Wear on outside of tires - suggest suspension upgrades? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

1Cor10:23 · 06-09-2014, 11:30 AM

Hi all,

Had my first HPDE course and noticed that my tires (Michelin PSS) were exhibiting quite a bit of uneven wear toward the outside. I'm running camber bolts up front right now (-1.3). I noticed that my friend's twins were all running less wear than mine (guessing the extra grip from the PSS giving it more roll).

Was wondering what mods you guys would suggest to combat this issue / increase camber. Wondering if it's worth spending money on camber plates / RLCA or just save up for proper coilovers that come with plates. I have my eyes set on Ohlins R&T but not sure I want to drop that kind of money right now. The other option is that I could just put stock wheels/tires back on for now and save my PSS from getting chewed on the outside.

Appreciate any advice / comments you may have. Thanks!

7thgear · 06-09-2014, 11:45 AM

could be case of overdriving the car/tires

do you have any video of yourself driving (specifically your hands)

while more camber and stiffer anti roll will always help, driving beyond the limits of the tires will have them wear down sooner.

did you log your pressures and tire temperatures? Which track was this and how long were your stints?

doing 15 hard laps on street tires is bound to burn through the rubber much faster than doing 3 sessons of 5 with only 1 or 2 being aggressive laps.

ToyoburuBRZ · 06-09-2014, 11:50 AM

A lot of what I've been reading on this forum says that ~2 degrees of camber gives you the best wear pattern

SubiePig · 06-09-2014, 12:00 PM

^ to many variables. There is no magic number that fits every tire, spring, swaybar, ride height, track situation.

-Hot tire pressures when coming off track?

-any suspension mods other than the camber bolts?

-As 7thGear said, video preferably in car?

wparsons · 06-09-2014, 12:54 PM

Next time log tire pressures, and if possible tire temperatures at at least 3 points across the width of the tire (inner shoulder, center and outer shoulder).

If you're overdriving the tires you'll get similar wear to not enough camber or too little tire pressure, but the data will look very different.

1Cor10:23 · 06-09-2014, 02:55 PM

Thanks for the suggestions guys - I've got footage, will upload tonight. Suspension is stock other than camber bolts (set at roughly -1.3 all around). It was my first time out on the track so a lot of it definitely has to do with driver experience / perhaps over driving.

It was at the new Mosport DDT, ~15 minute sessions.

Between sessions, I was reading ~37 PSI.

tahdizzle · 06-09-2014, 03:49 PM

stiffer side wallz! :p

King Tut · 06-09-2014, 04:21 PM

More negative camber is the answer.

BRZZZZZZZZZZ · 06-09-2014, 04:32 PM

I agree with above, could be overdriving, could be wrong pressures, could be lack of camber. Could be a combination of all.

Also pics of tires before and after event please.

1Cor10:23 · 06-09-2014, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRZZZZZZZZZZ

I agree with above, could be overdriving, could be wrong pressures, could be lack of camber. Could be a combination of all.

Also pics of tires before and after event please.

Will post tonight. Before pictures - tires were new, possibly ~300KM of city driving.

dradernh · 06-09-2014, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1Cor10:23

Between sessions, I was reading ~37 PSI.

How long after you got out of the car were they reading 37 psi: immediately, some time later, just before going back out again?

1Cor10:23 · 06-09-2014, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dradernh

How long after you got out of the car were they reading 37 psi: immediately, some time later, just before going back out again?

Read 37 probably ~45-1 hour after a session. Probably should've been more diligent during the day to take readings right after.

dradernh · 06-09-2014, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1Cor10:23

Read 37 probably ~45-1 hour after a session. Probably should've been more diligent during the day to take readings right after.

Yeah, if you want to stay on top of tire temps, you check them immediately after you come in, if only to record them and then come back later to adjust them. On a course as twisty/turny as DDT is, they could have been as much as 8 psi higher out on the course than they were when you checked them.

1Cor10:23 · 06-09-2014, 08:38 PM

Hey guys, here's some pics. For info, these were essentially new coming in to mosport DDT. Lapping done in 15 minute sessions, 5 sessions in the day. Tires were 33 psi cold in the morning. Video footage of driving to come (with steering inputs)

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

06-09-2014, 11:30 AM	#1
1Cor10:23 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Drives: '13 Whiteout FR-S (M/T) Location: GTA Posts: 1,205 Thanks: 492 Thanked 392 Times in 238 Posts Mentioned: 14 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	Wear on outside of tires - suggest suspension upgrades? Hi all, Had my first HPDE course and noticed that my tires (Michelin PSS) were exhibiting quite a bit of uneven wear toward the outside. I'm running camber bolts up front right now (-1.3). I noticed that my friend's twins were all running less wear than mine (guessing the extra grip from the PSS giving it more roll). Was wondering what mods you guys would suggest to combat this issue / increase camber. Wondering if it's worth spending money on camber plates / RLCA or just save up for proper coilovers that come with plates. I have my eyes set on Ohlins R&T but not sure I want to drop that kind of money right now. The other option is that I could just put stock wheels/tires back on for now and save my PSS from getting chewed on the outside. Appreciate any advice / comments you may have. Thanks! __________________ \|1Cor10:23 \| Whiteout FR-S \| Form Follows Function Build\|

06-09-2014, 11:45 AM	#2
7thgear i'm sorry, what? Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: Canada Location: I rock a beat harder than you can beat it with rocks Posts: 4,399 Thanks: 357 Thanked 2,506 Times in 1,268 Posts Mentioned: 40 Post(s) Tagged: 3 Thread(s)	could be case of overdriving the car/tires do you have any video of yourself driving (specifically your hands) while more camber and stiffer anti roll will always help, driving beyond the limits of the tires will have them wear down sooner. did you log your pressures and tire temperatures? Which track was this and how long were your stints? doing 15 hard laps on street tires is bound to burn through the rubber much faster than doing 3 sessons of 5 with only 1 or 2 being aggressive laps. __________________ don't you think if I was wrong, I'd know it?

06-09-2014, 12:00 PM	#4
SubiePig Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Drives: -'02 PSM WRX, '94 Miata, '13 BRZ Location: Lafayette, Louisiana Posts: 438 Thanks: 188 Thanked 155 Times in 112 Posts Mentioned: 13 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	^ to many variables. There is no magic number that fits every tire, spring, swaybar, ride height, track situation. -Hot tire pressures when coming off track? -any suspension mods other than the camber bolts? -As 7thGear said, video preferably in car? __________________ Sponsered by:Chasebays/Corr Performance Tuning/KartBoy/Bad Panda Motorsports/Racer-X Fabrication STX Build thread 14th/67 SCCA Nationals (2014)

06-09-2014, 02:55 PM	#6
1Cor10:23 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Drives: '13 Whiteout FR-S (M/T) Location: GTA Posts: 1,205 Thanks: 492 Thanked 392 Times in 238 Posts Mentioned: 14 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	Thanks for the suggestions guys - I've got footage, will upload tonight. Suspension is stock other than camber bolts (set at roughly -1.3 all around). It was my first time out on the track so a lot of it definitely has to do with driver experience / perhaps over driving. It was at the new Mosport DDT, ~15 minute sessions. Between sessions, I was reading ~37 PSI. __________________ \|1Cor10:23 \| Whiteout FR-S \| Form Follows Function Build\|

06-09-2014, 04:21 PM	#8
King Tut NASA SpecE30 Racer Join Date: May 2012 Drives: 2006 Honda S2000 Location: Gulf Breeze, FL Posts: 7,279 Thanks: 607 Thanked 5,759 Times in 3,055 Posts Mentioned: 274 Post(s) Tagged: 10 Thread(s)	More negative camber is the answer. __________________ - King Tut Street/Track Car: 2006 Honda S2000 TT3 \|\| Race Car: 1987 BMW 325is SpecE30 \|\| Tow Vehicle: 2014 RAM 1500 EcoDiesel Sold Cars: 2012 BMW M3 \|\| 2013 Subaru BRZ \|\| 2012 Porsche Cayman R \|\| 2009 Chevrolet Z06 \|\| 2009 BMW M3 \|\| 2004 BMW M3 \|\| 2004 Nissan 350Z

06-09-2014, 11:50 AM	#3
ToyoburuBRZ Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Drives: Black BRZ Location: Toronto Posts: 438 Thanks: 116 Thanked 144 Times in 105 Posts Mentioned: 9 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	A lot of what I've been reading on this forum says that ~2 degrees of camber gives you the best wear pattern

06-09-2014, 04:32 PM	#9
BRZZZZZZZZZZ Car Nut Join Date: Dec 2013 Drives: BMW 335d, Toyota Echo RS, FRS Location: Calgary Posts: 1,557 Thanks: 368 Thanked 603 Times in 346 Posts Mentioned: 12 Post(s) Tagged: 2 Thread(s)	I agree with above, could be overdriving, could be wrong pressures, could be lack of camber. Could be a combination of all. Also pics of tires before and after event please.

06-09-2014, 08:38 PM	#14
1Cor10:23 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Drives: '13 Whiteout FR-S (M/T) Location: GTA Posts: 1,205 Thanks: 492 Thanked 392 Times in 238 Posts Mentioned: 14 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	Hey guys, here's some pics. For info, these were essentially new coming in to mosport DDT. Lapping done in 15 minute sessions, 5 sessions in the day. Tires were 33 psi cold in the morning. Video footage of driving to come (with steering inputs) Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk __________________ \|1Cor10:23 \| Whiteout FR-S \| Form Follows Function Build\|

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