CSG and RCE tag-team suspension Q&A thread! Ask us anything!

[DarkSideFRS]

is there any way i can just buy the RCE yellow bumpstops?

[MechOps]

Just installed RCE Tarmac 0. What is the best way to tighten the top strut nut with a partially/almost stripped Allen key socket?

What is the best way to measure height settings? On that note, what is the stock height of our cars?

[Kenny_LongWrench]

Originally Posted by DarkSideFRS

is there any way i can just buy the RCE yellow bumpstops?

Racecomp has them on their site. I think it was under replacement parts. I inquired with them a little while back and got some.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by MechOps

Just installed RCE Tarmac 0. What is the best way to tighten the top strut nut with a partially/almost stripped Allen key socket?

What is the best way to measure height settings? On that note, what is the stock height of our cars?

Impact driver, here's a video from Vorshlag, I stripped my struts as well and have been installing it this way for the last 6 months or so.

Measurements vary, I've done the highest edge of the bottom of the fender arch, many do the same. It's somewhere between 26" and 26.5" stock iirc. You could also measure at the pinch welds. Don't go crazy trying to get them even, if your ground is not perfectly level it'll never measure true.

[thetyrant]

HI guys hoping for some pointers if you can.


Currently running a supercharged GT86 over here in the Uk with our terrible roads!...car came to me with Tein StreetFlex (6kg f&r) along with EDFC active pro unit etc, ive not played with active just been trying to find a good manual setting for road and occasional track use.


I find the Streeflex ok on smoother roads and tracks but once it gets bumpy they struggle to keep car undercontrol, also comfort inside the car on these bumpy roads isn't good, I know these are a budget damper so looking to upgrade and current favourite options for me in Uk are as below.


Tein MonoSport - these are current favourite as I can then retain the EDFC which would be nice, just concerned they maybe too harsh for road use.


Ohlins DFV R&T - ive ran these on previous cars Evo9/MX5/135i with good results, spring rates on these kits for the 86 are a bit strange though so concerned it might be a problem, also price is quite a lot more which is a factor.


So any experience of Streetflex vs MonoSport vs Ohline R&T on most road use would be helpful for me to make a choice.


Thanks in advance

[WRBrzRX]

Originally Posted by thetyrant

HI guys hoping for some pointers if you can.


Currently running a supercharged GT86 over here in the Uk with our terrible roads!...car came to me with Tein StreetFlex (6kg f&r) along with EDFC active pro unit etc, ive not played with active just been trying to find a good manual setting for road and occasional track use.


I find the Streeflex ok on smoother roads and tracks but once it gets bumpy they struggle to keep car undercontrol, also comfort inside the car on these bumpy roads isn't good, I know these are a budget damper so looking to upgrade and current favourite options for me in Uk are as below.


Tein MonoSport - these are current favourite as I can then retain the EDFC which would be nice, just concerned they maybe too harsh for road use.


Ohlins DFV R&T - ive ran these on previous cars Evo9/MX5/135i with good results, spring rates on these kits for the 86 are a bit strange though so concerned it might be a problem, also price is quite a lot more which is a factor.


So any experience of Streetflex vs MonoSport vs Ohline R&T on most road use would be helpful for me to make a choice.


Thanks in advance

I wonder if expert tuning on the EFDC dials you in. They seem to be easy to screw up and difficult to perfect.

[thetyrant]

Originally Posted by WRBrzRX

I wonder if expert tuning on the EFDC dials you in. They seem to be easy to screw up and difficult to perfect.

No I think its a damper valving/quality issue I have really, the EDFC allows you to fine tune and adjust on the fly etc to trick it into doing fancy things, but it cant cure the base damping setup, don't get me worng the Streetflex for what it costs is pretty reasonable and on better roads and track its not an issue, start to throw in some bumps and poor surface though and I find it just doesn't feel very happy about it!

I did try dropping front spring rate to 5kg to see if that would improve things which it does to a degree, but the reduction in damper free travel you get as a result means your down to 15mm of bumptravel which is no good around here!.


Im going to speak to my contact at Ohlins about the spring rate situation with those, approx. 4kg front and 3kg rear now seems very soft and I imagine travel is an issue on that. Monosports ive been told are very good damper and a slight reduction in spring rate improved road manners a lot but be good to get more feedback on that.


Ive also been looking at the RSR Sport-I kits but importing isn't going to be cheap and im wary of having no UK backup should there be an issue, any longterm users of the RSR kits feel free to chip in on that.


Ian

[DeaconRoc]

Originally Posted by thetyrant

No I think its a damper valving/quality issue I have really, the EDFC allows you to fine tune and adjust on the fly etc to trick it into doing fancy things, but it cant cure the base damping setup, don't get me worng the Streetflex for what it costs is pretty reasonable and on better roads and track its not an issue, start to throw in some bumps and poor surface though and I find it just doesn't feel very happy about it!

I did try dropping front spring rate to 5kg to see if that would improve things which it does to a degree, but the reduction in damper free travel you get as a result means your down to 15mm of bumptravel which is no good around here!.


Im going to speak to my contact at Ohlins about the spring rate situation with those, approx. 4kg front and 3kg rear now seems very soft and I imagine travel is an issue on that. Monosports ive been told are very good damper and a slight reduction in spring rate improved road manners a lot but be good to get more feedback on that.


Ive also been looking at the RSR Sport-I kits but importing isn't going to be cheap and im wary of having no UK backup should there be an issue, any longterm users of the RSR kits feel free to chip in on that.


Ian

Whereabouts in the UK are you based? I'm UK based too and arrange Midlands meets - a recent one was specifically for people to try different suspension set ups.

I fear you'll never get the 86 suspension just as you want though. For bumpy UK roads I'm not convinced there is a perfect set up. I'm basing this on having gone through 6 suspension set ups on my 86 so far!

[thetyrant]

Originally Posted by DeaconRoc

Whereabouts in the UK are you based? I'm UK based too and arrange Midlands meets - a recent one was specifically for people to try different suspension set ups.

I fear you'll never get the 86 suspension just as you want though. For bumpy UK roads I'm not convinced there is a perfect set up. I'm basing this on having gone through 6 suspension set ups on my 86 so far!

Im up in Lake District/Cumbria so a bit north of you but if im willing to travel to try things if needs be, what suspension have you had so far out of interest and +/- of each ?

You sound like me as I tried 7+ setups on my last car before finding a best compromise.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by thetyrant

Ohlins DFV R&T - ive ran these on previous cars Evo9/MX5/135i with good results, spring rates on these kits for the 86 are a bit strange though so concerned it might be a problem, also price is quite a lot more which is a factor.

You can check also the Sachs performance coilovers which are not that expensive. Their dampers use experience from motorsports and they are very high quality. Spring rates in front are similar to Ohlins . On the rear they are progressive and initial compression is again similar to Ohlins. Afterwards, they become stiffer to prevent the occasional bottoming out.

In general the Ohlins and Sachs spring rates are not strange. For example, the Sachs rates are about 30% stiffer compared to stock spring rates. The stock car is known to handle very well. Not only on the road, but also on the track. So, this increase rate seems quite reasonable. On the other hand, I don't know what is the reasoning to increase the rates 100%-200%.

[thetyrant]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

You can check also the Sachs performance coilovers which are not that expensive. Their dampers use experience from motorsports and they are very high quality. Spring rates in front are similar to Ohlins . On the rear they are progressive and initial compression is again similar to Ohlins. Afterwards, they become stiffer to prevent the occasional bottoming out.

In general the Ohlins and Sachs spring rates are not strange. For example, the Sachs rates are about 30% stiffer compared to stock spring rates. The stock car is known to handle very well. Not only on the road, but also on the track. So, this increase rate seems quite reasonable. On the other hand, I don't know what is the reasoning to increase the rates 100%-200%.

Sachs are one ive no experience with personally although I know of others who have used them on Evos with good results, I will do some searching on them for the 86 etc.


Regards the Ohlins spring rates it is the soft rear im concerned with most as I know how bump travel limited these cars after a lot of measuring and testing this last few weeks, with such a soft rear spring im worried it may cause excess bumpstop issues, also understeer due to rear squat as its softer event than stock and although I know the preload is high on Phlins which will make a difference its still a concern, supposedly stock GT86 over here has 3kg front with 4kg rear and overall balance is good so why ohlins have swapped them around I need to ask the questions.


Different manufacturers have different theories with springs and damping rates of course, on a car like this with such limited travel I guess most are going high spring rates and then putting development into the damper to control it, ive been shocked on other cars with very high spring rates but quality engineered damping to control them making road comfort/compliance much better than expected.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by thetyrant

Sachs are one ive no experience with personally although I know of others who have used them on Evos with good results, I will do some searching on them for the 86 etc.

Regards the Ohlins spring rates it is the soft rear im concerned with most as I know how bump travel limited these cars after a lot of measuring and testing this last few weeks, with such a soft rear spring im worried it may cause excess bumpstop issues, also understeer due to rear squat as its softer event than stock and although I know the preload is high on Phlins which will make a difference its still a concern, supposedly stock GT86 over here has 3kg front with 4kg rear and overall balance is good so why ohlins have swapped them around I need to ask the questions.

Different manufacturers have different theories with springs and damping rates of course, on a car like this with such limited travel I guess most are going high spring rates and then putting development into the damper to control it, ive been shocked on other cars with very high spring rates but quality engineered damping to control them making road comfort/compliance much better than expected.

Yes the Ohlins are softer on the rear and they are not progressive. I don't have a personal experience, but it seems that they are focused more on good quality pavement. Spring rates for Sachs are front 38N/mm and rear 30-45N/mm (progressive).

You are correct about what other cars are using. It was the same for the first versions of Ohlin's and Bilstein's. Afterwards, they created revisions with much lower rates. A reasoning is that the car is lighter compared to others (e.g. evo's, bmw's etc.). It has also a very low center of gravity, so there is not much need to fight with the body roll. In fact, I expect the revised rates to give better results.

[DeaconRoc]

Originally Posted by thetyrant

Im up in Lake District/Cumbria so a bit north of you but if im willing to travel to try things if needs be, what suspension have you had so far out of interest and +/- of each ?

You sound like me as I tried 7+ setups on my last car before finding a best compromise.

There is a meet on the 17th if your free - there'll be several different suspension set ups there such as Tein Flex A's and Monosports, Moton's, etc.

I've had the stock set up, stock set up with AST lowering springs (this was generally good), Meister R GT1's, Meister R Zeta R's (the customer service was good and all my money was refunded), Tein Flex A's (these are my favourite road and occasional track dampers - the HBS really does take the edge off when hitting the bump stops) and Moton Clubsports which I've run with rates from 4kg front, 3kg rear through to 9kg front and 14kg rear and am currently on 7kg front and 8kg rear (if you track much the Motons are excellent but overkill for road use imo).

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by DeaconRoc

There is a meet on the 17th if your free - there'll be several different suspension set ups there such as Tein Flex A's and Monosports, Moton's, etc.

I've had the stock set up, stock set up with AST lowering springs (this was generally good), Meister R GT1's, Meister R Zeta R's (the customer service was good and all my money was refunded), Tein Flex A's (these are my favourite road and occasional track dampers - the HBS really does take the edge off when hitting the bump stops) and Moton Clubsports which I've run with rates from 4kg front, 3kg rear through to 9kg front and 14kg rear and am currently on 7kg front and 8kg rear (if you track much the Motons are excellent but overkill for road use imo).

What is your current wheel/tire combination?