Getting a BRZ.. AT or MT?

[dp1]

^ that. I owned and drove AT with JR SC and many other mods on street and track, now own and drive MT with JR SC and many other mods on street and track...really enjoy(ed) both and miss the AT, just not to the extent that I would sell my MT. If I were to do it all over again - AT.

[BlueFire]

Thank you guys.

[afoust50]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

The only reason I could see for buying the automatic is if you're missing a leg.

This exactly.

[shiumai]

you can have fun in both the AT and MT. which one to get depend on whether you still get enjoyment out of shifting manually, and whether that enjoyment is limited to high performance driving, or just during your daily commute.

the BRZ is my first AT car i've owned (other than shared family cars). i came from 30 years of driving a manual, and 18 years of riding motorcycles. while i certainly enjoy the feel of correctly-executed upshifts and downshifts, rev matching etc during spirited driving in the mountains, i get no enjoyment out of it in a daily commute in traffic. it doesn't 'bother' me - i just don't get excited driving a manual for daily driving since my drive to work isn't very exciting.

if it's still a novelty to you, then by all means get the manual. if you want to improve your performance driving skills with a MT, then you obviously need the manual.

i'll be honest - after 30 years of driving a MT, i still haven't mastered the heel/toe technique, or many other performance driving skills. after taking superbike school, numerous track days on my bikes, i still can't two-wheel drift my bike or scrape my elbows on the ground like the pros. i'm just an average spirited driver and motorcyclist. being average also meant that i'd still screw up the occasional shift or grind that gear.

maybe it's shocking to admit that i don't really care about being involved in all aspect of shifting gears, that i'm not a 'purist' anymore, or don't really care about mastering the performance driving aspect of the gear shift. i also don't care if i never grind another gear or miss a downshift, or don't blip the throttle to my satisfaction in my car.

the paddle shifters on the AT allow me to have complete control over when my car upshifts and downshifts; except that it doesn't allow me to screw up a shift. i can't grind gears or burn the clutch. it blips the throttle better than i ever could on the downshifts. shifts faster than i could with a MT. but i'm okay with that.

using the paddle shifters allows me to keep both hands on the wheel at 9 and 3. i like that. if i don't, i can shift with my hand on the shifter instead, 'faking' the stick. just no more clutching with the left foot, or smell of a burnt clutch. i'm still able to be 'fully engaged' in other aspect of my drive; concentrating on what line i'm taking, when to brake before a turn, trail brake, when and how much to get on the gas, etc. there's still a lot more to performance driving besides the clutch, and i'm okay with giving up that one mechanical aspect of it. i had a co-worker that was a driving instructor at willow springs for club races and could do in a rental AT car what many other driving enthusiasts in their much more expensive, powerful and fast MT sports cars couldn't do. it's just another example of 'it's the indian, not the arrow' thing.

the AT is a better shifter than i have ever been, or will ever be, and i'm good with admitting that. it doesn't prevent me from enjoying the other aspects of driving one bit. except maybe burning out, which i don't care for.

[peri.Laynz]

I had an AT FRS for about 20 months, loved the paddle shifters, instant rev matching, and everything else that shiumai summed up so well. I actually do live in a city where bumper to bumper traffic is an every day affair, and while the FRS isn't my daily, it was nice when I did decide to drive it, my left leg didn't wear out.

That said, the gearing on the auto is much more eco-friendly and less power-friendly than the manual, and since it's not my daily, and it's a sports car, I ended up selling my auto and getting a MT. I have so much fun in the MT that it has nearly become my daily driver. Lol. Also, I had read horror stories about the AT overheating on long track days. Probably remedied by a trans cooler, but that's just added expense on top of an already more expensive car (AT vs MT).

In the end, get what you'll enjoy the most, and have no regrets. After driving both versions extensively, I thoroughly enjoy the MT every time I'm in it. It's hard not to drive it.

[rs999]

I'm still trying to find the enjoyment I am supposed to get out of owning a manual transmission FR-S.

I drive MT smoothly now, but it is just one more thing to think about while driving.

So at autocross, instead of putting the car in S or 3rd gear from the paddles, I now start at 1, take off, and block shift to 3.

The car stays in 3 during the whole autocross course.

So where's the enjoyment supposed to start? Or maybe I'm more into driving fast and finding the fastest way around a track or cones that adding shifting into that mix is pointless.

I'm going to see if I can take out an AT FR-S service loaner when I bring my car in for 7500 mile service so that I can make up my mind.

[ModBargains]

Originally Posted by rs999

I'm still trying to find the enjoyment I am supposed to get out of owning a manual transmission FR-S.

I drive MT smoothly now, but it is just one more thing to think about while driving.

So at autocross, instead of putting the car in S or 3rd gear from the paddles, I now start at 1, take off, and block shift to 3.

The car stays in 3 during the whole autocross course.

So where's the enjoyment supposed to start? Or maybe I'm more into driving fast and finding the fastest way around a track or cones that adding shifting into that mix is pointless.

I'm going to see if I can take out an AT FR-S service loaner when I bring my car in for 7500 mile service so that I can make up my mind.

You cant just...not shift. Leaving it in third isnt racing. It sounds lazy to me. Unless its some ridiculously smooth turning track with nothing interesting. If so, find better places to auto x. If not, you should probably use second.

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by BlueFire

I have always owned automatics, of course i can drive manual as i learned on one lol and have drove a few others as well, aside from my owning motorcycles the past 10 years. Anyway I'm kinda wondering if the BRZ would be more fun as the MT over the AT. I do a bit of traveling from time to time so I'm kinda thinking i may be worn out with the manual at some times. I test drove the AT BRZ a week ago. Can some guys with some experience chime in for me please? Is it a chore to shift? Is it nice and smooth?

MT is fun. AT is fun if you commute in traffic quite a bit, but don't be deceived by that statement. It's also a very intuitive setup even for track use. I have setup, driven, and instructed many people in both cars.

[RussianNinja]

The way I feel about AT and MT.
MT personally seems like you have a lot more control over the car, so if you screw up, most likely you will be to blame because you didn't shift right. While with AT, let me just tell you this, I have a Prius for that.

[DarkSunrise]

There is no right answer to the ever-popular AT vs. MT debate. That's because it comes down to personal preference.

I've got a DSG GTI in my garage, as well as a MT FR-S. When I want to relax, take phone calls, go on long trips, etc., I enjoy the DSG. Frees up a hand, lets you think about things other than shift points/driving, etc.

But when I want to have fun, feel more connected with the car, do track days/autox/back roads, etc., I love 6MT. Heel-toe downshifts under hard braking, working the shifter and clutch, etc. It's all part of the driving experience that you don't get with an automatic.

Personally I can say I would never buy a sports car with an automatic (and yes I've done autox in an automatic FR-S), but everyone's different and that's OK.

Bottom line, figure out what you enjoy and how you plan to use your car, and buy accordingly.

Originally Posted by rs999

I'm still trying to find the enjoyment I am supposed to get out of owning a manual transmission FR-S.

I drive MT smoothly now, but it is just one more thing to think about while driving.

So at autocross, instead of putting the car in S or 3rd gear from the paddles, I now start at 1, take off, and block shift to 3.

The car stays in 3 during the whole autocross course.

So where's the enjoyment supposed to start? Or maybe I'm more into driving fast and finding the fastest way around a track or cones that adding shifting into that mix is pointless.

I'm going to see if I can take out an AT FR-S service loaner when I bring my car in for 7500 mile service so that I can make up my mind.

Other than at launch, you should be in 2nd gear for autocross. 2nd gear will take you up to ~58 mph. I've only seen a couple of layouts where 3rd is needed and even then, it's just for a few seconds, and then back into 2nd.

[Xti]

In my opinion. I would buy MT for several reasons

1/ The freedom of picking your own gears, and the feeling of that acceleration.

2/ The skill you needs, and the attentions you do to drive it smoothly

3/ The rev-match, and the rush of entering/exiting any corners

4/ The different tunes from your exhaust by utilizing your gear box, rev-match while having fun.

You need to have a friend who really knows how to drive a stick-shift smoothly. It is not just about clutch control. That is just the beginning of driving a stick-shift.

If you are an experienced stick-shift driver, you wouldn't ask weather to buy AT or MT in cars like this. If you were to ask for Corvette or M3...now, that is a different story. Still, 90% of Enthusiasts who is a pro at MT will always pick MT. It is just an addiction once you have done it right.

[kavanagh]

Originally Posted by Xti

In my opinion. I would buy MT for several reasons

1/ The freedom of picking your own gears, and the feeling of that acceleration.

2/ The skill you needs, and the attentions you do to drive it smoothly

3/ The rev-match, and the rush of entering/exiting any corners

4/ The different tunes from your exhaust by utilizing your gear box, rev-match while having fun.

You need to have a friend who really knows how to drive a stick-shift smoothly. It is not just about clutch control. That is just the beginning of driving a stick-shift.

If you are an experienced stick-shift driver, you wouldn't ask weather to buy AT or MT in cars like this. If you were to ask for Corvette or M3...now, that is a different story. Still, 90% of Enthusiasts who is a pro at MT will always pick MT. It is just an addiction once you have done it right.

I've been addicted to manuals for 30 years - and I bought the auto.

For me the performance of the auto on the track outshines the performance of the manual, and that is what I wanted most - performance. I do still love manuals for the existential connection of man-to-machine, and for pure driving enjoyment, manual fits the bill.

Call me crazy, but I believe the auto will outperform the manual on the track when both cars put the same HP to the wheels and with the same suspension setup. So far, every person who has driven my car on track has said the same, and one of those people is the lap record holder who set the record in his manual FRS (prepped better than mine at the time).

I hope to prove it this season.

[Xti]

You are not crazy at all. The AT Shift faster than any human being, but for it to out perform in a low-powered car. Well, that is something you will have to debate on. I logically say the AT in any low-powered vehicles can not compare to the MT.

AT in anything with 500+ HP is a different story, and always will outperform any MT

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by kavanagh

Call me crazy, but I believe the auto will outperform the manual on the track when both cars put the same HP to the wheels and with the same suspension setup. So far, every person who has driven my car on track has said the same, and one of those people is the lap record holder who set the record in his manual FRS (prepped better than mine at the time).

I hope to prove it this season.

I don't think that's crazy at all. Actually I think it's been proven.

For GTI's, the DSG puts down very similar hp to the wheels as a manual, but is ~0.4 seconds quicker from 0-60 because of how quickly it shifts.

That usually adds up to about 1-2 seconds quicker around a road course.