Impressions: HPDE in FR-S and ... did I glaze my pads?

[Skurj]

Originally Posted by donoman

I did notice that my braking was getting better yesterday. I'll try swapping the pads left and right this week. Now I'm deciding if I should do a pad/rotor upgrade or just go for a BBK up front. If I get the BBK I might as well get sticky tires. But if I get those I should get wider wheels that can accommodate wider tires. In which case i should get coilovers to lower the car a smidge.

And so it begins.... in my noobness I would have said go cheap and change to a more track oriented pad.. and then I priced out carbotechs...
But seriously do it... oh and get the 9" wheels with sticky tires you won't be sorry

Do your research first though. There are tires , brakes etc recommended on this site over and over, you won't be led astray.

Don't take just my word for it, but I am happy with carbotech pads, and Rs3 v2's..

[strat61caster]

Another vote for pads and don't forget fluids.

My stock pads still have a decent amount of life left after two track days, they were fading on the end of the second day and lost stopping power on the street afterwards, got track pads and fluid for the third track day and those will likely last me through most if not all of the year using the OEM pads on DD duty.

My rotors looked worse than yours, after a track day with track pads on it my rotors looked fresh and smooth.

Almost $500 for Carbotech XP10's and Motul 660, have project mu fluid on standby, no regrets.
Same $$$ for Dunlop Direzza ZII SS in OEM size.
Toss in a decent alignment and camber bolts to get -1.1 degrees up front and toe dialed in.
The car is much more capable than the driver in my case for the moment.

[CSG Mike]

When you're ready, we can help.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by donoman

I did notice that my braking was getting better yesterday. I'll try swapping the pads left and right this week. Now I'm deciding if I should do a pad/rotor upgrade or just go for a BBK up front. If I get the BBK I might as well get sticky tires. But if I get those I should get wider wheels that can accommodate wider tires. In which case i should get coilovers to lower the car a smidge.

OP if you need replacement stock-size rotors, it's fairly cheap to buy Centric blanks, about $200 for a full set. I usually carry a spare set for track days.

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Toss in a decent alignment and camber bolts to get -1.1 degrees up front and toe dialed in.

BTW I don't think strat61 meant that -1.1 was a target, just what he could get out of his camber bolts. The more negative camber you can get evenly up front, the better for handling. I got roughly -1.5 on SPC bolts if I remember correctly.

[donoman]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'm going to run these OEM rotors as I feel like they are cleaning up a bit and stopping power is coming back. I can't even see the back of the rotors for crying out loud! But I'm hoping the scoring isn't too bad back there.

If the rotors do clear up then I'll just run them and buy another set of OE rotors for backup. If they don't then I'll buy more fancy slotted rotors and some Stoptech pads. In either case I'm going to flush the fluid with RBF600 as per suggestions here and I think I'll get a dedicated set of track pads. There's nothing worse to ruin a Trackday than brakes not working and flying off course when something could have been avoided for $500. ;-)

Now I need to decide if I should buy wider wheels with stickier tires or just keep the stock wheels. My OE tires are in surprisingly good condition and probably have at least 10K miles left on them so I feel really bad throwing them away. One option is to pick up stock wheels and get a set of stickier tires for those but that's no fun is it???

Just stop me before I go out and put a full cage in this thing.

[jvincent]

I'd recommend doing what was suggested by a couple of people on this board regarding tires.

Run the stock ones until they are used up. They are good to learn on since they give a lot of feedback. After that switch to new tires.

The tires I am running now are better than stock for the track, but are not super sticky (Hankook V12s). Again, they are letting me learn the limits of the car progressively. Once these are toast I'll move to something stickier.

[Kimsey47]

Originally Posted by donoman

The funny thing is that I usually do this on my other cars. But the beauty of this car is that it drives so well in stock trim that I didn't think it was necessary. It did handle really well until that final session.

I was so excited about the trackday that I left home and realized I didn't pack a change of clothes ... I was wearing Walmart undies and socks the next day. I don't think my little brain could have handled a pad change for this one ;-)

Yeah, I know you said Walmart but my mind went straight to the Rain Man.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by donoman

Thanks for the advice guys. I'm going to run these OEM rotors as I feel like they are cleaning up a bit and stopping power is coming back. I can't even see the back of the rotors for crying out loud! But I'm hoping the scoring isn't too bad back there.

If the rotors do clear up then I'll just run them and buy another set of OE rotors for backup. If they don't then I'll buy more fancy slotted rotors and some Stoptech pads. In either case I'm going to flush the fluid with RBF600 as per suggestions here and I think I'll get a dedicated set of track pads. There's nothing worse to ruin a Trackday than brakes not working and flying off course when something could have been avoided for $500. ;-)

Now I need to decide if I should buy wider wheels with stickier tires or just keep the stock wheels. My OE tires are in surprisingly good condition and probably have at least 10K miles left on them so I feel really bad throwing them away. One option is to pick up stock wheels and get a set of stickier tires for those but that's no fun is it???

Just stop me before I go out and put a full cage in this thing.

Just finish off the tires first, and then get something stickier. It won't hurt to get more seat time with the car's limit kept lower intentionally.

You know, an option is to ship the car to us along with a retainer, and we can ship you back a monster after the build is completed

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Don't spend money on upgraded rotors. Get better pads/fluid first, then once you outgrow the thermal capacity of the stock rotors go to a quality BBK.

Wholeheartedly agree! On stock calipers, just get cheap centric premium blanks and spend your money on good pads and fluid. And ideally you would get a separate set of "street" AND "track" pads...the compromise pads are...well...a compromise.

Originally Posted by jvincent

I'd recommend doing what was suggested by a couple of people on this board regarding tires.

Run the stock ones until they are used up. They are good to learn on since they give a lot of feedback. After that switch to new tires.

The tires I am running now are better than stock for the track, but are not super sticky (Hankook V12s). Again, they are letting me learn the limits of the car progressively. Once these are toast I'll move to something stickier.

I agree again. It's helpful to build the car in stages so you can have a full system of suspension and brake components that match the tires you've chosen. Stock tires are fine with stock components (except pads and fluid!). You'll learn a lot and get comfortable with the car. Get some more track experience and move up to sticky street tires and you'll benefit from suspension upgrades and want to start thinking about a BBK. Get faster on the track and learn a little more....move on to r-comps and then you'll really want a quality suspension and that BBK.

Tire grip can change everything...not just laptimes and cornering force, but how much heat your brakes have to deal with, how fast you have to react to oversteer/understeer situations, ideal brake bias, and yes...even handling balance. Everything is affected. Also it means things you want get more expensive.

Building the car around tire choice while keeping in mind driver skill/style and safety is the right way to go.

- Andy

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

BTW I don't think strat61 meant that -1.1 was a target, just what he could get out of his camber bolts. The more negative camber you can get evenly up front, the better for handling. I got roughly -1.5 on SPC bolts if I remember correctly.

Yes, that is correct, thought about amending it but figured it would come up naturally. Out of curiosity do you know where you started from the factory? I think I was at ~-0.3, I was surprised I didn't get more but a couple of tenths is something I'll be unlikely to notice and camber plates should be in my future.

Alignment is a terribly underrated performance upgrade, definitely helped the inherent understeer this car comes with from the factory. Toe can have a huge impact on the car's stability/agility, zero toe in the rear left my car wandering all over the freeway, just a little bit of toe in brought it back to factory feel while still being more zero than the original setting, just a touch more responsiveness.

Hardcore performance driving seems to call for more than -2.0 degrees camber up front, that will be my target when I spend the money to get that adjustment, dial in with tire temps from there. At that point and beyond the tires will likely wear noticeably on the inside shoulder if daily driven at freeway speeds, minor sacrifice imo, but that's a personal choice.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Yes, that is correct, thought about amending it but figured it would come up naturally. Out of curiosity do you know where you started from the factory? I think I was at ~-0.3, I was surprised I didn't get more but a couple of tenths is something I'll be unlikely to notice and camber plates should be in my future.

Alignment is a terribly underrated performance upgrade, definitely helped the inherent understeer this car comes with from the factory. Toe can have a huge impact on the car's stability/agility, zero toe in the rear left my car wandering all over the freeway, just a little bit of toe in brought it back to factory feel while still being more zero than the original setting, just a touch more responsiveness.

Hardcore performance driving seems to call for more than -2.0 degrees camber up front, that will be my target when I spend the money to get that adjustment, dial in with tire temps from there. At that point and beyond the tires will likely wear noticeably on the inside shoulder if daily driven at freeway speeds, minor sacrifice imo, but that's a personal choice.

Sorry no idea what my factory alignment specs were, but every car does seem to be slightly different.

Agree on ideally having more than -2.0 degrees of camber up front. When the time comes to replace my factory suspension, I'll likely throw in camber plates and aim for -2.5 degrees. Also adjustable LCAs for the rear, as I'm slightly lopsided on my rear camber at the moment. Damn drunk Subaru factory workers!

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Also adjustable LCAs for the rear, as I'm slightly lopsided on my rear camber at the moment. Damn drunk Subaru factory workers!

Funny mine are too by >0.5 degree if I remember correctly, probably contributing to some inconsistency between corners. I'm not sure if mine is factory's fault or a curb I clipped a year or so back, in any case they're both well over -1.0 and not a huge limiter for me so I'm not in a hurry but the more I think about it...

[donoman]

OK, I can run these OE tires until they're burned up. My next HPDE is a double header which is a little bit why I'm worried. Don't want my tires going off after Day 1 and hosing Day 2.

I have to set a limit for this car since it is my daily driver. I won't run aggressive alignment or a BBK. I think good pads and fluid, wheels and street tires is where I'm going to draw the line. I gotta drive this thing to work.

[Hyper4mance2k]

Originally Posted by donoman

I would venture to say that driving this FR-S is just as fun as driving my 911.

Originally Posted by The NY Times

They’re 80 percent as entertaining as a Porsche 911 for about 20 percent of the price

Yup