Track outer shoulder wear : sway bar upgrade?

[Code Monkey]

The RE71 has pretty stiff sidewalls. Hankooks RS3 have 'relatively' softer sidewalls, not sure about the RS4.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by 86league

Thanks Mike.

Know another 86 driver at the track with a similar setup running RE71R's and they are wearing the outer shoulder first - not as bad as my MPSS, but the trend is still there.

Is the RE71 sidewall soft as well?

In the paddock I get people recommending I run BS RE71R, HK RS4, and a few saying just go Toyo R888R since they wear nearly as well (not sure I'm ready for 888's).

I'd love to hear your inputs/rank those 3 tires and the GT SX2...

Do you want to learn to drive on a low grip tire or a highly forgiving tire?

Low grip long life good communication = SX2.

Highly forgiving medium life = NT01/RC1

Generally speaking I have zero interest in 1 lap wonders like the 71R/SUR4G/Rival S 1.5. Unfortunately, they're mandatory to be autox competitive. HPDE? It depends on if you want to learn to drive or just try to get a faster lap ti me.

[86league]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Do you want to learn to drive on a low grip tire or a highly forgiving tire?

Low grip long life good communication = SX2.

Highly forgiving medium life = NT01/RC1

Generally speaking I have zero interest in 1 lap wonders like the 71R/SUR4G/Rival S 1.5. Unfortunately, they're mandatory to be autox competitive. HPDE? It depends on if you want to learn to drive or just try to get a faster lap ti me.

Yeah - I'm out there to learn and to have fun. Plus, the SX2 price point is sort of hard to argue with - esp. if they are long life...

[JoeC]

If you're interested in dedicated track tires, I've been pleased with the Maxxis RC-1. I used them for 5 track day weekends (10 days, 35 sessions) and they still have several weekends left. Seem to perform very consistently as they wear down

I'd never heard of the Champiro Sx2 but wow, $80 per tire!

[Icecreamtruk]

100% agree with Mike on this one. You have the wrong tire. Additionally to his suggestion, I would place the RS4 as a tire that drives similarly to the Nitto NT01, lasts way longer, tolerates heat very well (almost as good as the Nitto, words appart from the MPSS), and its about half a second slower per minute on track (so not huge dissavantage).

On a second note tho, I have driven the stock tires, MPSS, RC1, NT01 and RS4 tires. All of them except the RS4 at -3 camber up front, and I still wore the shoulder more. Im at -3.8 now, and I wear the inside a touch more than the outside, but cornering speeds increased, and braking hasnt suffered (at least not that I can feel it). You said you have plates, do you also have camber bolts? If not, you can run both, bolts and plates and get a bit more camber that way (front only). Rear, Im pretty sure you can get way more with just a LCA (SPC for something cheap that works, SPL for something awesome but more expensive).

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Icecreamtruk

100% agree with Mike on this one. You have the wrong tire. Additionally to his suggestion, I would place the RS4 as a tire that drives similarly to the Nitto NT01, lasts way longer, tolerates heat very well (almost as good as the Nitto, words appart from the MPSS), and its about half a second slower per minute on track (so not huge dissavantage).

On a second note tho, I have driven the stock tires, MPSS, RC1, NT01 and RS4 tires. All of them except the RS4 at -3 camber up front, and I still wore the shoulder more. Im at -3.8 now, and I wear the inside a touch more than the outside, but cornering speeds increased, and braking hasnt suffered (at least not that I can feel it). You said you have plates, do you also have camber bolts? If not, you can run both, bolts and plates and get a bit more camber that way (front only). Rear, Im pretty sure you can get way more with just a LCA (SPC for something cheap that works, SPL for something awesome but more expensive).

At track temperatures, the NT01 lasts longer than the RS4 in terms of heat cycles; the RS4 drop off roughly 2-2.5x faster than the NT01. For tread life with HPDE use, I'd say the RS4 lasts about 25% longer.

Remember, both tires are good down to the cord.

@Icecreamtruk what size tires and wheels are you using, and what ride height and spring/sway rate?

[Icecreamtruk]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

At track temperatures, the NT01 lasts longer than the RS4 in terms of heat cycles; the RS4 drop off roughly 2-2.5x faster than the NT01. For tread life with HPDE use, I'd say the RS4 lasts about 25% longer.

Remember, both tires are good down to the cord.

@Icecreamtruk what size tires and wheels are you using, and what ride height and spring/sway rate?

You are right on the money with the drop on the RS4 and they become easier to drive as they loose grip (I dont know why).

Im running 17x9 wheels with 245/40 RS4 on them, most circuits around here never go beyond the 100mph on the short straights, so cornering speed is king. Stock sway bars, spring rates are 6k front, 8k rear, about 1.5" lower than stock at the front and 1" rear (so half an inch of rake between front and rear axle).

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Icecreamtruk

You are right on the money with the drop on the RS4 and they become easier to drive as they loose grip (I dont know why).

Im running 17x9 wheels with 245/40 RS4 on them, most circuits around here never go beyond the 100mph on the short straights, so cornering speed is king. Stock sway bars, spring rates are 6k front, 8k rear, about 1.5" lower than stock at the front and 1" rear (so half an inch of rake between front and rear axle).

Try raising your front. Your wear issues may go away

[Surok]

hey CSG mike, my car is cornerweighted and the front is significantly higher than the rear, which looks dumped down so that the top of the rear tire is almost at the same height as the edge of the rear fender..

i understand this is to balance the car out, but does this have an effect on aerodynamics by having the front higher than the rear?
i was approaching 160mph yesterday and the i cant help but feel it might have been better with the front lower. (i have APR front lip )
@CSG Mike

[zbrz]

This is a very interesting discussion as i sort of have the same dilemna, to go the "Soft Spring Stiff bar" or "Stiff Spring Soft Bar" camp and it really depends on driver preference, the circuits you drive on etc. I have a very similar setup, RCE Yellows, Velox Camber Plates, Whiteline camber bolts and run -3.5/-2 camber, zero toe front and slight toe in rear and its a tad too taily at higher speed circuits. Other thing that doesn't get mentioned much is Caster. I run -6.3 Caster and it helps with maintaining dynamic camber so try and get a little more Caster if you could.

My opinion is if you are happy with the Springs and not want to spend too much money then trying out a larger front sway is a cheap alternative. And like the others mentioned a tyre with stiffer side walls would help too, and i would pick either the RE71R, Z2* or Z3 if it has been released in the US already, or Advan AD08R. I would be interested in your findings

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Surok

hey CSG mike, my car is cornerweighted and the front is significantly higher than the rear, which looks dumped down so that the top of the rear tire is almost at the same height as the edge of the rear fender..

i understand this is to balance the car out, but does this have an effect on aerodynamics by having the front higher than the rear?
i was approaching 160mph yesterday and the i cant help but feel it might have been better with the front lower. (i have APR front lip )
@CSG Mike

You can corner balance the car to have the front lower.

Corner balancing and rake are independent. Have your shop do it again.

[Surok]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You can corner balance the car to have the front lower.

Corner balancing and rake are independent. Have your shop do it again.

ahh nuts, another $670 down the drain.

[FirstWinter]

Originally Posted by Surok

ahh nuts, another $670 down the drain.

It costs that much for a corner balance where you are?

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Surok

ahh nuts, another $670 down the drain.

Just lower the front of the car, turn the left and right spring perches the same amount and the change to corner balance should be negligible, like significantly less than taking a passenger or leaving the spare tire+tools in the trunk or full vs. empty tank of gas.