Rumor: Mazda Engineers pushing for more RWD models

[Allch Chcar]

http://www.edmunds.com/car-news/mazd...eel-drive.html

Edmunds cites Mazda of North America. But no link was provided, hence why I labeled it as a rumor. Which it is.

I have said this a few times and I have heard others say it before. Mazda needs a RWD platform to differentiate. The Rotary needs a platform and so does the Miata/MX-5. They have verbally commited to producing both for the foreseeable future. Mazda had to cooperate with Alfa to make the upcoming ND Miata/MX-5 in the absence of a new enough RWD platform. The RX-8 and NC MX-5 were based on the same platform previously. So even though it's expensive, I feel they need to work on a RWD platform for the benefit of the Brand. Ideally a RWD platform that could be shared between a mid-size , compact, and the tiny Miata/MX-5 frame.

With the next RX already in the pipes and the ND MX-5 also under construction they will have to wait until the Hybrid/Electric designs are finished before doing anything. Which are in the works BTW. Mazda has a long term plan to adopt alternative fuels. Honestly, advanced Hybrid configurations and specifically Electric Motors would allow for a return to RWD layouts. With electric motors they can mount them directly to the rear axle and place batteries underneath the floor. Then for a hybrid they can use a smaller battery pack and substitute a smaller ICE and fuel tank up front. Possibly even utilize a highly efficient Rotary as a generator for range extending. That and designing all of their ICEs for Premium fuels will help them meet future emissions/MPG requirements.

[DarkSunrise]

While I'm in favor of more RWD cars in the market, esp. from a company like Mazda, I think this would be a mistake from a marketing perspective. FWD makes sense for compact and midsize cars manufactured for the masses (Civics and Accords).

[Allch Chcar]

Mazda can't compete economically in those markets. Which is why they have tried to move upper-market selling almost sport luxury vehicles at reasonable prices. Mazda has been importing their volume sellers from Japan, the Mazda3 and Mazda6, and losing money on exchange rates. Currently, Mazda is trying to move production back to North America. But this will likely mean reliability problems for several years as they break in new plants.

In the future, aerodynamics and super efficient engine designs are going to make branding difficult for tiny manufacturers. Sports cars will not be an option at some point due to emissions/CAFE. One way to better market a brand is to switch everything to a different drivetrain layouts. This isn't economical for one or two cars but it can be for the entire lineup. Subaru has already done AWD by offering it throughout their models, even making it exclusively in certain markets. BMW and Mercedes have only started offering FWD on entry level models because they can't use their traditional ICE layouts efficiently in tiny economy cars. Meanwhile the rest of their lineup is moving beyond the reach of the middle class until only the rich will be able to afford a well optioning 3 series or C class.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

Sports cars will not be an option at some point due to emissions/CAFE.

To me, a sports car should be small and lightweight, and being aerodynamic doesn't hurt at all. Perfect recipe for low emissions and high fuel economy. For YEARS, the highest observed mpg in the back of Road & Track magazine was a 1st-gen Elise at 35mpg.

Lower emissions and higher fuel economy might mean an end to oversized/overwrought/overweight superultramegacars and dopey musclecars, but it could be a new beginning for true lightweight minimalist sports cars.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

. Meanwhile the rest of their lineup is moving beyond the reach of the middle class until only the rich will be able to afford a well optioning 3 series or C class.

Uhhh it's called living outside your means and credit, and that's how most Americans afford anything including cars beyond their wealth. Expect no change in the present future.

[7thgear]

all they have to do is brush off the dust of the RX7 blueprints, put in an engine that doesn't suck, and laugh all the way to the bank.

[thill]

Hybrid sports cars are already a reality. Incredible power and great gas mileage when you want it. Lightweight? Not yet.. Probably will happen as technology continues to evolve.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

all they have to do is brush off the dust of the RX7 blueprints, put in an engine that doesn't suck, and laugh all the way to the bank.

Sum of us don' take kindly to those kinds of implications 'round hur...




In any case, I'm looking forwards to rotary powered hybrids, should justify some R&D money to the engine. I think the only new car I would willingly go to a dealer to purchase would be the next RX.

[7thgear]

it's been a few decades now, they haven't made rotary work

RIP

personally I have never been keen on engine design. Make it light, make strong, make it reliable and make it output whatever it needs to output.

if a straight 6 or a v8 is what you need, then do it and forget about everything else.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

all they have to do is brush off the dust of the RX7 blueprints, put in an engine that doesn't suck, and laugh all the way to the bank.

Would never survive modern safety tests without gaining 200-300lbs. Low window sills and belt lines don't help side impacts either.

[bcj]

Can't imagine a rotary electrical generator. Whatever for?

Maybe a high speed bio oil turbine about the size of a gallon of milk would be an option.

[reni]

Other than their sportscars, Mazda RWD cars would be doomed to failure at least in North America.

The vast majority of Mazda 3 and 6 buyers don't care about RWD, and more importantly wouldn't pay extra for it or sacrifice space for it. The vast majority of BMW buyers wouldn't buy a Mazda because it doesn't have a BMW badge on it. It would make a small number of people on internet car forums happy, but the subset of those people who could actually afford to buy one new would be a tiny sliver of the number of sales needed to make it a success.

[Allch Chcar]

We're looking at the Alfa Romeo half and half deal for the ND chassis. Then a RX replacement for the next 6-7 years as it is. Mazda is NOT going to radically change their volume selling FWD platform, the Skyactiv.

They do need a RWD platform if they are making a new RX-7 though. But then Mazda was floating rumors about a possible RX-9. The RX-9 was rumored be an upscale 4 door sports sedan. In my humble opinion, they do need such a vehicle. But I would still vote against the Rotary for anything but a very low volume, high maintenance sports car. Even more so when they can retool a N/A Skyactiv 2.0L(or 2.5L) and get most of the power with good Emissions, MPG, and above average Reliability.

Now my other opinion, if they made a RWD shooting brake... I would seriously consider selling my kidneys and going on Dialysis. I can always buy new kidneys later. Otherwise, It's just a waiting game for me.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by bcj

Can't imagine a rotary electrical generator. Whatever for?

Maybe a high speed bio oil turbine about the size of a gallon of milk would be an option.

Smoothness and efficiency, a rotary that didn't have to rev up to 9k might be rather well qualified for generator work, we don't know until someone tries. It would also be just as small as the electric motor, big weight savings is always good for eficiency.

Originally Posted by 7thgear

it's been a few decades now, they haven't made rotary work

RIP

personally I have never been keen on engine design. Make it light, make strong, make it reliable and make it output whatever it needs to output.

if a straight 6 or a v8 is what you need, then do it and forget about everything else.

By your logic we'd all still be using carburated flat heads. It's fair to say you don't care, leave the little black box to do it's thing but it's a wonder of modern times to harness billions of explosions to get to work every day.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/08/16/m...all-new-model/

It's fair to call the rotary dead, the rest of the industry did 40 years ago. Not everyone gets it, just like tons of people don't get the 86.