Pop goes the 86

[smudge]

Originally Posted by Matt@Cosworth

understood

I know you're committed to the HKS parts but I would highly recommend sourcing a rod with a copper beryliium bush on the little end if you can

unless the HKS part does actually have this?

I don't think it does

The main reason for the HKS kit was having the extra capacity and the brand of HKS being well known so I've got the support if anything did ever go wrong

Parts are being sent off to Japan next week so fingers crossed we get a quick and positive response

[sam69]

Hey smudge with the Ozzy $ heading further south every day an LS 2 swap would be a possible option one would think .

So glad I got forged rods when I look at this

[Xero-Limit]

Sorry to hear about your failure. That rod doesn't look very beefy, and this is quite similar to the high torque FA20 failures we have seen with the stock hardware. If you plan on running anything over 300 torque the only real option is to use a quality forged rod, I.E. Carrillo, Manley, or whatever Cosworth may be releasing. You may see some cast type rods with strong bolts and stroker kits used for NA applications to save weight/cost. But you won't find that on a high HP application like you're trying to do here with the supercharger.

Not to say some other factors weren't what led to the failure, but regardless I'd only go with a stout forged H beam or I beam rod when doing such a build.

[smudge]

Originally Posted by moto-mike

Sorry to hear about your failure. That rod doesn't look very beefy, and this is quite similar to the high torque FA20 failures we have seen with the stock hardware. If you plan on running anything over 300 torque the only real option is to use a quality forged rod, I.E. Carrillo, Manley, or whatever Cosworth may be releasing. You may see some cast type rods with strong bolts and stroker kits used for NA applications to save weight/cost. But you won't find that on a high HP application like you're trying to do here with the supercharger.

Not to say some other factors weren't what led to the failure, but regardless I'd only go with a stout forged H beam or I beam rod when doing such a build.

Well that's exactly my issue. I would expect HKS to be high quality but it's confusing that the rods aren't forged liked the pistons and crank are.

We had about 260ftlbs at the wheels so we were closing in on the 300 figure you state but again HKS rate this kit to much higher figures so it shouldn't happen

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by smudge

Well that's exactly my issue. I would expect HKS to be high quality but it's confusing that the rods aren't forged liked the pistons and crank are.

We had about 260ftlbs at the wheels so we were closing in on the 300 figure you state but again HKS rate this kit to much higher figures so it shouldn't happen

have you considered there was an event of large detonation during the run or some kind of installation error?

I can understand stock motors are hit and miss and can blow up anytime. I also understand there's always the possibility an HKS part slipped through quality control (although would be unlikely).

Although I agree stock rods are weak, I for one have been running at 383 wtq for two years now, and they held on the dyno and a few runs at 471 wtq.

Of course, my experience does not mean any and all stock rods can take that much power. I know stock rods have bent on very mild builds, but man that kind of carnage with just around 260 lb-ft is unbelievable.

[MisterSheep]

In for updates.

[celek]

I am sorry to here this.
Although HKS states Forged Crank and Forged pistons.
Directly from the site it says:

POINT-2:CONNECTING ROD
Specific connecting rods have been designed to suit the longer stroke.
With no engine modifications, a special size crank pin has been set requiring new bearings.　
※The crank metals (Nissan RB26 & SR) must be purchased separately.
High strength I beam design and revised connecting rod bolt size.

Nothing about being forged. They are probably a Billet rod to reduce production costs VS making a new forging for the rod. Although all the new F motors from Subaru are going with a Angled rod we may be in luck in the future for kits from HKS.

The other reason I skipped HKS's full kit on my build and only purchased the crank was the Rod to stroke ratio. Although not stated on the site I doubt they got back to anything near stock which kills the top power and has a severe rod angle in the case against the cylinder wall. Which can result with the OP results.

Source:
http://www.hks-power.co.jp/en/produc...city/fa20.html

2.3ltr Build below
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63901

[ajc209]

Originally Posted by celek

I am sorry to here this.
Although HKS states Forged Crank and Forged pistons.
Directly from the site it says:


Nothing about being forged. They are probably a Billet rod to reduce production costs VS making a new forging for the rod. Although all the new F motors from Subaru are going with a Angled rod we may be in luck in the future for kits from HKS.

The other reason I skipped HKS's full kit on my build and only purchased the crank was the Rod to stroke ratio. Although not stated on the site I doubt they got back to anything near stock which kills the top power and has a severe rod angle in the case against the cylinder wall. Which can result with the OP results.

Source:
http://www.hks-power.co.jp/en/produc...city/fa20.html

2.3ltr Build below
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63901

All the data they present there is with CAMs on an N/A car... surprised they dont talk about the SC kit.

[smudge]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

have you considered there was an event of large detonation during the run or some kind of installation error?

I can understand stock motors are hit and miss and can blow up anytime. I also understand there's always the possibility an HKS part slipped through quality control (although would be unlikely).

Although I agree stock rods are weak, I for one have been running at 383 wtq for two years now, and they held on the dyno and a few runs at 471 wtq.

Of course, my experience does not mean any and all stock rods can take that much power. I know stock rods have bent on very mild builds, but man that kind of carnage with just around 260 lb-ft is unbelievable.

No sign of det whatsoever from the logs and for I'd be surprised if it was an install error for 2 main reasons:

1. Abbey Motorsport are well known here in the UK and have done all sorts of performance engine builds across various models for decades

2. It wouldn't last 2,100miles if there was something wrong from the start

So many ideas being thrown around at the moment. Until HKS come back with their report it's hard to say really

[Rifle]

Originally Posted by smudge

No sign of det whatsoever from the logs and for I'd be surprised if it was an install error for 2 main reasons:

1. Abbey Motorsport are well known here in the UK and have done all sorts of performance engine builds across various models for decades

2. It wouldn't last 2,100miles if there was something wrong from the start

So many ideas being thrown around at the moment. Until HKS come back with their report it's hard to say really

Best of luck, friend. Been following your build for quite sometime. You went out with a motor, I went out with a car!

[akiranakayama]

Wow. Carnage, wtf?! In for updates, as well!

[weederr33]

Are you going to go with HKS again once everything is fixed?

[smudge]

Originally Posted by weederr33

Are you going to go with HKS again once everything is fixed?

It all depends on what HKS come back with to be honest

There are 5 possible outcomes from this:

1. HKS find a fault, supply a new set of rod, compensate me for the block and installation cost - unlikely but hopeful with my contact at HKS being a good friend of mine so hopefully he can pull some strings

2. HKS find a fault and supply me with a new set of rods but won't compensate for any of the additional cost for the block or install - far from ideal as I don't really have the cash to pay for the block and install all over again

3. HKS don't offer anything and put it down to an installation issue. Then it's a difficult conversation with Abbey but this is very unlikely in my opinion

4. HKS don't offer anything but don't put it down to install issue - I MAY have a backup plan which will involve selling the 335 charger and a few other bits to fund the new project

5. Sell all the parts off the car and just be done with it - least likely option as I'm still in love with her

Time will tell...

[cdrazic93]

6. ???

7. Profit