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BRZ First-Gen (2012+) -- General Topics All discussions about the first-gen Subaru BRZ coupe


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Old 03-29-2012, 03:25 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by switchlanez View Post
Can you provide any Subaru or Toyota examples?
Like EZ engine?
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Old 03-29-2012, 03:35 PM   #100
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but if there is to be a higher-strung NA version tuned for even more bHP/liter, wouldn't it make more sense to come from Toyota's engineers rather than Subaru?

Toyota does have some experience in making NA high bhp/liter engines (i.e. 2zz-ge and the LFA engine via Yamaha), but Subaru does not (traditionally more inclined to FI).

That being said, whoever does it, it would still be greatly appreciated.

And out of curiosity, while I wouldn't be surprised if the FA20 has variable valve timing, what about something like VTEC or VVTL-i?
i think the use of lift causes engines to not pass emissions anymore, the cars engine still has a lot left in it
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:14 PM   #101
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The BRZ does not have to keep 86x86, because it is not the Toyota 86. They could make it oversquared, and I am sure it is possible, as I heard plans of NA engine-kits from various tuners. Changing bore is possible, BMW changed stroke on the M3 GTS E92 and M3 CRT E90 while keeping exactly the same engine, capacity went from 4.0l to 4.4l.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:13 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses View Post
Marketing. It's a square engine, there's room for improvement: oversquare.
I know there are benefits to changing the bore, I am just asking if Subaru really wants to deviate from the plans of their new business (capital) partner right now. If Toyota has given them their blessing, I guess the point is moot.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:30 PM   #103
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Nah lift can pass emissions, new Honda engines still have variable lift. I think it's a matter of most manufacturers feeling like it's not worth it, they'd rather just lose some top end, or lose some low end torque, and save the money (I don't know how much they save, this is speculation).

The rod ratio is quite bad already so stroking it would likely lose some revs, and the specific output would go down. Boring it out slightly to 2.2L could make 250ps more easily achievable, more top end focused cams/intake could put the 7000rpm torque at perhaps 175 lb-ft, peak power at 7500, that would get you around 240hp. Still would need more revs though. 8500rpm would make things pretty easy, but I'm guessing that takes rather extensive modifications.
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Old 03-30-2012, 04:36 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by serialk11r View Post
Nah lift can pass emissions, new Honda engines still have variable lift. I think it's a matter of most manufacturers feeling like it's not worth it, they'd rather just lose some top end, or lose some low end torque, and save the money (I don't know how much they save, this is speculation).

The rod ratio is quite bad already so stroking it would likely lose some revs, and the specific output would go down. Boring it out slightly to 2.2L could make 250ps more easily achievable, more top end focused cams/intake could put the 7000rpm torque at perhaps 175 lb-ft, peak power at 7500, that would get you around 240hp. Still would need more revs though. 8500rpm would make things pretty easy, but I'm guessing that takes rather extensive modifications.
It depends what how much was left on the table. The 300 PS JDM EJ20 redlines @ 8.500 RPM.
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Old 03-30-2012, 04:53 AM   #105
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You're talking about the turbo motor right? EJs have a shorter stroke, so the revs probably come a bit easier than the FA, which has very short rods too.
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Old 03-30-2012, 06:05 AM   #106
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Originally Posted by serialk11r View Post
You're talking about the turbo motor right? EJs have a shorter stroke, so the revs probably come a bit easier than the FA, which has very short rods too.
EJ207 turbo, correct. Can't recall if it's 8000 or 8500, but the good version of the engine (V7, 2001ish) had forged crank and pistons in addition to twin-scroll, DAVCS, and possibly big port heads.
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Old 03-30-2012, 07:25 AM   #107
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Subaru says that it will not turbocharge the engine as there is no space at the front of the engine bay for an intercooler.
Rubbish, i spent a lot of time under the bonnet of the BRZ taking pictures of the space in front of the engine.

You could easily fit a massive intercooler in there.

Personally i believe the engine bay could comfortably take a 6-cylinder engine (V6 Mind, not inline of course).

So i call BS on the AutoExpress artile
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:35 PM   #108
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does that mean 250 hp n/a!? dayum how would they do that? they'd have to increase displacement!!!
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Old 03-31-2012, 04:53 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ichitaka05 View Post
Like EZ engine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by wikipedia
EZ30D: 2999CC DOHC, 245ps (180 kW) @6600 rpm, 297Nm@4200 rpm. Bore 89.2 mm, Stroke 80 mm. Compression 10.7:1. This version had one exhaust port per cylinder, a drive-by-wire throttle, a black plastic intake manifold, VVL and AVCS. It was available in manual and automatic unlike the old EZ30D. Found in the 2003–2009 Legacy 3.0R, Outback 3.0R and 2006–2008 Tribeca.

EZ36D: 3629CC DOHC, 260ps (191 kW) @6000 rpm, 335Nm@4400 rpm. Bore 92 mm, Stroke 91 mm. Compression 10.5:1. Found in the 2010-current Legacy, Outback and 2008-current Tribeca. The EZ36D incorporates possibly the only implementation of an asymmetrical connecting rod in a modern application. The offset connecting rod was designed to allow additional displacement from the same exterior dimensions.
Looks like Subaru revised that engine to have a larger displacement when the cars had a generation change. I don't see examples of a car getting a bored out version of the base engine in the same generation. I've only heard of the s2k increasing 0.2 liters at which point they completely dropped the smaller motor.

A bored out version of the same engine in the same generation with both versions selling simultaneously seems like wishful thinking to me.
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Old 03-31-2012, 04:59 PM   #110
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Are you looking for specific instances where ONLY bore was changed?

In 2004 and 2005 the Subaru STI was sold with the EJ257 (99.5:79)engine for USDM; at the same time the the WRX was still using the EJ205 (92:75). The EJ25x series is essentially a bored out EJ20x series.
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Old 03-31-2012, 05:20 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leeky View Post
Rubbish, i spent a lot of time under the bonnet of the BRZ taking pictures of the space in front of the engine.

You could easily fit a massive intercooler in there.

Personally i believe the engine bay could comfortably take a 6-cylinder engine (V6 Mind, not inline of course).

So i call BS on the AutoExpress artile
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Old 04-01-2012, 02:37 PM   #112
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more reason for me to wait. i'd rather pay a bit more for the STI version.
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