Perspective Question: c5z06 to BRZ?

[dowroa]

Hi All:

I wanted to ask a simple yet complex question. Please forgive me for being a little wordy. I have been internalizing this for a while and I am trying to ensure I make a reasonable decision.

People who come to the BRZ have come from nothing, first cars, commuter cars and faster cars.

I would like some perspective and feedback from anyone!

Question

I would appreciate some perspective in going from a 2002 C5 Z06 with 13k miles to a 2017+ BRZ.

Has anyone else come from a higher HP, "faster" car to the BRZ? What were your thoughts over the course of ownership (or deciding not to buy)?


General Change Premise

Yes yes. Power is nice (especially if you have never had such before) but unusable power is unusable when the gearing and power are such that they are reserved for the track.

What does that mean?
1st- 48.0
2nd - 68.8
3rd - 99.7
4th - 142.5
5th - 169.7
6th - 254.5

V8s do sound awesome, however!

I do like 405hp/405tq .. but it costs a lot to make that safe, and is really not able to be utilized on the road.

I would rather have a car I can use whenever I want (even in race form) than a car that really is just liked a leashed animal sitting in my garage doing nothing.

Input Welcome!

I have enjoyed reading and keeping up with this community.

Everyone has been awesome and I have always liked keeping in touch with everyone who has had a Subaru (15+ years for me)

I am not looking for a robotic answer, but some input/thoughts I may have not considered or your perspective is very welcome!

Please note I will also have a rallyX car soon for off-road Subieness.

There is a 2016 STi's. Its current purpose is that of safe, unmodified daily driver for 4-people and isn't going to the track or getting modified. I have REALLY enjoyed being back in an STi which really made me notice that daily usability and "fun" meant more to me.

There is also a 7-seat family car and long trips.


Thanks!

Thanks if you take time to read or provide feedback. It is nice to hear back from people who are excited about cars and don't see them as appliances.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by dowroa

I would rather have a car I can use whenever I want (even in race form) than a car that really is just liked a leashed animal sitting in my garage doing nothing.

I waivered on my response until I came to this line ^.
You have thought things through and if this is what you are after than yes a FRS/86?BRZ is the right car. Not only are high HP cars leashed in the garage they are held back on the roads. Not sure where people get to street drive all these high HP cars anywhere near their potential. There is something to be said to being able to wind a car out and not go to jail.

[bcj]

Never had a high HP car. Didn't want one. Still not a priority.
There certainly are things to say about adding lightness. Mostly expletives?

Used to be, you could buy a light two door FR car that could actually corner effectively.
Mostly foreign though. Never got on really well with the domestic battle cruisers.

Then came the FF economy utility appliance. Hey, they were cheap.
And then again, they were cheap.

[Hot-Lava_Dave]

It sounds like this car is right up your alley! You can rev out a couple of gears in these and not get in terrible trouble. It's been said a thousand times probably but: "Driving a slow car fast is a lot more fun than driving a fast car slow."

[dowroa]

I would just like to add that I have driven/owned quite a few "slow" cars.

I think everyone should have a chance to driver a higher HP car, and I do think they have a place in the world for some people.

However, at the end of the day, I want to be driving and I want to be pushing the limit of a car. A Corvette has HIGH limits and HIGH costs to maintain the car.

I think the COST of ownership is just too high for me right now. I can afford it, but I am not sure I want to for the return I am getting.

Not specifically attempting to make this a `slow car fast` philosophical debate.

Has anyone had experience moving back from a higher HP car into a BRZ?

I do have an STi, but I really consider that a different move. It is AWD. I have autoXed/circuitXed/HPDE'd WRX/STis. They are awesome cars, but not what I am after right now.

Thank you all!

[ghst86]

I came from owning 4 mustangs in the past, all V8's, to a BRZ. My last car was a 2015 Mustang GT performance package with a lot of work done, and I can honestly say I prefer the BRZ.

It was already said, but you can ring the car's neck on the streets without speeding and warranting a ticket, whereas in my 5.0 I couldn't redline 2nd gear without speeding down a residential at 60mph.

I've fallen in love with the aftermarket, how small the car is, and how amazing it handles. It's funny, too, because even while I owned the mustang, I would check out other 86's on the road and secretly want one.

Now, as far as practicality goes, I'm pretty low, and I keep my car obsessively detailed & clean. She's a total garage queen, since I have a daily for work, so in the past 6 months of ownership I've put maybe 500~ miles on it. I could, however, I totally see myself dailying this car without any issues. Trunk is big enough to fit groceries and whatnot, it's the easiest manual I've ever driven, and the MPG is always around 20-25. My intent on buying this car wasn't to daily it though, but rather build it as a project (I won't even say how much I've invested since I bought it, but it's more than the Mustang was).

Good luck!

[Summerwolf]

DON'T DO IT.

The corvette is SO cheap to maintain, modify and run. Actual costs are pretty comparable and the only thing cheaper between my c5z and brz are tires. Any real power in the brz is costly and things that should be cheap (headers for example) are not. Plus the ls6 is infinitely more mod friendly and reliable than the fa20. Plus the t56.... way more durable.

I had a ton of fun and gained a lot of experience with my C5z and thought I'd try something different with the brz (had four lsx vehicles prior). I should've bought another vette, honestly. The whole slow car fast mantra here is overused. Imo it's much better to drive a fast car slow..... and be able able to go fast rather than a slow car always being slow except during certain conditions. Especially conditions that would favor the fast car anyways.

Also, comparing a sports car like the Corvette to a v8 pony car is not a fair comparison.

The brz isnt a bad car, but the c5z is a GREAT car.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by dowroa

Has anyone else come from a higher HP, "faster" car to the BRZ? What were your thoughts over the course of ownership (or deciding not to buy)?

I have driven faster cars and I wouldn't say that the BRZ is a slow car. You can easily go above speed limits in a matter of a few seconds. Engine output numbers might seem low, but the weight is low too. Unless you are looking for top speed, better to compare power to weight ratios. They will give you more insight. Another idea is to test drive one and tell for yourself. Opinion in such matters is always subjective.

[dowroa]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

DON'T DO IT.

The corvette is SO cheap to maintain, modify and run. Actual costs are pretty comparable and the only thing cheaper between my c5z and brz are tires. Any real power in the brz is costly and things that should be cheap (headers for example) are not. Plus the ls6 is infinitely more mod friendly and reliable than the fa20. Plus the t56.... way more durable.

I had a ton of fun and gained a lot of experience with my C5z and thought I'd try something different with the brz (had four lsx vehicles prior). I should've bought another vette, honestly. The whole slow car fast mantra here is overused. Imo it's much better to drive a fast car slow..... and be able able to go fast rather than a slow car always being slow except during certain conditions. Especially conditions that would favor the fast car anyways.

Also, comparing a sports car like the Corvette to a v8 pony car is not a fair comparison.

The brz isnt a bad car, but the c5z is a GREAT car.

Hmm... everything about this is where I was prior to getting a c5z06 (mine has 13k miles).

I took it to an autoX, and it was OK.

Then, I looked into getting it prepped for A-Street or CAM-S. That is about 1500, just in tires. That isn't even thinking about another 600 just for 18x10.5s on the rear (cheap).

Then, the c5z06 overheats. I can't even HPDE it until I address that for oiling and transmission cooling.

Then, there are the breaking valve springs. My VIN is right in the middle of that.

So, I don't think the above is incorrect in any way. If you are looking to GO FAST and want power, I do think the C5Z06 is the right choice. However, brakes and tires are easily 2-3x more and you go through those consumables QUICK (ViR is my local track).

This is what I am struggling with. I don't hate the c5z06 at all. It is a great car. I just can't use it and can't commit to throwing down 2-3k just to get it ready to step onto VIR Full.

Thanks for your experience, however. It is what I am still mulling over.

[Jdmuscle]

One word.. balance.

Have a ton of HP sitting in my garage but lately I’ve been all about balance and a car that I can go all out and not be sent to jail for. At the same time.. I’d like the option to have fast cars at my disposal. Would I say go for the BRZ/86 and sell the C5Z?? No.. what I’m saying is.. the BRZ/86 will be a nice stable mate for the Z06.

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

I have driven faster cars and I wouldn't say that the BRZ is a slow car. You can go easily above speed limits in a matter of a few seconds with this one too. Engine output numbers might seem low, but the weight is also low. Unless you are looking for top speed, better to compare power to weight ratios. Another idea is to test drive one and tell for yourself. Opinion in such matters is always subjective.

Eh.... when you're comparing it to something with 350 ft lbs of torque at idle this thing is a dog with a horrible powerband. These cars are not fast..... at all. They're a sporty, good handling, cheap, entry level car.

[HachiRokuX]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

Eh.... when you're comparing it to something with 350 ft lbs of torque at idle this thing is a dog with a horrible powerband. These cars are not fast..... at all. They're a sporty, good handling, cheap, entry level car.

I came from a slower car with the same torque numbers as the 86, less hp, significantly more weight (500+ pounds) and yet the torque dip is still really noticeable/concerning at times.

Personally, I’d rather drive a fast car at 4-5/10ths than an 86 (bone stock) at 10/10ths but that’s just me. I wouldn’t make the trade.


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[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by dowroa

Hmm... everything about this is where I was prior to getting a c5z06 (mine has 13k miles).

I took it to an autoX, and it was OK.

Then, I looked into getting it prepped for A-Street or CAM-S. That is about 1500, just in tires. That isn't even thinking about another 600 just for 18x10.5s on the rear (cheap).

Then, the c5z06 overheats. I can't even HPDE it until I address that for oiling and transmission cooling.

Then, there are the breaking valve springs. My VIN is right in the middle of that.

So, I don't think the above is incorrect in any way. If you are looking to GO FAST and want power, I do think the C5Z06 is the right choice. However, brakes and tires are easily 2-3x more and you go through those consumables QUICK (ViR is my local track).

This is what I am struggling with. I don't hate the c5z06 at all. It is a great car. I just can't use it and can't commit to throwing down 2-3k just to get it ready to step onto VIR Full.

Thanks for your experience, however. It is what I am still mulling over.

Breaking valve springs is a cheap fix.... aftermarket beehives are 300 bucks? Replacement is easy and doesnt involve a car breaking recall. take the excuse to throw a cam and upgraded timing chain in. Easy.

Mine never had overheating issues, but they are bottom feeders, keep the radiator clean and make sure the air dam is still there and most of the time it's not an issue. Radiator replacement is a cheap upgrade. Brakes are NOT expensive. The c5z brakes are nothing special and parts are readily available. Like I said, most running costs aside from tires are pretty comparable, but the base is much stronger with the c5.

You're going to run in to overheating issues tracking this car as well and an oil cooler is almost mandatory. It all boils down to what fits you as a driver, but it's good you're doing research.

[dowroa]

Originally Posted by Jdmuscle

One word.. balance.

Have a ton of HP sitting in my garage but lately I’ve been all about balance and a car that I can go all out and not be sent to jail for. At the same time.. I’d like the option to have fast cars at my disposal. Would I say go for the BRZ/86 and sell the C5Z?? No.. what I’m saying is.. the BRZ/86 will be a nice stable mate for the Z06.

Thanks. I have thought of this.

However, the wife is cutting me off at 3-cars, and rightly so:

* c5z06 - autoX track
* 16 STi - Daily (100 miles) + required 4-door car
* Fozzie FXT - rallyX

It is where I am at. For this situation, it is either BRZ or C5z06.

Thanks!