Talk me into, or out of, a Mac

[2forme]

Originally Posted by denkigrve

You can right click, out of the box. This isn't 1997 anymore. You could right click on the mac for ages. You can also get a LOT of stuff done. More and more businesses live on OS X.

There are no issues with bootcamp. You've obviously not seriously used it from your comments. The same type of HW is used inside of the Mac that's used in any PC Laptop on the market.

You're mistaken. But that's ok. I know what I'm talking about because I'm on the machine right now. Yes, it right clicks... barely. I have to use the very far right corner to get it to register. 40% of the time it thinks it's a left click. But again, that must be in my head right? Because Macs are perfect. If you'd like a video, I will happily oblige.

A Mac is a PC with a really expensive case and OS. I'm not sure what businesses you think are running on Mac other than Apple retail stores. No financially responsible institution in their right mind would ever consider a Mac out of sheer security vulnerability alone. Normal businesses don't want to spend the time and money on retraining their entire staff on how to use a machine that only 10% of the world (and that's generous) is using. Not to mention support costs, hardware costs, software compatibility, hardware compatibility, extensibility.... and on and on. Businesses generally tend to want to make money, not give it away because it's what they see in the local starbucks.

I've been in the technology field far to long to argue with people about what they think Macs are capable of. I own one and have used it extensively. Glad it works for you. I needed to do real work on mine. Thus OSX got tossed for Windows.

Originally Posted by neutron256

I've been a Mac user at home, and PC at work for over a decade now. I personally prefer Mac because it just works, and other then occasionally clicking okay to an update I really don't need to do any thing.

Pluses to MAc
-Easy to use
-Better Quality hardware
-Cheaper, more frequent OS updates
-Better iOS compatibility (if you use iOS devices)
-It can run windows
-Great support (which you almost never need)

Pluses for Windows
-Cheaper Hardware (But it also tends to be obsolete sooner)
-More hardware/software options
-Larger market share (shrinking every day)
-More flexibility (if you know what your doing)

I will admit I also have a PC at home that I use for CAD/CAM applications simply because the options aren't there for MAC yet, but RhinoCAD is working on a MAC version and once the final version is released I might switch to a new MacPro for CAD.

There are few things I'd like to correct, or asterisk with your "pros" list.

1) Macs use the exact same components as PCs, and generally run 1-2 generations behind. They are outdated the day they are sold. They are of the same physical quality.
2) It's only easy to use if you know how to use. It's not the most organized or intuitive interface.
3) It "just works" until it doesn't. 90% of hardware isn't mac compatible. That includes a lot of industrial hardware like plotters, scanners, etc.
4) The OS is much more expensive than Windows and they charge for updates. MS only charges for major OS versions. The rest is free. It only "appears" cheaper because of where the cost is hidden. You never see major announcements for the thousands of updates MS pushes out, while every minor revision of OSX gets blogged incessantly. Also to note, Apple is VERY slow at patching things that go wrong with the OS.

I just want to make something clear. OSX is great for people who lack a very basic understanding of how the machine works. I would easily recommend a Mac to my parents, or people of that generation. That way, when they have a question or something breaks, I won't get the phone call, Apple will.

If you live in the iGarden with ton's of iDevices, yes, everything will work great. You will quickly realize that a majority of the world doesn't live in this system. So should you ever need to access something or use something outside of this... you will run into a lot of problems and even less people who know how to fix them.

To all the Mac fanatics. If you want to tell me you prefer Mac OSX because you just like it better. That's fine. Taste is a very real and valid response. But before you post things like "oh macs are better at X" realize that your perception isn't necessarily fact. They sold you an image around a PC. It IS a PC. It will always be a PC. A PC that you are limited in things you can do with it and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Installing Windows can alleviate some of these things, but not all (I'm looking at you, graphics/sound/ram/ports).

[TemeCal]

Originally Posted by denkigrve

You can right click, out of the box. This isn't 1997 anymore. You could right click on the mac for ages. You can also get a LOT of stuff done. More and more businesses live on OS X.

There are no issues with bootcamp. You've obviously not seriously used it from your comments. The same type of HW is used inside of the Mac that's used in any PC Laptop on the market.

It's not worth trying to converse with 2forme. He's clueless about many things in the technology field, in which he thinks he's an expert in. I've seen ridiculous comments on filesystems from him, leading me to believe he has very little knowledge of filesystems. He doesn't appear to have much Unix/Linux/BSD knowledge either, which may explain his lack of understanding of Mac OS. Even little comments about "right-click" doesn't work on a mac, is absurd. He doesn't realize there are several options to setup right-clicking.

I personally run Linux on the majority of my machines, some Mac and some Windows. I have no issues with those who prefer Windows, but it's my last choice. Pretty much any *nix based tool, is standard or can run on a Mac...making my productivity MUCH higher than Windows. Those who say they can't get anything done on a Mac, doesn't have a clue how to use them...which makes me also believe they have no clue about BSD. NTFS and a registry? No thank you. Macs, like Linux, use a good journaling filesystem without a registry. Writing perl scripts, bash scripts or a quick C++ program to automate something in a Mac...no problem, because a Mac was built on BSD. Windows...well that requires cygwin, activePerl, etc...

Again, I'm not bashing on Windows users...because I am one myself. But please don't assume Mac users are idiots or that they're toys compared to Windows machines. And his comment about large companies not using Macs, is a crock. We're a fortune 50 company, with 40,000+ employees and most engineers are using Macs. We work with some of the top companies in the world, and they too are using Macs. They're also using Linux and Windows.

[denkigrve]

Originally Posted by TemeCal

It's not worth trying to converse with 2forme. The guy is a tool. He's clueless about many things in the technology field, in which he thinks he's an expert in. I've seen ridiculous comments on filesystems from him, leading me to believe he has very little knowledge of filesystems. He doesn't appear to have much Unix/Linux/BSD knowledge either, which may explain his lack of understanding of Mac OS. Even little comments about "right-click" doesn't work on a mac, is absurd. He doesn't realize there are several options to setup right-clicking.

I personally run Linux on the majority of my machines, some Mac and some Windows. I have no issues with those who prefer Windows, but it's my last choice. Pretty much any *nix based tool, is standard or can run on a Mac...making my productivity MUCH higher than Windows. Those who say they can't get anything done on a Mac, doesn't have a clue how to use them...which makes me also believe they have no clue about BSD. NTFS and a registry? No thank you. Macs, like Linux, use a good journaling filesystem without a registry. Writing perl scripts, bash scripts or a quick C++ program to automate something in a Mac...no problem, because a Mac was built on BSD. Windows...well that requires cygwin, activePerl, etc...

Again, I'm not bashing on Windows users...because I am one myself. But please don't assume Mac users are idiots or that they're toys compared to Windows machines. And his comment about large companies not using Macs, is a crock. We're a fortune 50 company, with 40,000+ employees and most engineers are using Macs. We work with some of the top companies in the world, and they too are using Macs. They're also using Linux and Windows.

I'm in the same boat as you. The company I work for is pretty much entirely mac. We're a top tech company in the US and we rely on macs for almost everything at this point. I'm really sad and disappointed in his approach to commenting to mac users with such hostility. Because I use a mac I'm automatically a "young hipster." It's really disappointing how people act towards one another when their opinions differ.

[m.wood0213]

whatever you do not put freaking parallels on it with windows. So pointless. If youre into media (photography, music editing, movie editing) the by all means very worth it. Totally worth the $$$ if youre willing to learn how to use it.

[encity5]

btw, i know we are all saying that you need to "learn" or "get use to" the mac, but in actuality the learning curve is not steep, at all.

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by 2forme

No financially responsible institution in their right mind would ever consider a Mac out of sheer security vulnerability alone. Normal businesses don't want to spend the time and money on retraining their entire staff on how to use a machine that only 10% of the world (and that's generous) is using. Not to mention support costs, hardware costs, software compatibility, hardware compatibility, extensibility.... and on and on.

Not going to take a side on this religious war (been there done that since before a lot of the folks on this forum were born) but I have to provide a counter to your statement above. Higher Ed/Research institutions are heavily invested in Mac and don't think for a second that they aren't financially responsible businesses.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[2forme]

Originally Posted by Foobar

Not going to take a side on this religious war (been there done that since before a lot of the folks on this forum were born) but I have to provide a counter to your statement above. Higher Ed/Research institutions are heavily invested in Mac and don't think for a second that they aren't financially responsible businesses.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Educational institutions get a rather tidy discount. It's one of the things I actually admire about Apple.

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by 2forme

Educational institutions get a rather tidy discount. It's one of the things I actually admire about Apple.

Not quite as good as it used to be, our Dell discount is actually better then our Apple one, but yeah - Apple realized the opportunity in education and research very early on and got them hooked.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[Anorax]

I know I'm a little late here, but if that old thinkpad is running WinXP (or *shudder*, vista), a new corei3/5/7 laptop w/SSD and Win7 will be a significant improvement.

[Carticular]

Once I switched back in 2005, I have never looked back. Love OS X. Our Macbook Pro turns 6 years old in a month but is still running and looking great. Can't say the same for our friends' Windows machines.

[n2oinferno]

Originally Posted by TemeCal

And his comment about large companies not using Macs, is a crock. We're a fortune 50 company, with 40,000+ employees and most engineers are using Macs. We work with some of the top companies in the world, and they too are using Macs. They're also using Linux and Windows.

I think it comes off this way because, worldwide at least, Apple has very small penetration and in some places aren't considered business class machines. Not to say they can't be, they just aren't viewed as one. A couple of our contractors bring in their Macbooks. That's fine, they can connect to the domain and access the resources they need. But if they have OS issues that need troubleshooting they can't ask us, the Windows admins, because we don't get our hands on the stuff to know what's going on with it. Hell, aren't the vast majority of businesses still stuck using XP on most of their user machines? We just migrated to Win7 for compatibility issues, and now a bunch of our legacy shit has to be run from a terminal server because it just doesn't function well, or at all, in Windows 7.

As far as price, I had a feeling there was a decent amount of margin on the boxes, but I didn't know it was this high.
http://www.tuaw.com/2013/04/17/apple...of-the-profit/

[rbizzle004]

JCPenny in my area got rid of all there registers. They now use an older iPhone or iPod touch along with credit card software for all there purchases. You swipe your credit card on the device and sign. They also scan all tags with the iPod or iPhone.

[marky]

one word... hackintosh

i own macs/ipads/iphones

[bcj]

ubuntu linux.
NO cost, frequent updates.

Learning curve applies equally to windows.
If you come to it fresh, unix makes much more sense to a beginner.
It's like legos. Make whatever you want with the blocks.

Or you can pay wads of cash to *lease* black boxes from M$ or Mac