GT86 vs Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.6 R

[D88]

I've seen a lot of reviews comparing the GT86 to the Genesis 2.0T but very few comparing it to Hyundai's Genesis Coupe 3.6 R. The 3.6 R is still very similarly priced so I feel it is an honest contender. What's the scoop on this comparison?

[husker741]

Originally Posted by D88

I've seen a lot of reviews comparing the GT86 to the Genesis 2.0T but very few comparing it to Hyundai's Genesis Coupe 3.6 R. The 3.6 R is still very similarly priced so I feel it is an honest contender. What's the scoop on this comparison?

It's faster, but it's a fat pig and can't corner worth shit. It's straight line performance is probably the only performance aspect that the Genesis wins in. It is also more of a touring car than a sports coupe.

/thread

[D88]

Originally Posted by husker741

It's faster, but it's a fat pig and can't corner worth shit. It's straight line performance is probably the only performance aspect that the Genesis wins in. It is also more of a touring car than a sports coupe.

/thread

Fair enough. This was my own impression too but here's what a Genesis owner said about the car (I know he will be biased but I really want to know if there is some merit to what he claims):

The Genesis coupe 3.8 R-Spec is the same price as the BRZ limited; the 3.8 drives MUCH differently than the 2.0T (I have owned both). The 3.8 r-spec is not only MASSIVELY faster and better equipped, it too can be slide happy and just as controllable as the BRZ; So while it is larger, heavier, and has a real back seat; it also generates 80%+ more power, grips better, stops better, and turns better than the twins.
If you are looking in that sub-30k market, and you MUST buy new, the 3.8 R-Spec is hands down the better car, and the better value; if you are look sub-30k and you are open to used and in the USA, the answer is always Corvette.

To which I argued:

Have you even driven a BRZ/FRS for any length of time? Have you read or viewed ANY reviews comparing the two?
If you're a horsepower junky then yes I will agree that the Genesis is hands down the car to buy. It's great for highway and city streets when you want that hard acceleration and it won't let you down in that department.
You can owe the better stopping and grip power to the better tires on the Genesis. While I don't agree with their choice of tires for the FRS, it was all due to making it a fun car to drive by encouraging tail happiness. For this reason, its difficult to compare the two cars in this regard. They seem to approach the driving experience quite differently.
It's when it comes to handling that I have to disagree with your conclusion. The Genesis is widely known to have problems in this department. Read/watch any review and there is always a point about the Genesis' lack of predictability, its bulkiness constantly showing and its inability to put down the power when you expect it.
Additionally, during spirited driving, the Genesis exhibits problems of early brake fade and the gearbox feels mushy and vague in the gear changes in comparison to an FRS.
The FRS/BRZ has been lauded for its nimbleness and predictability in the corners, its lightweight feel and sharp handling as well as a solid gearbox. Its downfall is clearly the lack of power in the straights which turns a lot of people off so for anyone looking to buy either a Genesis or FRS/BRZ, it comes down to what driving style you prefer. In any case, I don't think either one offers the best of both worlds straight from the factory.

And his inevitable response:

Yes I have; and I don't put a whole lot of stock in most reviews, as they are normally not worth the paper they are printed on. Especially in magazines and website that take marketing money from the companies that produce the cars they are reviewing. That is why you never see a 3.8 R-Spec test against a BRZ limited, despite the fact that they share a price tag.
I disagree with you, I have never heard any, nor have I in the hundreds of laps I have done in our own genesis have ever seen any hit of "lack of predictability"; the car is very predictable, from the factory, It will under-steer on turn in and rotate under power. It is VERY controllable and predictable.
The 3.8 R-Spec hands the twins their ass in every way in terms of performance and yes, IMHO even handling. The twins are good for those that want to drift around at 30mph on prius tires; but the ability to drift easily is not what I define as good handling. I want to see braking performance, stability, and mechanical grip in the suspension.
beyond hoon drifting in parking lots, the twins make excellent trainers for young drivers who are learning how to drive a RWD car. They however are not quick, and if you replace the tires with sticky ones, you completely jack the handling up; so they are an expensive tuning platform (both are equally shitting tuning platforms.)
In the interest of honesty, from the factory, The Gen coupe R-spec has a few things that need to be addressed before it really shows is worth, especially on the track.
1) The factory brake pads use 65% of the available pad to rotor contact patch. Buy some real pads that use the entire contact patch and the Brembo brakes shine.
2.) The car has staggered tire fitment from the factory to supply intentional turn in under-steer. Change all 4 tires to a 255 wide, sticky compound and this turn in under-steer goes away and it becomes neutral. (you can use the factory 19" rims)
3.) The car comes with camber bolts, but they are not installed (in a box in the glove box). You need to put them in and adjust the front camber to fine tune the turn in to your liking.
4.) An ECU Flash does WONDERS for the engine and throttle response
I like the twins, but they are just too slow, and honestly, I feel they are over priced. You get more of everything for you dollar on the Gen Coupe, and it is a much faster, better sports car all around, as well as a more comfortable car to commute in everyday (with a functional back seat).
Now if you were to say, what is the best sports car I can buy under 30k, I wouldn't recommend either of the two, I would tell you to go buy a 2008+ C6 Corvette with Z51, or an 02-04 C5 Z06 Corvette...

He seems to believe the exact opposite of what you claim and bases this on having driven a BRZ to compare with. What he said comes off as very opinion based especially when he instantly refutes anything that the reviewers have been saying (without evidence) stating that reviewers are just bought out by companies to favour one car over the other.

I found his inclusion of mods to make it better laughable and a futile argument but ignoring that annoyance, does anything else he said have truth to it?

[jebuwh]

I've driven both. Quite a bit. Not a chance in hell does the genesis handle better. It literally is a pig. Huge, heavy, bulky in every way. Sticky tires on the twins loses the slidey factor but the grip handling is epic. I drove both cars back to back in some canyons, and I would choose the twins every time.

[AllDayJonRay]

Originally Posted by D88

Genesis Guy - "In the interest of honesty, from the factory, The Gen coupe R-spec has a few things that need to be addressed before it really shows is worth, especially on the track.
1) The factory brake pads use 65% of the available pad to rotor contact patch. Buy some real pads that use the entire contact patch and the Brembo brakes shine.
2.) The car has staggered tire fitment from the factory to supply intentional turn in under-steer. Change all 4 tires to a 255 wide, sticky compound and this turn in under-steer goes away and it becomes neutral. (you can use the factory 19" rims)
3.) The car comes with camber bolts, but they are not installed (in a box in the glove box). You need to put them in and adjust the front camber to fine tune the turn in to your liking.
4.) An ECU Flash does WONDERS for the engine and throttle response."

He accepts that these things need to be addressed for the Genesis to "show it's worth", and we have to assume that he's only giving his opinion based on the cars performance after these modifications are made, yet he is unwilling to consider any of the same modifications for the twins, ignorantly claiming:

They however are not quick, and if you replace the tires with sticky ones, you completely jack the handling up

^^ This is an asinine claim, increasing the grip equally at all four corners does not 'completely jack the handling up'. It's funny that he's willing to make such a claim about molesting the cars intended handling performance by increasing grip equally all around, yet he finds it acceptable to remove the factory equipped staggered stance for a larger square stance.

If you're going to consider the Genesis in modified form, you should consider the 86 in comparable modified form. I have no doubt that the twin's handling outclasses the Genesis' on stock form. This would only be more pronounced if both had 255's all around, lol.

He's a jackass. He's in love with his Genesis, the same as we are in love with our 86's. He's not going to concede a single point, because he wants what he drives to be the better of the two.

[RoadKillGrill]

I test drove one while looking at the BRZ, but due to incentives and other things settled on a FRS 10 series.

For reference my daily driver was an 1987 MR2.

The Genisis on first impressions looks pretty good. It has power, and the interior looks nice. It was nice to be able to sit a person in the back seat.

But the ride quality on it was not so great, the roads around the dealership are full of cracks and potholes. The seat become uncomfortable and the car was oscillating on the bumps. The shifting didn't feel right, I didn't like the stock nob either and was planning to change it off asap.
The steering was the main part I was unhappy about, its a constant numb experience. I never felt I had direct control over the car, it felt like driving a cheap PC racing wheel with the force feedback on a constant pressure.

The gauges and stuff look cool with just window shopping the car but when driving are irrelevant, they are in the middle and too low to look at if you are driving so i guess its a show for your passengers.

The dealer was pressuring me into a buy to not go across the street to the Toyota/Sion dealer across the road but I did anyway. Driving the FRS on the same crappy roads really made it clear which one I'd enjoy more every day. The steering felt better the seats hugged me perfectly and the shifting was great. The A huge blocking pillar on the shoulder check was the only thing I initially didn't like on the FRS.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by D88

Fair enough. This was my own impression too but here's what a Genesis owner said about the car (I know he will be biased but I really want to know if there is some merit to what he claims):



To which I argued:

Have you even driven a BRZ/FRS for any length of time? Have you read or viewed ANY reviews comparing the two?
If you're a horsepower junky then yes I will agree that the Genesis is hands down the car to buy. It's great for highway and city streets when you want that hard acceleration and it won't let you down in that department.
You can owe the better stopping and grip power to the better tires on the Genesis. While I don't agree with their choice of tires for the FRS, it was all due to making it a fun car to drive by encouraging tail happiness. For this reason, its difficult to compare the two cars in this regard. They seem to approach the driving experience quite differently.
It's when it comes to handling that I have to disagree with your conclusion. The Genesis is widely known to have problems in this department. Read/watch any review and there is always a point about the Genesis' lack of predictability, its bulkiness constantly showing and its inability to put down the power when you expect it.
Additionally, during spirited driving, the Genesis exhibits problems of early brake fade and the gearbox feels mushy and vague in the gear changes in comparison to an FRS.
The FRS/BRZ has been lauded for its nimbleness and predictability in the corners, its lightweight feel and sharp handling as well as a solid gearbox. Its downfall is clearly the lack of power in the straights which turns a lot of people off so for anyone looking to buy either a Genesis or FRS/BRZ, it comes down to what driving style you prefer. In any case, I don't think either one offers the best of both worlds straight from the factory.

And his inevitable response:



He seems to believe the exact opposite of what you claim and bases this on having driven a BRZ to compare with. What he said comes off as very opinion based especially when he instantly refutes anything that the reviewers have been saying (without evidence) stating that reviewers are just bought out by companies to favour one car over the other.

I found his inclusion of mods to make it better laughable and a futile argument but ignoring that annoyance, does anything else he said have truth to it?

Why does he think a 3.8 r-spec with a heavier engine up front on an already front-heavy chassis will handle better than a lighter 2.0t r-spec?

And as you already know from any number of track comparisons out there, the 2.0t r-spec is a much flabbier/duller car on the track compared to the FR-S.

[R.S-HawK]

I just swapped from an FR-S to a Genesis Coupe 3.8 R-Spec about three weeks ago. Owned the FR-S for almost a year, but have not owned the Genesis Coupe long enough to make good judgement of the driving experience it provides, therefore will keep it very short.

• Yes, the Gen Coupe R 3.8 is far more powerful. If you really want to get into it, it all comes down to the figures, 348hp vs 197hp. 297ft-lb torque vs 151ft-lb of torque. 2.7 second difference to 60.

In the handling department however, there is (literally) no comparison.

• The FR-S handles like a dream. It was built to be more nimble. It is far smaller, and far lighter. The FR-S is a driver's car. Everyone here knows that, and therefore I'll leave it at that.

• The Genesis Coupe, on the other hand, is a Grand Touring Coupe. It is a big car, but it handles well. The 3.8L V6 is fantastic. The suspension is far softer (even in the R-Spec), and in exchange you're given a very good but rather disconnected ride that is complemented with a excellent interior. Putting it through a corner is not as effortless nor as entertaining as the FR-S, and because of the difference in suspension tuning and weight, you don't get the same feel for the speed of the vehicle.

With that being said, the reality here is that outside of their price, these two cars are not direct competitors.

• The FR-S is light, nimble and has a stiff suspension. Infinitely entertaining to drive. Far more like the S2000 and Miata than the Genesis Coupe.

• The Genesis Coupe is a Grand Tourer, with the R-Spec trim being an attempt to make it more of a driver's car (Six Speed Manual, Race-Tuned Suspension, LSD, Brembo Brakes, 19" Wheels). It competes with everyone, and no one. You certainly get a very complete package for the price though, one that's more in line to compete with the likes of the Infiniti G37 (or the new Q50) and BMW 435i.

Which one is better? You're comparing apples to oranges. Regardless, the point I try to make every time I get into argument about two or more different vehicles: It's all a matter of personal needs and/or preferences.

If I had the chance to, I'd own both.

RS.

[Venator]

I know that this is of a 2.0T GC but the comparison is pretty good.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...or_comparison/

[speargunsandracecars]

Never been a fan of the Genesis. I wouldn't buy one personally, but I am glad that it's being made. Hyundai did good work with their 1st sportscar offering. I imagine that the next generation, if there is one, will be better. In the end though, despite the similarities, they are different cars. The Genesis is more competitive with V6 Mustangs and Camaros.

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by noobcake

I dont know, But I was in an unfamiliar area recently and accidentally accelerated in front of a genesis while on the freeway, he was merging and it became one line. And this guy followed me up my a$$ until I got off the freeway and then eventually made a right turn to the gas station. Scared me for a bit. Thought it was going to end in some sort of physical confrontation but looks like he was in a hurry for some gas.

Not sure how this has any relevance to the topic.

[glorydays]

i love the look on genesis owner's faces when they see me and realize that they bought the wrong car. All i can think is... Too soon junior.

[Reaper]

i looked at the hyundai and then i also looked at FullBlownMotorsports 520WHP Stock motor dyno. Then i bough my frs and called fullblown. HP problems solved, and i still out corner the hyundai.

[jflogerzi]

The genesis coupe either 2.0T or 3.6 are great grand touring cars. I see them in the same light as the G37's. Great power, smooth, nice interiors, but numb. Not a sports car.