I'm not good enough to really judge how good somebody else is, I suppose, but I felt like he was better than I was at any rate.



FWIW, my local track /is/ a tight short technical track. It's 1.8 miles, 11 turns, and is sponsored by a local Mazda dealer and pretty much 90% of the vehicles on it are Miatas.



I couldn't explain to you why, but that's what went down *shrug*
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Old 02-27-2019, 01:28 AM   #139
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It's possible I'm overselling his talent. I'm not good enough to really judge how good somebody else is, I suppose, but I felt like he was better than I was at any rate.



FWIW, my local track /is/ a tight short technical track. It's 1.8 miles, 11 turns, and is sponsored by a local Mazda dealer and pretty much 90% of the vehicles on it are Miatas.



I couldn't explain to you why, but that's what went down *shrug*
I've heard that Harris Hill is pretty friendly for the 86 from a buddy that used to live out in Texas so that could play a large role. The RS is HEAVY so it's not the absolute best on a very tight course, it will overheat tires quickly in that scenario.
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Too many cars.. never.
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Old 06-23-2019, 08:29 PM   #140
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Knowing jack shit what you want out of it, I say neither. Get a used 4 door civic for $8k and spend the $2k on hookers and blow.

FYI the $8k 4 door civic will be just as fast as the brz and the rs. The rs is a fat pig by the way.
Lol, that was gold!
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