Car & Driver Mag: Supra vs 86 Center of Gravity

[Adam_L]

Originally Posted by James H

when the 86 was launched, Toyota said that its COG is less than one inch higher than their almighty over $300K LFA. So now they are saying the GR Supra COG is one inch lower than the 86 which makes it lower than the LFA??!!

GR Supra vs 86 , the GR Supra will have a lowering spring in it when bought new, to achieve that height. So if you lower your 86/twin by 1" (TRD or RCE springs) it'll be the same COG +/- 1-2mm. At least that's what it looks like on paper at this point, but should be very close. The LFA is in a totally different class, super /hyper car , but again peoples can compare things all day long to try and gain some kind of meaning out of the comparison.

How much is a GR Supra…. $60k ? I thought I heard the first batch being imported is sold out.

[James H]

Not the first time a big company has lied in the interest of the bottom line. Sony knew very well that Milli Vanilli were frauds, VW and their emission scam, Hyundai and the exaggerated mpg claim... why would we think Toyota is immune to this?
... and "the first batch being sold out" is another typical marketing scheme. How many cars in that first batch? 10, 20, 50? Companies purposely release a tiny batch to generate hype and long waiting list. I used to work with marketers so heard about a lot of the tricks. These guys are paid to push their claims to the very edge without crossing the line and get sued. Occassionally some loose and stupid ones cross the line. The COG thing may be an example.

[Adam_L]

Originally Posted by James H

Not the first time a big company has lied in the interest of the bottom line. Sony knew very well that Milli Vanilli were frauds, VW and their emission scam, Hyundai and the exaggerated mpg claim... why would we think Toyota is immune to this?
... and "the first batch being sold out" is another typical marketing scheme. How many cars in that first batch? 10, 20, 50? Companies purposely release a tiny batch to generate hype and long waiting list. I used to work with marketers so heard about a lot of the tricks. These guys are paid to push their claims to the very edge without crossing the line and get sued. Occassionally some loose and stupid ones cross the line. The COG thing may be an example.

I agree, but the very nature of COG is a hypothetical measurement. Car manufactures know this, and exploit this fact. 2-4mm either way +/- , and one could say it's better or not as good of a car. It's numbers, but it's a play on the numbers , then it comes down to who did the measurements.

[NARFALICIOUS]

Originally Posted by 86MLR

Not with the OEM dampersy

TRD Springs are put on OEM shocks from port.

[86MLR]

Originally Posted by NARFALICIOUS

TRD Springs are put on OEM shocks from port.

Which doesn't help the suspension travel, what are TRD springs for a twin? 20mm, how much travel before the damper hits the bump stop?.......that puts them "into" the bump stop.

Yes these cars ride on the bump stops, to a point, but losing height via a spring change has its negative consequences.

Marketing trumps engineering.

Opinions may vary

[RayRay88]

This whole car is whack, Toyota's marketing department is in overdrive to give this car clout. Same can be said about all the vents and scoops Toyota claims can be made functional for racing, but unless you start cutting hard in to the unibody and running impossible ducting (something even the most advanced race teams will avoid), it's all a flat out lie to cover up design features over functionality.
Also I find it highly suspect that the Z4, which should have equivalent or better COG (no roof), doesn't also play on this line of marketing.

[Tokay444]

Originally Posted by RayRay88

This whole car is whack, Toyota's marketing department is in overdrive to give this car clout. Same can be said about all the vents and scoops Toyota claims can be made functional for racing, but unless you start cutting hard in to the unibody and running impossible ducting (something even the most advanced race teams will avoid), it's all a flat out lie to cover up design features over functionality.
Also I find it highly suspect that the Z4, which should have equivalent or better COG (no roof), doesn't also play on this line of marketing.

Well, it has a roof, and all the heavy electric motors and mechanisms to make it function are quite aways above the floor.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by James H

Not the first time a big company has lied in the interest of the bottom line. Sony knew very well that Milli Vanilli were frauds, VW and their emission scam, Hyundai and the exaggerated mpg claim... why would we think Toyota is immune to this?

Haha... Soopra is the Milli Vanilli of sports cars.

[RayRay88]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

Well, it has a roof, and all the heavy electric motors and mechanisms to make it function are quite aways above the floor.

Perhaps, quoted weight for the Z4 is, on average, about 10kilos more than the Supra. Also the mass doesn't have to be on the floor or lower to contribute to a lower center of gravity.

[Dake]

I think part of the reason BMW doesn't advertise CoG for the Z4 is because that's not really the goal of the platform. Yeah, they say they wanted to go more sporty than the previous generation Z4 and Z3, but ultimately they're still roadsters first and foremost. The M2 is their "sports" car.

But yeah - it probably is higher than the Supra thanks to the added weight of the motors and whatnot.

[venturaII]

People quibbling over a CoG difference of just a few mm between Supran and 86 platform, playing right into Toyota's marketing department efforts to distract from a ~600 pound difference between the two...

[why?]

Originally Posted by venturaII

People quibbling over a CoG difference of just a few mm between Supran and 86 platform, playing right into Toyota's marketing department efforts to distract from a ~600 pound difference between the two...

not really, we all know the Supra is much heavier. It has to be for the price, there are lots of features and electronics that they literally could not do without and actually be able to sell the car.

[NARFALICIOUS]

Why are a bunch of people who aren't going to buy the car so concerned about it's Center of Gravity anyways?

How many of you who would buy the car even track it?

And how many of you who would track it, would also keep stock suspension?

[86MLR]

Because I like cars, and talking about cars, and my favorite bit, talking about the the part with the most performance..... the marketing.

Would I buy one, nope, I don't trust BMW reliability.

And here in AU it really isn't good bang for your buck at $100k.

Plus more fake vents than a Honda.

Plus for that money, I can think of alot of better track orientated cars than this.

The Zupra made me sad, if it was a Le'Supra I may think differently.