K&N Intake Dyno (and lots of tech talk)

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Oh don't kid yourself there are plenty that will swear they get a huge increase from a catback or different header.
The thing is that there are indeed many, many cars that can can and do get huge gains from headers' exhaust and intakes. You can take mom's old base model Civic and almost double the power with a few bolt ons as it was never designed for power in the first place. The GRs design pretty much wrings out everything they can to start with so basic bolt ons will have little impact.

header != catback

And those old Super Street ads were rigged. They would take a built a engine with all supporting mods necessary and dyno with a stock header and cat, then put on their header and go "See, it makes 15+hp" when it would never do that on a stock engine.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

header != catback

And those old Super Street ads were rigged. They would take a built a engine with all supporting mods necessary and dyno with a stock header and cat, then put on their header and go "See, it makes 15+hp" when it would never do that on a stock engine.

I threw the header into the mix because the GR already has a header. Pull the old cast iron exhaust manifold off any car equipped as stock and replace it with a header and the gains are decent even without tuning.

[vindiesel]

Originally Posted by Desertnate

What about the cost/benefit ratio for handling mods? I'm pretty happy with the platform now, but as time goes by and I become more familiar with it, could see being tempted to play around with the handling a bit.

Track day or auto cross and working on extracting it fully from a stock position before modding but that’s not cool. (Sarcasm)

Getting too far off topic but watch this video. He dumped 10g of money into the platform in regards to full suspension, brake kit and wheels/tires and said it was a waste of money. Shaved a few seconds off track time.

If you go down the rabbit hole made sure you have a clear budget and a realistic goal.

[Snoopysvet]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Oh don't kid yourself there are plenty that will swear they get a huge increase from a catback or different header.
The thing is that there are indeed many, many cars that can can and do get huge gains from headers' exhaust and intakes. You can take mom's old base model Civic and almost double the power with a few bolt ons as it was never designed for power in the first place. The GRs design pretty much wrings out everything they can to start with so basic bolt ons will have little impact.

Facts

[BioRebel]

Originally Posted by vindiesel

Track day or auto cross and working on extracting it fully from a stock position before modding but that’s not cool. (Sarcasm)

Getting too far off topic but watch this video. He dumped 10g of money into the platform in regards to full suspension, brake kit and wheels/tires and said it was a waste of money. Shaved a few seconds off track time.

If you go down the rabbit hole made sure you have a clear budget and a realistic goal.

I think most of the issues were "it made the car worse at being a daily driver" due to the extra effort of setting it all up and maintaining it.

The comment I was most surprised about is that they needed to send the calipers off to be cleaned after a single winter. Honestly had no idea BBK's needed that.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by vindiesel

Track day or auto cross and working on extracting it fully from a stock position before modding but that’s not cool. (Sarcasm)

Getting too far off topic but watch this video. He dumped 10g of money into the platform in regards to full suspension, brake kit and wheels/tires and said it was a waste of money. Shaved a few seconds off track time.

If you go down the rabbit hole made sure you have a clear budget and a realistic goal.

Did he think he was going to turn it into a Cayman S beater with suspension and tires?

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by BioRebel

I think most of the issues were "it made the car worse at being a daily driver" due to the extra effort of setting it all up and maintaining it.

The comment I was most surprised about is that they needed to send the calipers off to be cleaned after a single winter. Honestly had no idea BBK's needed that.

An AP kit needed cleaning after a single winter? That seems weird. What did he mean by cleaning? I'm not watching that entire video.

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

Did he think he was going to turn it into a Cayman S beater with suspension and tires?

No.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by vindiesel

He dumped 10g of money into the platform in regards to full suspension, brake kit and wheels/tires and said it was a waste of money. Shaved a few seconds off track time.

Not all track parts reduce lap time. A bbk does not make you faster, you just have more mass to dissipate heat meaning less chance of fade and pads and rotors last a lot longer. Looking over the parts he got, he certainly overspent on some things and skimped on others. Could have went with cheaper coilovers that yielded similar performance(SS1's or CSG Flex A's), could have skipped the SPL rear LCA's or just ran some cheap SPC ones. Could have left the stock wheels and went with a better 200TW tire then the RS4. Left the stock brakes and just bought pads. Could have easily saved over 5k just by making more reasonable choices. Would have been still within spitting distance of his car as is, maybe even quicker if you went with a super 200 tire. Even another endurance 200 like the V730 is better than the RS4 lap time wise.

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

An AP kit needed cleaning after a single winter? That seems weird. What did he mean by cleaning? I'm not watching that entire video.

Just don't abuse them and let them get all crudy with buildup and they are fine. I'd like to think that guys who track their cars are at least inspecting their calipers and rotors when swapping pads.

[Pat]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

An AP kit needed cleaning after a single winter? That seems weird. What did he mean by cleaning? I'm not watching that entire video.

I normally love their videos. Normally I am on the same page with them. However, I disagreed with a LOT of what they said in this video. I was surprised. And have evidence contradicting a lot of what was said.
My AP Sprint kit was used for several years non-stop in Colorado, magnesium chloride and all. I could not find any degradation of the calipers, and documented it well with a post on this forum.
In fact, my 2023 BRZ arrives in a couple weeks and I chose to go with another AP BBK based on my experience with my first BRZ.
I use my car for 20 to 30 track days a year, and just as many days skiing. It's a wonderful "compromise" car in my experience.
It would be fun to have a discussion with them about all of the things that were disappointing. Unfortunately, videos are simply one-way communication. The format isn't nearly as useful as having a discussion sharing multiple perspectives.
I also think one of them has a bias favoring Honda, although that's not a major consideration in what I shared above.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

No.

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

Not all track parts reduce lap time. A bbk does not make you faster, you just have more mass to dissipate heat meaning less chance of fade and pads and rotors last a lot longer. Looking over the parts he got, he certainly overspent on some things and skimped on others. Could have went with cheaper coilovers that yielded similar performance(SS1's or CSG Flex A's), could have skipped the SPL rear LCA's or just ran some cheap SPC ones. Could have left the stock wheels and went with a better 200TW tire then the RS4. Left the stock brakes and just bought pads. Could have easily saved over 5k just by making more reasonable choices. Would have been still within spitting distance of his car as is, maybe even quicker if you went with a super 200 tire. Even another endurance 200 like the V730 is better than the RS4 lap time wise.



Just don't abuse them and let them get all crudy with buildup and they are fine. I'd like to think that guys who track their cars are at least inspecting their calipers and rotors when swapping pads.

Originally Posted by Pat

I normally love their videos. Normally I am on the same page with them. However, I disagreed with a LOT of what they said in this video. I was surprised. And have evidence contradicting a lot of what was said.
My AP Sprint kit was used for several years non-stop in Colorado, magnesium chloride and all. I could not find any degradation of the calipers, and documented it well with a post on this forum.
In fact, my 2023 BRZ arrives in a couple weeks and I chose to go with another AP BBK based on my experience with my first BRZ.
I use my car for 20 to 30 track days a year, and just as many days skiing. It's a wonderful "compromise" car in my experience.
It would be fun to have a discussion with them about all of the things that were disappointing. Unfortunately, videos are simply one-way communication. The format isn't nearly as useful as having a discussion sharing multiple perspectives.
I also think one of them has a bias favoring Honda, although that's not a major consideration in what I shared above.

This is why I don't watch click bait YT videos from people with no credibility.

I'd go into my experience but the pop rivet, widebody crowd would say I'm dumb.

[Th3rdSun]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

I suspect here's where the difference comes in. People already know a catback isn't going to add any power. But still cling to the idea that an intake will, even though it's been shown multiple times it doesn't. So they are buying because they think it's going to add power, whereas people buy a catback knowing it's just going to be louder.

The better point of buying a catback should be for weight reduction. I have the HKS Hi-Power Spec II,and it feels like a feather compared to the stock exhaust.The added bonus is that it sounds a little bit sportier,without being at all obnoxious.


I bought it here from a forum member at a fantastic deal. I would NEVER pay full price for any of these "mods",because the value just isn't there,for me at least.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by Th3rdSun

The better point of buying a catback should be for weight reduction. I have the HKS Hi-Power Spec II,and it feels like a feather compared to the stock exhaust.The added bonus is that it sounds a little bit sportier,without being at all obnoxious.


I bought it here from a forum member at a fantastic deal. I would NEVER pay full price for any of these "mods",because the value just isn't there,for me at least.

How much weight did you lose and how much time did you gain at the track? I'm not saying it's important but being like "I lost 12.5lbs on my exhaust helped me get to cars and coffee faster is silly.

You can gain a bigger gain from an AP sprint kit which drops 20lbs on the front end.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

This is why I don't watch click bait YT videos from people with no credibility.

I'd go into my experience but the pop rivet, widebody crowd would say I'm dumb.

SG is been around the platform for a long time, his user ID is Dezoris. I think he was getting out of the first gen about the time I was joining the forums which was a few years after I got my car. I used to watch his videos. He was an early adopter of the Vortech supercharger and had a lot of issues that were self induced. He has always projected a bitterness towards the twins since then. What he looks for in a car is fundamentally different then me so since he became a car review channel I stopped watching.