|
Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain. |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
12-02-2014, 12:06 AM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Drives: 2014 86 GTS
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 168
Thanks: 131
Thanked 85 Times in 57 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Transmission Stock Capacity
Hey guys,
(search has been done) After seeing the "FA20 stock capacity" thread tumble into transmission breakage talk, it got me really concerned on my plans to go the forced induction route. Though these fears are mainly sparked through only one source @Reaper. As far as I understand it, the engine coupled with a really good tune seems to hold power really well (300 whp pump gas / 400 whp e85 or so on street driving). In my 2 years on the forums, most issues in general were tune/install related. The diff hasn't seen breakage either and is a Toyota unit (apparently good for 500 whp, don't quote me on that though). Unfortunately transmissions are the least upgradable part in the drive line and I think it would be really interesting to try spark discussion on what it is capable of. My personal targets are around 250-300 ft.lb, I understand any increase in power will technically lead to a reduced life and there are many variables to pin point an exact number but it would be interesting to know what you guys think about what torque level is considered "reliable" or "bulletproof" |
12-02-2014, 01:05 AM | #2 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Drives: 86
Location: 86
Posts: 186
Thanks: 119
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
i think 300whp is limits of gearbox for both manual and automatic for long safety.
this means max boost with E85 should be under 9psi. i think 7.5psi is good like avo kit for stock engine |
12-02-2014, 02:19 AM | #3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Drives: 2013 BRZ
Location: Norcal
Posts: 1,592
Thanks: 1
Thanked 623 Times in 378 Posts
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Torque is what breaks gearboxes. At 300whp you're at around 220-240 ft/lbs torque.
I'd bet that 400 whp and 300 torque are prett safe numbers, depending on how you drive. These numbers as a drift car with lots of clutch kicking, maybe not. Same thing for a big, sticky tired road race car, where the box would get super hot. For street and AX and general hooning, I bet 400whp and 300torque are pretty safe IMO. |
12-02-2014, 07:48 AM | #4 |
in orbe terrum non visi
Join Date: Jan 2014
Drives: violent
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,747
Thanks: 279
Thanked 762 Times in 446 Posts
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
Stock cars are getting transmissions warrantied for excessive syncro wear.
400wtq will shear 4th with street tires everytime. I did it with 460whp 393wtq in just a few thousand miles on hankook ventus v12s. Not a grippy tire. @Synack sheared 4th with only 350whp I'm not sure his torque. He has stock suspension and 19 inch wheels. So he can't have too much grip. My first transmission the syncros died. Not power related at all. A faulty part. My second transmission had bad syncros as well and I sheared 4th while in boost. My 3rd transmission that's in the car now is a used one with 19,000 miles and shifts smoother than all the others. I've put 1000 hard miles on it and it hasn't broken yet. With stock fluid in it. The box is very very weak. Element tuning blew one up at around 400 hp and started running a cooler. I'm running a similar setup now and it's thermostatic but I haven't gotten it hit enough to turn on. It's been in the 30 and 40s here with cold slippery pavement. I don't think it's going to do much good honestly. I'm well educated in every available transmission swap for this car.
__________________
I have E85 where there isn't E85, that's my secret. http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=reaper+build
|
12-02-2014, 08:39 AM | #5 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Drives: 2013 Raven FRS 2JZ-GTE/V160 swapped
Location: Hampton, VA
Posts: 960
Thanks: 376
Thanked 623 Times in 315 Posts
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
Why not do a permanent fix instead of band-aids every time? |
|
12-02-2014, 01:39 PM | #6 | |
in orbe terrum non visi
Join Date: Jan 2014
Drives: violent
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,747
Thanks: 279
Thanked 762 Times in 446 Posts
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
8 - 10k for a v160 swap. 5.5k for a tremec swap and there's no guarantee it will shift past 7k rpm. Holinger quoted me 20k, so did quaife. I've only spent 500$ so far on transmissions. So I could buy 12 transmissions for the price of just a v160 box without the adapter kit. You want to give me the other 15k $? I'm also working with a few companies to build gearset for the stock box and waiting for that to pan out.
__________________
I have E85 where there isn't E85, that's my secret. http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=reaper+build
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Reaper For This Useful Post: | hmong337 (12-02-2014) |
12-02-2014, 02:00 PM | #7 |
Junior
Join Date: Aug 2013
Drives: a car
Location: Probably at school
Posts: 4,341
Thanks: 3,184
Thanked 2,512 Times in 1,502 Posts
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
So is Quality control just shit for these syncros or what?
__________________
"Ah! What music! They could have never imagined, those pioneers who invented the automobile, that it would posses us like this, our imaginations, our dreams. Men love women, but even more than that, men love CARS!"-Lord Hesketh
|
12-02-2014, 02:42 PM | #8 |
in orbe terrum non visi
Join Date: Jan 2014
Drives: violent
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,747
Thanks: 279
Thanked 762 Times in 446 Posts
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
Yes.
__________________
I have E85 where there isn't E85, that's my secret. http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=reaper+build
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Reaper For This Useful Post: | cdrazic93 (12-02-2014) |
12-02-2014, 02:54 PM | #9 |
Emperor JDM
Join Date: Jun 2013
Drives: '91 MR2 Gen3 3SGTE, '13 FRS
Location: Onterrible, Canada
Posts: 1,750
Thanks: 3,498
Thanked 909 Times in 495 Posts
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 3 Thread(s)
|
We need a cryo-treatment option.
__________________
|
12-02-2014, 03:10 PM | #10 |
in orbe terrum non visi
Join Date: Jan 2014
Drives: violent
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,747
Thanks: 279
Thanked 762 Times in 446 Posts
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
If you read the 4 other transmission threads you'll see its been done. Doesn't work. Factory gears are as hard and as strong as the space available allows them to be.
__________________
I have E85 where there isn't E85, that's my secret. http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=reaper+build
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Reaper For This Useful Post: | spitfire481 (12-02-2014) |
12-02-2014, 05:26 PM | #11 |
Junior
Join Date: Aug 2013
Drives: a car
Location: Probably at school
Posts: 4,341
Thanks: 3,184
Thanked 2,512 Times in 1,502 Posts
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Sooooo....QED iconel gear set anybody?
__________________
"Ah! What music! They could have never imagined, those pioneers who invented the automobile, that it would posses us like this, our imaginations, our dreams. Men love women, but even more than that, men love CARS!"-Lord Hesketh
|
The Following User Says Thank You to cdrazic93 For This Useful Post: | Dipstik-sportech (12-02-2014) |
12-02-2014, 06:50 PM | #12 |
in orbe terrum non visi
Join Date: Jan 2014
Drives: violent
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,747
Thanks: 279
Thanked 762 Times in 446 Posts
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
Inconel is not stronger. I've used Inconel in other applications before.
__________________
I have E85 where there isn't E85, that's my secret. http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=reaper+build
|
12-02-2014, 07:30 PM | #13 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Drives: Scion FR-S
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 686
Thanks: 597
Thanked 256 Times in 173 Posts
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Nah bro, MP35N gear set.
What is the strength of the gears being used? Inconel is fairly strong, we use 718 fairly often with a strength around 120 ksi yield for some of our oil equipment. Of course these materials have to meet NACE, so the strength is artificially limited for those applications. |
12-02-2014, 07:50 PM | #14 | |
in orbe terrum non visi
Join Date: Jan 2014
Drives: violent
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,747
Thanks: 279
Thanked 762 Times in 446 Posts
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
__________________
I have E85 where there isn't E85, that's my secret. http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=reaper+build
|
|
|
|
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
FA20 Stock Capacity | Swivel | Engine, Exhaust, Transmission | 143 | 04-08-2015 02:12 PM |
Oil Capacity for track use | smbstyle | Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting | 6 | 08-12-2013 04:47 AM |
Stock AISSIN Transmission Power Capacity | Don@Accelerated | Forced Induction | 37 | 07-03-2013 10:15 PM |
Manual transmission FR-S in-stock | scioneric | Dealer Cars | 1 | 01-09-2013 07:26 PM |
Hauling capacity, will they fit?! | CoRi J | FR-S & 86 Photos, Videos, Wallpapers, Gallery Forum | 3 | 06-24-2012 10:49 PM |